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Kaitlin
19-11-2008, 05:14 PM
The main reasons why I believe that Devil exists is due to simple logic and laws of probability.

(this sentence may read funny but that doesnt discont the fact that there may be more than 1 Devil or that its 1 Devil who various aspects appeal to different sects)

Crossfire (Axiom)
19-11-2008, 06:56 PM
The main reasons why I believe that Devil exists is due to simple logic and laws of probability.

(this sentence may read funny but that doesnt discont the fact that there may be more than 1 Devil or that its 1 Devil who various aspects appeal to different sects)
Firstly, what is your definition of 'devil' ?

Space_Dude
19-11-2008, 07:01 PM
it exists within u...:lol:

MichaelBaron
19-11-2008, 07:03 PM
I think once you come to a chess tournaments...you will see many ppl compared to whom devil is like an angel :)

Trent Parker
19-11-2008, 07:09 PM
The devil plays the Ruy Lopez Archangelsk variation :D

Adamski
19-11-2008, 07:35 PM
OK, biblically there is no debate. Many passages of Scripture affirm that the Devil exists.

Kaitlin
19-11-2008, 07:42 PM
Well that only took six posts.. so how come the3 "Does God Exist"tread has gone on to 51,112 post :rolleyes:

Space_Dude
19-11-2008, 07:46 PM
the devil is everything u fear.

TheJoker
19-11-2008, 08:58 PM
Certainly exists but due to an infectous mouth cancer who knows for how much longer.

Adamski
19-11-2008, 09:10 PM
Well that only took six posts.. so how come the3 "Does God Exist"tread has gone on to 51,112 post :rolleyes:A good question! It is too long to read the whole DGE thing. Part of the answer is that this (DGE) is a question which has interested people throughout human history, and this thread started some time ago. Maybe in a few years time, this thread will also have a large number of posts as this question has also occupied many minds throughout history.

Aaron Guthrie
19-11-2008, 09:13 PM
Well that only took six posts.. so how come the3 "Does God Exist"tread has gone on to 51,112 post :rolleyes:In contrast to god, the devil encounters no problem of evil.

Zwischenzug
19-11-2008, 09:19 PM
I remember a saying that goes, "the greatest trick the devil ever pulled convincing the world that he doesn't exist". From the movie "The Usual Suspects".

Rincewind
19-11-2008, 09:28 PM
Does anyone want to tackle the more interesting question "does hell exist?"?

Adamski
19-11-2008, 09:30 PM
Does anyone want to tackle the more interesting question "does hell exist?"?We would disagree! My Bible tells me it does but I know you don't believe the words of the Bible.

Rincewind
19-11-2008, 09:38 PM
We would disagree! My Bible tells me it does but I know you don't believe the words of the Bible.

Seems to be almost as many different takes on this question as there are christians. The old fashioned view is that there is fire and brimstone and wailing and gnashing of teeth and all those good things. However, new age christians are saying things like hell is simply eternal existence in the absence of god. I just find it an interesting question how christians here conceptualise hell.

Adamski
19-11-2008, 09:44 PM
Seems to be almost as many different takes on this question as there are christians. The old fashioned view is that there is fire and brimstone and wailing and gnashing of teeth and all those good things. However, new age christians are saying things like hell is simply eternal existence in the absence of god. I just find it an interesting question how christians here conceptualise hell.I don't know what it looks like. I just know I don't want to go there! The Bible does not ever describe it in physical terms, but it does say there will be much "weeping and gnashing of teeth" there.

Kevin Bonham
19-11-2008, 09:51 PM
In contrast to god, the devil encounters no problem of evil.

It also doesn't encounter the problems of omnipotence.

As for Hell, whenever so-called "Christians" all-too-gleefully inform me of their view that I am going there, I advise them that I'll see them there, and I'll be the one with the whip.

WhiteElephant
19-11-2008, 10:10 PM
The devil is under your bed. You can see him if you look under there at midnight.

Miranda
19-11-2008, 10:15 PM
The devil is under your bed. You can see him if you look under there at midnight.
Trust me. I know. I have a bunk bed, and sleep on the top bunk. I share a room with my twin sister.

The devil is a she!

Aaron Guthrie
19-11-2008, 10:19 PM
It also doesn't encounter the problems of omnipotence.But this is hardly as funny.

Also, it doesn't encounter the trickster problems you put forth against normal god.

Kevin Bonham
19-11-2008, 10:25 PM
But this is hardly as funny.

Also, it doesn't encounter the trickster problems you put forth against normal god.

Indeed. Which all means that while God certainly doesn't exist, the Devil might. :D

WCL-Skwerly
20-11-2008, 03:48 AM
I have always figured that to accept the existence of something, one must accept the existence of its opposite. Without go, there would be no stop. Without pain, there could be no relief. And without the Devil, in line with my argument, there could be no God.
:)

Spiny Norman
20-11-2008, 06:26 AM
In contrast to god, the devil encounters no problem of evil.
:lol:

Ian Rout
21-11-2008, 09:16 AM
I don't know about Hell, but I heard a few months ago (I think it was on ABC radio news) that Limbo had been closed.

Spiny Norman
21-11-2008, 10:28 AM
... no ... they just renamed it to Purgatory ... Limbo had too many negative connotations (wasn't "pc").

Ian Rout
21-11-2008, 11:10 AM
... no ... they just renamed it to Purgatory ... Limbo had too many negative connotations (wasn't "pc").
I didn't realise that, I thought they were two different places. Not so interesting then.

Returning to the earlier discussion, if we are to accept the existence of Hell on the basis of literal reading of scriptures then it follows that in the next life, at least if you go to Hell, that you take your teeth with you.

Rincewind
21-11-2008, 03:46 PM
Returning to the earlier discussion, if we are to accept the existence of Hell on the basis of literal reading of scriptures then it follows that in the next life, at least if you go to Hell, that you take your teeth with you.

Reminds me of a Dave Allen joke.

Basically a old fire and brimstone priest is delivering a sermon talking about the gnashing of teeth and this old guy in the first pew pipes up "But I don't have any teeth". The preacher doesn't miss a beat and replies, "Teeth will be provided!"

TheJoker
23-11-2008, 06:29 PM
http://animaldiversity.ummz.umich.edu/site/resources/ofstedal/couper/devil.jpg/medium.jpg

Space_Dude
23-11-2008, 07:04 PM
http://animaldiversity.ummz.umich.edu/site/resources/ofstedal/couper/devil.jpg/medium.jpg
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

antichrist
23-11-2008, 07:17 PM
A Christian or some kind of believer was trying to convincing me that the Devil was a goodie coz he was trying to bless humans with the tree of knowledge instead of just letting them stay ignorant how God had left them. When I recently told my Jehoval Witness friend this he reakons coz humans have knowledge we have all world troubles that God has "blessed " us with. Crazy mixed up kids those Jehoval Witnesses.

Sinister
26-11-2008, 09:32 PM
The devil is under your bed. You can see him if you look under there at midnight.
that is not the devil,it is only tony check his location in his profile if you dont believe me.on the flip side tony might be the devil:hmm:

Sinister
26-11-2008, 09:34 PM
the devil is everything u fear.
Tony at the rate you're going people might think you are an insane,paranoid priest

Space_Dude
26-11-2008, 11:02 PM
Tony at the rate you're going people might think you are an insane,paranoid priest
I AM THE LAST DRAGON!

Sinister
26-11-2008, 11:23 PM
I AM THE LAST DRAGON!
alrighty then. maybe that should have gone in the cool quotes thread

Miranda
26-11-2008, 11:46 PM
Hm.

Well, God can't exist without the Devil existing... therefore, neither of them exist!

Sinister
27-11-2008, 09:17 AM
Hm.

Well, God can't exist without the Devil existing... therefore, neither of them exist!
that is very true or else we would have earth flooded with the souls of the dead(if you are religious you might believe this but I am not religious and am only posting what I heard from a psycho priest)

Capablanca-Fan
27-11-2008, 10:29 AM
Well, God can't exist without the Devil existing...
Why not?


therefore, neither of them exist!
Good grief, two false premises (the devil doesn't exist and the first line above), which doesn't in itself prove a false conclusion (http://creationontheweb.com/content/view/1860/#validity), but still ...

Miranda
27-11-2008, 10:36 AM
God can't exist without the devil existing because the devil is created by God. Hence, the devil can't exist without God existing.

God doesn't exist anyway, therefore the devil doesn't exist. Easy. :)

Capablanca-Fan
27-11-2008, 10:55 AM
God can't exist without the devil existing because the devil is created by God.
This doesn't follow. In Christian theology, God is a necessary being while the devil is contingent. God has existed eternally while the Devil has not, so there was a time when God existed without the Devil.


Hence, the devil can't exist without God existing.
This is true.


God doesn't exist anyway, therefore the devil doesn't exist. Easy. :)
This at least follows from premises, but this doesn't mean that the "God doesn't exist" premise is true.

Space_Dude
27-11-2008, 03:31 PM
that is very true or else we would have earth flooded with the souls of the dead(if you are religious you might believe this but I am not religious and am only posting what I heard from a psycho priest)
What if the devil is too scared to come out beacuse of God and God has better things to do other then budding in to everyones life

Sinister
27-11-2008, 03:34 PM
What if the devil is too scared to come out beacuse of God and God has better things to do other then budding in to everyones life
maybe....maybe not
who knows?

Space_Dude
27-11-2008, 03:35 PM
maybe....maybe not
who knows?
Nobdy can prove or disprove the existents of God

Sinister
27-11-2008, 03:36 PM
Nobdy can prove or disprove the existents of God
that is the exact reason this thread is useless

Space_Dude
27-11-2008, 03:39 PM
that is the exact reason this thread is useless
This thread and 'Does God exist?' thread is made for people's opinion. I think

Desmond
27-11-2008, 03:41 PM
What if the devil is too scared to come out beacuse of God and God has better things to do other then budding in to everyones lifeI doubt such a god would have trouble with multi-tasking, but then again he is a man.

Space_Dude
27-11-2008, 03:42 PM
I doubt such a god would have trouble with multi-tasking, but then again he is a man.
God is spelled with a capital G and he said in the bible that he would not interfere with our lives again

Desmond
27-11-2008, 03:50 PM
God is spelled with a capital GDepends on the context. And as far as you correcting my spelling goes, well that is like the case of teh pot calling teh kettle black.

and he said in the bible that he would not interfere with our lives againWhere is that?

Capablanca-Fan
27-11-2008, 04:02 PM
I doubt such a god would have trouble with multi-tasking, but then again he is a man.
‘God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should repent’ (Numbers 23:19), although that doesn't mean that He can't incarnate (http://www.apostolic.net/biblicalstudies/num23.htm) or multi-task.

Capablanca-Fan
27-11-2008, 04:02 PM
Nobody can prove or disprove the existence of God
Can you prove that?

Space_Dude
27-11-2008, 04:22 PM
Can you prove that?
I can, because nobody had the proof that God didnt exist, because if they did disprove God, everyone would stop believing in them

Miranda
27-11-2008, 04:44 PM
Can you prove that?
*sigh*

Take it to the "Does God Exist" thread, Jono :P

Capablanca-Fan
27-11-2008, 05:31 PM
I can, because nobody had the proof that God didnt exist, because if they did disprove God, everyone would stop believing in them
Some people believe quite strange things that have been disproven.

Miranda
27-11-2008, 05:45 PM
Some people believe quite strange things that have been disproven.
Like God! :lol:

Sinister
27-11-2008, 05:50 PM
Can you prove that?
out of curiosity, can you prove tony is wrong?:hmm:

Miranda
27-11-2008, 05:51 PM
out of curiosity, can you prove tony is wrong?:hmm:
OK, perhaps this thread wasn't a great idea. It just turns into 'does god exist' under a different title!

Space_Dude
27-11-2008, 06:16 PM
OK, perhaps this thread wasn't a great idea. It just turns into 'does god exist' under a different title!
Can't believe I'm saying this but I agree with Mir :eh:

Sinister
27-11-2008, 06:24 PM
OK, perhaps this thread wasn't a great idea. It just turns into 'does god exist' under a different title!
I agree, this has left the topic completely and entered another

Space_Dude
27-11-2008, 06:26 PM
So, what is to become of this thread??

Sinister
27-11-2008, 06:35 PM
So, what is to become of this thread??
nothing,it may just disappear:hmm:

Space_Dude
28-11-2008, 03:57 PM
nothing,it may just disappear:hmm:
pffft, doubt it dont think threads gets erased because its not famouse.

antichrist
29-11-2008, 02:01 PM
it can be proven that God does not exist if He assembles the biggest crowd in history, tv sattelites everything and then commits suicide!!! Wow, that is it man no more god. My JW mates refused to consider the option that God may commit suicide

Kaitlin
29-11-2008, 02:39 PM
nothing,it may just disappear:hmm:

There.. see previous post.. you can put things in this thread that maybe considered "ďnsensitive" if you put them in the other thread. This tread by its nature means you have to consider the eviler and darker side to answer the thread question. Where as the other thread ignores all the evil and horrid things that happen in the world in considering their thread question, or at the least say they just deem them "unchristian" things in their crusade to be right.

And as Jono put "...... not all who claim to be Christian are Christian (cf. Mat. 7:21)", - the Ture Christians are the ones who go out helping other people and animals and I guess even plants and the enviorment... not the ones that go to Church every Sunday. Or should that be the first are pratical Christians and the second Ivory Tower Christians.

eclectic
29-11-2008, 02:44 PM
st james the apostle and first bishop of jerusalem says that true religion is helping the widow and the orphan

Kaitlin
12-12-2008, 11:57 AM
Getting to Heaven is hard... all those stairs, move over make room in the handbasket

Space_Dude
19-12-2008, 04:05 PM
Getting to Heaven is hard... all those stairs, move over make room in the handbasket
Ah! But thats why all inventors will go to heaven cause they invented the escelator.!

Bruce Oates
28-01-2009, 01:16 PM
Seems to be almost as many different takes on this question as there are christians. The old fashioned view is that there is fire and brimstone and wailing and gnashing of teeth and all those good things. However, new age christians are saying things like hell is simply eternal existence in the absence of god. I just find it an interesting question how christians here conceptualise hell.

I would settle for eternal existence in the absence of god, instead of my
present temporary existence in the absence of god.
I think the hell idea would be floated by fear of the fire beneath us, similiar
to the sailing off the flat earth fear.

There must be a devil... He (or she) is responsible for swaying the minds of
non believers.

antichrist
31-01-2009, 08:52 PM
Getting to Heaven is hard... all those stairs, move over make room in the handbasket

but you can buy a stairway to heaven, just ask my friend Led

antichrist
05-07-2011, 07:46 PM
http://www.the-tribulation-network.com/dougkrieger/what_the_antichrist_is_not_pt1.htm

Hobbes
05-07-2011, 08:24 PM
I think once you come to a chess tournaments...you will see many ppl compared to whom devil is like an angel :)

:lol: :clap:

Hobbes
05-07-2011, 08:25 PM
OK, biblically there is no debate. Many passages of Scripture affirm that the Devil exists.


Scott Colliver said just the opposite in the shoutbox the other day! Whose bible do I believe?

Rincewind
05-07-2011, 08:30 PM
Scott Colliver said just the opposite in the shoutbox the other day! Whose bible do I believe?

The book of Mormon?

Adamski
05-07-2011, 11:15 PM
Check out Bible passages such as Matthew 4:1, Matt 13:39 and John 8:44 - and that's just for starters.

antichrist
05-07-2011, 11:24 PM
Check out Bible passages such as Matthew 4:1, Matt 13:39 and John 8:44 - and that's just for starters.

Why doesn't God just knock the Devil off and parade "his"" body around the global sky so we all can believe?

Just as the Yanks done to bin Laden and the Italians done to Mussolini

Adamski
05-07-2011, 11:28 PM
Why doesn't God just knock the Devil off and parade "his"" body around the global sky so we all can believe?

Just as the Yanks done to bin Laden and the Italians done to Mussolini
Because if there was no Devil then our belief would just be robotic. God has allowed him some power in this world, but nowhere near as much power as God Himself.

Hobbes
05-07-2011, 11:31 PM
Just like AC is allowed to roam chess chat, but he doesn't have the same power as the mods!

Adamski
05-07-2011, 11:34 PM
Just like AC is allowed to roam chess chat, but he doesn't have the same power as the mods!
:P

antichrist
05-07-2011, 11:45 PM
Because if there was no Devil then our belief would just be robotic. God has allowed him some power in this world, but nowhere near as much power as God Himself.

well if God knocked the Devil to eliminate his influence but just did not let on to us, that would take care of everything, except that the Bible would no longer be correct. But then God, with just a flick of his fingers, could change all Bibles and religious work, all written history and all our memories to reflect the new situation.

Or again could go back to year dot when angel Lucifer was created and just abort him instead!

antichrist
05-07-2011, 11:48 PM
some Christians believe that the Devil is the good guy coz he tried to give knowledge to humans, whereas God was keeping them dumb, even about thir nudity - they did not know that they were nude and everybody was laughing at them

antichrist
05-07-2011, 11:51 PM
I wonder if the Devil has undies with a cross on rear end - just to rub it in

Oepty
06-07-2011, 12:14 AM
Scott Colliver said just the opposite in the shoutbox the other day! Whose bible do I believe?

What I said was I didn't believe in a eternal evil being or creature. I did not say the devil did not exist. The issue is what it is
Scott

antichrist
06-07-2011, 09:55 AM
What I said was I didn't believe in a eternal evil being or creature. I did not say the devil did not exist. The issue is what it is
Scott

Did God make the Devil? And did God make a mistake when making the Devil?

Oepty
06-07-2011, 10:02 AM
Did God make the Devil? And did God make a mistake when making the Devil?

sort of and no

antichrist
06-07-2011, 10:07 AM
sort of and no

well if God did not err in making the Devil that means God definitely wanted evil in the world. That means that God is evil!

Oepty
06-07-2011, 10:18 AM
well if God did not err in making the Devil that means God definitely wanted evil in the world. That means that God is evil!

LOL You have no idea what you are talking about

antichrist
06-07-2011, 10:37 AM
LOL You have no idea what you are talking about

well explain to me exactly how I am wrong so I will no longer be in error, you owe me and the world that much

If I was to create an evil Devil who brought havoc to the world and eternal suffering for a great amount of humanity I would consider myself a Hitler. How is Hell different to the Holocaust?

Oepty
06-07-2011, 01:07 PM
well explain to me exactly how I am wrong so I will no longer be in error, you owe me and the world that much

If I was to create an evil Devil who brought havoc to the world and eternal suffering for a great amount of humanity I would consider myself a Hitler. How is Hell different to the Holocaust?

I can't be bothered

Oepty
06-07-2011, 01:12 PM
If you had a slightest clue what I believed you would not ask stupid questions

If I thought you were actually capable of using your brains then I might tell you

Adamski
06-07-2011, 06:12 PM
I can't be bothered going into detail on rhis either. But I wilk give AC some pointers so he can go and do some reaearcg Firstly, God created Lucifer, originally a good archangel. Lucifer became proud and turned against God. From tgen ob he was called satan or tge devil.
Best sourcw of info on tge details - rhe Bible and use a goid Bible dictuonary/ concordance.
I am on my mobile so pse forgive inevitable typos.

Hobbes
06-07-2011, 06:17 PM
Lucifer, originally a good archangel. Lucifer became proud and turned against God.

A good place to research this is Bedazzled, with Peter Cook and Dudley Moore.

antichrist
06-07-2011, 06:19 PM
I can't be bothered going into detail on rhis either. But I wilk give AC some pointers so he can go and do some reaearcg Firstly, God created Lucifer, originally a good archangel. Lucifer became proud and turned against God. From tgen ob he was called satan or tge devil.
Best sourcw of info on tge details - rhe Bible and use a goid Bible dictuonary/ concordance.
I am on my mobile so pse forgive inevitable typos.

maybe, but God knowing everything knew that this would happen, but He still made the Lucifer to the same prescription or ingredients. Of course God knew coz he specifically designed Lucifer this way otherwise it would not have happened how it did. God was not forced to make Lucifer how Lucifer was was made. It was God's free will.