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Denis_Jessop
26-11-2007, 02:43 PM
There have been a few posts here and elsewhere about buying Fritz 10 so it seems an opportune moment to mention that Fritz 11 is now released, at least in Europe. For example, the London Chess Centre is advertising it at 29.99 pounds stg.

DJ

Phil Bourke
26-11-2007, 03:28 PM
Also available at chessbase.com for an equivalent price 42.01 Euro for us outside the European Union. (Equivalent changes according to exchange rates). Worth checking the relevant postage costs attached, as it should be in our Aus stores soon, and with the exchange rates as they are, it could be even cheaper to buy locally.

Brian_Jones
05-12-2007, 01:08 PM
Fritz 11 is available in Australia.

Order at http://www.chessaustralia.com.au/index.cfm?p=detail&o=CBFRITZ11

peter_parr
06-12-2007, 01:02 PM
Fritz 11 available in the Sydney CBD.

Fritz 11 (http://www.chessdiscountsales.com/whatsnew/2007/20071201/dec07.htm)

Davidflude
11-12-2007, 05:25 PM
Is Deep fritz 11 available and what about Shredder 11 and deep Shredder 11?

I still prefer to spend the money on adding more memory so as to get bigger hash tables. My next computer will have at least four CPU's but that is not for some time.

Desmond
11-12-2007, 09:56 PM
My next computer will have at least four CPU's but that is not for some time.
Can I interest you in a decent piece of machinery (http://www-07.ibm.com/systems/au/x/enterprise/x3950/index.html)?

sleepless
11-12-2007, 11:43 PM
Deep Shredder 11 is available as a download from the Shredder site.

Kevin Bonham
20-01-2008, 09:03 PM
Concerning Fritz11, I would be interested to know if anyone has found ways to:

* copy and paste games from Fritz11 to normal text without them coming out with lots of $6 and 4s and other things that stuff up the annotations (!, !! etc all disappear as well as +/= etc).

* open Fritz11 twice at the same time (with Fritz6 I can open the program multiply and have analysis running on several games at once but it appears F11 does not allow this)

* run Fritz11 in play mode and visit playchess via Fritz at the same time.

These are very minor issues; in general the improvements over the 2000 clunker are amazing!

Garvinator
20-01-2008, 09:17 PM
* run Fritz11 in play mode and visit playchess via Fritz at the same time.
I believe this works:

Go to www.playchess.com and download the playchess interface. Then do all the register/login in stuff and you are away.

Then you should be able to run fritz 11 and playchess as two different applications.

Kevin Bonham
20-01-2008, 09:31 PM
Go to www.playchess.com and download the playchess interface. Then do all the register/login in stuff and you are away.

Yeah, I'm suspecting that if I register a playchess account that will get around it. I can run playchess and fritz11 as two different programs as it is, but only using playchess as guest hence I don't get the multiscreen viewing option.

Bill Gletsos
20-01-2008, 10:05 PM
You can launch F11 and connect to playchess using an account. This will let you use multi screen.

Then right click on the F11 icon and select Run As

This should allow you to run a second copy of F11

However I am not sure if it will permit you to run the F11 engine simultaneously in both F11's at the same time.

Miguel
22-01-2008, 12:07 AM
* copy and paste games from Fritz11 to normal text without them coming out with lots of $6 and 4s and other things that stuff up the annotations (!, !! etc all disappear as well as +/= etc).
Menu: Tools > Options > Clipboard > Game > Text
Select old format instead of PGN. Then copy and paste your game. You'll probably have to use a ChessBase font if you want to see funky evaluations.

blackrook
22-01-2008, 01:02 AM
Reading these posts encourages me to get F11, but could anyone please help me with a couple of questions first:

1.Would the loading of F11 onto a machine result automatically in F8 being deleted?

2. Could the new F11 take over the old F8 own games database without any problems?

3. Has anyone using F11 noticed it running very slow or hanging (which is a problem I have had with F8 on two different machines)?

Kevin Bonham
22-01-2008, 08:18 AM
Reading these posts encourages me to get F11, but could anyone please help me with a couple of questions first:

1.Would the loading of F11 onto a machine result automatically in F8 being deleted?

2. Could the new F11 take over the old F8 own games database without any problems?

3. Has anyone using F11 noticed it running very slow or hanging (which is a problem I have had with F8 on two different machines)?

I have installed Fritz11 on a computer that already has Fritz6 and have had no problems with any of these things. However just to be on the safe side I put the Fritz11 files in a different folder to the Fritz6 ones and called it ChessBase2 instead of ChessBase1.

Kevin Bonham
26-01-2008, 12:38 AM
1. e4 {0} e6 {1} 2. d4 {0} d5 {1} 3. Nc3 {0} Bb4 {1}
4. e5 {0} c5 {1} 5. a3 {0} Bxc3+ {1} 6. bxc3 {0} Qc7 {2} 7. Nf3 {0} b6 {36} 8.
a4 {0} Ba6 {6} 9. Bxa6 {0} Nxa6 {1} 10. Qe2 {0} Nb8 {1} 11. a5 {0} bxa5 {7} 12.
Ba3 {0} Nd7 {4} 13. dxc5 {0} Ne7 {4} 14. c6 {0} Qxc6 {4} 15. O-O {0} Qxc3 {3}
16. Rfd1 {0} Nc6 {5} 17. Bd6 {0} Qc4 {13} 18. Qe3 {20} Qe4 {7} 19. Qc3 {14} Qc4
{12} 20. Qe3 {0} Qe4 {6} 21. Qc3 {24} Qc4 {4} 22. Qe3 {7} 1/2-1/2

After 40 losses I have drawn my first blitz game with Fritz 11 (I was black, above).

19.Qb3 was the continuation from the Tal-Donner smash that put 7...b6 under a cloud for a loooooooong time. I was keen to see how F11 fared against some Watson theory on that game but instead of exploring that it wimped out and allowed a repetition! (It turns out that it evaluates Qb3 as about -0.2 which is no reason not to play it against a relative bunny like me.)

Upon allowing the draw F11 awarded me the title of Human World Champion, but I was a little sceptical about this given that it had earlier in the night awarded me an FM title as well, without any evidence that I was playing in an Oceania Zonal.

It will be interesting to see how its learn function responds to this result; most likely I will never be allowed to play the French again.

Basil
26-01-2008, 01:02 AM
After 40 losses I have drawn my first blitz game with Fritz 11 (I was black, above).
:clap: That's an achievement.

blackrook
31-01-2008, 08:53 PM
I have just upgraded from F8 to F11 and am well-pleased so far. :) (I use Fritz a lot, mostly for looking at openings in "infinite analysis" mode.)

A couple of things that I have noticed:

1. The program (on a newer machine) is running a bit faster than F8. The kN/s runs at about 950, rather than 6-700. But this does not seem to explain how much faster it gets down the plys. It is at 15-18 in just a few seconds. I wonder, does F11 reject more lines for analysis at an earlier stage than F8 did or is something else going on?

2. Also, there are some significant differences in evaluations between the two programs. Has anyone noticed, in broad terms, what kind of things F11 attaches more weight and less weight to compared to F8?

3. Finally, does anyone make use of the alternative engines in programs like this? Do they have different styles? And when you have set the engine, how do you decide what level to set the hashtable to - mine came with an initial setting of 158MB and a maximum of 809MB. :hmm:

Kevin Bonham
01-02-2008, 06:56 PM
Second draw in a row! This time I was white.

1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bb5 Bb4 5.0-0 0-0 6.d3 d6 7.Bg5 Bxc3 8.bxc3 Qe7 9.Bxc6 bxc6 10.Rb1 h6 11.Bxf6 Qxf6 12.Qd2 Bg4 13.Qe3 Rfb8 14.Rb3 Rb6 15.Rfb1 Be6 16.c4 c5 17.a4 Rab8 18.h3 Bd7 19.a5 Rxb3 20.Rxb3 Qd8 21.Qd2 Ba4 22.Rxb8 Qxb8 23.Ne1 f6 24.f3 Kf7 25.Kf2 Qb2 26.Kg1 Bd7 27.Kh2 Bc6 28.Kg1 Kg6 29.Kh2 h5 30.g3 Qb4 31.Qxb4 cxb4 32.Kg2 Kf7 33.Kf2 g6 34.h4 Bd7 35.Ke2 g5 36.Kd2 gxh4 37.gxh4 f5 38.Kc1 c5 39.Kb2 Be6 40.Kb3 Kf6 41.Ka4 a6 42.Kb3 f4 43.Ka4 Ke7 44.Kb3 Bd7 45.Kb2 Kd8 46.Ka2 Kc7 47.Kb2 Kc6 48.Ka2 Be6 49.Kb2 Kd7 50.Ka2 Kc7 51.Kb2 Kc6 52.Ka2 Kd7 53.Kb2 Kc7 54.Ka2 Bf7 55.Kb2 Kd7 56.Ka2 Ke7 57.Kb2 Bg8 58.Ka2 Kf8 59.Kb2 Be6 60.Ka2 Kg8 61.Kb2 Kg7 62.Ka2 Kh6 63.Kb2 Kg6 64.Ka2 Bd7 65.Kb2 Kf6 66.Ka2 Bh3 67.Kb2 Bf1 68.Ka2 Be2 69.Kb2 Ke6 70.Kb3 Bd1 71.Kb2 Kd7 72.Kb3 Kc6 73.Kb2 Be2 74.Kb3 Kd7 75.Kb2 Ke7 76.Kb3 Ke6 77.Kb2 Bf1 78.Kb3 Bh3 79.Kb2 Kf6 80.Kb3 Ke7 81.Kb2 Bd7 82.Kb3 Be6 83.Kb2 Kf6 84.Kb3 Bc8 85.Kb2 Ke7 86.Kb3 Kf7 87.Kb2 Bd7 88.Kb3 Be6 89.Kb2 Bh3 90.Kb3 Kf8 91.Kb2 Ke7 92.Kb3 Be6 drawn by 50 move rule, F11 having refused previous draw offers. -

Computers are very vulnerable to this kind of blockading draw and to the bitter end F11 believed it was up 0.28 of a pawn although any reasonably strong human can see that black's winning chances are gone with 41...a6 and probably several moves before.

Kevin Bonham
01-02-2008, 07:26 PM
Hmmm, the learning function appears to be out to sea as, despite being a mere 2987-rated patzer (according to it) I've been allowed to repeat the first draw three times now (ie it has allowed it four times in total). The problem seems to be that it's not out of its book until move 17 and by that stage it's already too late unless it is willing to risk losing. Fritz6 used to take a cruder approach to draws like this, like not giving me a sniff at 1.e4 for a long long time. Also F11 doesn't appear to provide much variety in openings in rated games.


3. Finally, does anyone make use of the alternative engines in programs like this?

I read somewhere that they are mainly included to give the weaker human opponents something to play rated games against that they might actually beat. If you want to get a feel for their relative playing strengths at different time limits you can set them up to play against each other; it's quite amusing to watch how F11 usually takes apart F6, for instance.

CameronD
02-02-2008, 12:06 AM
Go into rated game in fritz, and each engine will have a lower minimum rating whih you can slide down to.

On my machine the rating deviations are ...

fritz 8 1680 - 3017
crafty 19.01 1630 - 2967
Comet 1580- 2917

Desmond
02-02-2008, 12:42 AM
Have you tried anti-computer systems against it Kevin? such as b6 d6 e6 g6 Bb7 Nd7 Ne7 Bg7 more-or-less regardless of what white does

Kevin Bonham
26-02-2008, 10:50 PM
Have you tried anti-computer systems against it Kevin? such as b6 d6 e6 g6 Bb7 Nd7 Ne7 Bg7 more-or-less regardless of what white does

I haven't actually, because my understanding is that these are supposed to be followed by some kind of gradual creeping buildup and my defensive play (in a position I'm unfamiliar with) is nowhere near strong enough to execute such a plan against it without first getting smashed.

I just had a go and while it used up more than half of its time by move 13, I was nonetheless clearly lost by move 20.

I have (finally) seen some evidence of the learn function working - after allowing the same French draw above four times with 1.e4 and once via transposition from 1.d4 it has now switched to only playing 1.Nf3. However it continues to allow me to play the same very drawish Spanish Four Knights line against it although I have now drawn five times in that as well (albeit in a range of different endgames.)

Capablanca-Fan
27-02-2008, 12:13 PM
Have you tried anti-computer systems against it Kevin? such as b6 d6 e6 g6 Bb7 Nd7 Ne7 Bg7 more-or-less regardless of what white does
GM Joel Benjamin, who was on the Deep Blue advisory team, argued in a lecture here about 10 years ago that Kasparov lost precisely because he had a stereotyped view on what an "anti-computer" system should be. But by doing so, he abandoned his own strengths, and the computer could cope.

Davidflude
03-03-2008, 10:38 AM
I have just upgraded from F8 to F11 and am well-pleased so far. :) (I use Fritz a lot, mostly for looking at openings in "infinite analysis" mode.)

A couple of things that I have noticed:

1. The program (on a newer machine) is running a bit faster than F8. The kN/s runs at about 950, rather than 6-700. But this does not seem to explain how much faster it gets down the plys. It is at 15-18 in just a few seconds. I wonder, does F11 reject more lines for analysis at an earlier stage than F8 did or is something else going on?

2. Also, there are some significant differences in evaluations between the two programs. Has anyone noticed, in broad terms, what kind of things F11 attaches more weight and less weight to compared to F8?

3. Finally, does anyone make use of the alternative engines in programs like this? Do they have different styles? And when you have set the engine, how do you decide what level to set the hashtable to - mine came with an initial setting of 158MB and a maximum of 809MB. :hmm:

1. yes one of the improvements made in each upgrade of an engine is in algorithms and they will run faster.

2. There are significant differences in evaluations. For instance shredder 10 multiprocessor was convinced my opponent was over three pawns ahead while rybka 10 was convinced the position was approximately even (this probably would have changed if I gave rybka a lot more time. just for the record I resigned.

3. The alternative engines do have different styles. Furthermore I have tried altering the value of pieces to Q=8.5 R=4.5 other men unchanged. The difference was not very geat in evaluations.

The rule of thumb on memory is set the memory used by the program to half the installed memory on your machine. You should also free up as much memory as possible. Remember some nasty programs do not release memory when you close them.

Increasing the memory on your machine is one of the simplest ways to improve the speed of chess playing programs in particular but also many other things as well. at present I have two gigs. Does anyone know how much memory that Windows XP will handle.

tanc
04-03-2008, 10:37 AM
XP handles a max of 4 GB mem. At default settings, 2GB is shared by kernel and the other 2GB by applications although this can be modified by changing the boot.ini file.

Intuition
04-04-2008, 01:47 PM
how does fritz 11 compare to shredder 11 in terms of which one is better for a chess player to buy? For some reason fritz1 11 seems alot more popular?

Duff McKagan
26-04-2008, 02:22 AM
Hmmm, the learning function appears to be out to sea as, despite being a mere 2987-rated patzer (according to it) I've been allowed to repeat the first draw three times now (ie it has allowed it four times in total). The problem seems to be that it's not out of its book until move 17 and by that stage it's already too late unless it is willing to risk losing. Fritz6 used to take a cruder approach to draws like this, like not giving me a sniff at 1.e4 for a long long time. Also F11 doesn't appear to provide much variety in openings in rated games.

I have some questions.... 1) How does the learning function work exactly? 2) What is your computer rated at on "unleashed" mode? 3) How on earth does David Flude alter the computer's value of the pieces? Couldn't everybody just say that the Queen=1 so to kill the beast time after time? :)

WCL-Skwerly
26-04-2008, 08:24 AM
Deep Shredder 11 is available as a download from the Shredder site.

I bought the Shredder 11 DVD. VERY cool, I absolutely love the engine, and the interface is top notch (Fritz 10). Talk about customizable, I didn't know what I was missing out on only using Chessbase Light :doh: .

At any rate, Shredder 11 is a VERY strong program. Of course Naum and Rybka give it a good go, but I use mine more as a study tool than for competition, so it works out well. Besides, whether another engine can beat Shredder or not is so far beside the point (for me) as to be ridiculous: Shredder's latest rating was 2948 based on a 300 game match with other engines. GM strength? You betcha. So with the click of an icon I have a GM at home with me to go over games and tell me where I (frequently ;)) go wrong.

Kevin Bonham
26-04-2008, 01:12 PM
1) How does the learning function work exactly?

I'm not sure of the exact maths of it but I know that it stores an internal value for particular opening moves as it plays them, and adjusts that value based on its experience of those lines. (I think the figure can also be affected if, for instance, it gets into a lost position and then wins anyway.)


2) What is your computer rated at on "unleashed" mode?

It claims to be 3531. I'm not sure what basis they make up this figure on. Fritz 6 claims to be 3306 on my current computer but only claimed to be 2650-odd on my old HP.

WCL-Skwerly
27-04-2008, 03:49 AM
I think that the more available memory/hastables allowed to them, the program assumes it'll play that much stronger. On my laptop, F8 unleashed was like 2690 or something close, but when I got my current HP 2ghz setup it jumped up over 3000 as well. Neither is accurate 100% per USCF standards, but it is probably a good gauge :).

Desmond
27-04-2008, 09:27 AM
I think the real problem engine developers face is not making the engine stronger, but rather making it weaker and doing so while simulating the play of people at that specified level.

Intuition
28-04-2008, 11:33 AM
does anyone else have the problem with F11 that sometimes the moves/notation disappears? but then if you minimise it and bring it back they come back again?

Miguel
28-04-2008, 12:22 PM
does anyone else have the problem with F11 that sometimes the moves/notation disappears? but then if you minimise it and bring it back they come back again?
I had the same problem with Fritz 10. I reported it to ChessBase, but they weren't able to help me. In the end I "fixed" it myself by turning off the high quality notation (Tools > Options > Design).

Intuition
29-04-2008, 03:08 PM
I had the same problem with Fritz 10. I reported it to ChessBase, but they weren't able to help me. In the end I "fixed" it myself by turning off the high quality notation (Tools > Options > Design).

Thanks ill give it a go :)

espplayer7
10-05-2008, 07:00 AM
I lost my fritz 11 manual that came with the game, i was wondering if anyone knows where i can find a pdf for this?

WCL-Skwerly
10-05-2008, 08:27 AM
Well, not sure if you know this or not, but if you hit F1 at any time the entire manual comes up in the form of a help dialogue box!!

I have Fritz 10 (Shredder 11) but I imagine they are similar?

I'll try to find one for you though, I'm sure they are out there bud. :)

espplayer7
10-05-2008, 09:58 AM
thanks, any help is greatly appreciated

Kevin Bonham
05-02-2012, 12:33 AM
I have finally defeated this program on "unleashed" level at 4/2 blitz after several hundred attempts (quite a few draws in those). The strategy I have been pursuing is to swap off into a notionally bad pawn endgame which is actually drawn in the hope that the computer makes a mistake. After missing wins in three or four games by this method (and also in one interesting game where I was winning in a wild double-rook ending but stuffed it up) I was finally successful.

Bonham - Fritz 11.

1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bb5 Bb4 5.0-0 0-0 6.d3 d6 7.Bg5 Bxc3 8.bxc3 Qe7 9.Bxc6 bxc6 10.Bxf6 Qxf6 11.Rb1 Bg4 12.Qe2 Rab8 13.Qe3 Bxf3 14.Qxf3 Qxf3 15.gxf3 f5 16.Rb3 Kf7 17.Rfb1 Rb6 18.Kg2 Kf6 19.Kg3 Ke6 20.a4 f4+ 21.Kg2 Rfb8 22.Kh3 g6 23.Kg4 Kf6 24.h4 c5 25.c4 Rb4 26.a5 h6 27.h5 Rxb3 28.Rxb3 Rxb3 29.cxb3 c6 30.hxg6 Kxg6 31.Kh4 h5 32.Kh3 Kg5 33.Kg2 Kf6 34.Kh3 a6 35.Kh4 Kg6 36.Kh3 Kg5 37.Kg2 Kf6 38.Kh3 Kg6 39.Kh4 Kh6 40.Kh3 d5 41.exd5 cxd5 42.cxd5 Kg7 [42...Kg5 43.d6 Kf6 44.Kh4 Ke6 45.Kxh5 Kxd6 appears drawn] 43.Kh4 Kg6 44.d6 Kf6 45.Kxh5 Kf7 46.Kg5 Ke6 47.Kg6 Black resigns 1-0

Garrett
05-02-2012, 05:29 AM
congratulations !

Redmond Barry
06-02-2012, 05:02 AM
nice one.

Kevin Bonham
24-09-2012, 01:11 AM
Oddly in this narcoleptic blitz game the program decided to take a draw rather than play a different move that would give it an evaluation of -0.14 against me (who it rates as about an 800 point underdog).

1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.exd5 exd5 4.Nf3 Nf6 5.Bd3 Bd6 6.0-0 0-0 7.Bg5 Bg4 8.Nbd2 Nbd7 9.c3 c6 10.Qc2 Qc7 11.Rae1 Rae8 12.Bh4 Bh5 13.Bg3 Bxg3 14.fxg3 Bg6 15.Bxg6 hxg6 16.Ng5 Rxe1 17.Rxe1 Re8 18.Rxe8+ Nxe8 19.Ndf3 Qd8 20.Qe2 Nd6 21.a4 Kf8 22.Nh7+ Kg8 23.Nhg5 Kf8 24.Nh7+ Kg8 25.Nhg5 -

Kevin Bonham
30-09-2012, 09:53 PM
Second ever blitz win at 4/2. Unfortunately 'puters are still susceptible to this sort of thing.

Bonham,Kevin (2218) - Fritz 11 (3020) [B22]
Blitz:4'+2", 30.09.2012

1.e4 c5 2.c3 Nf6 3.e5 Nd5 4.Nf3 Nc6 5.d4 cxd4 6.cxd4 d6 7.Bc4 Nb6 8.Bb5 dxe5 9.Nxe5 Bd7 10.Nxd7 Qxd7 11.Nc3 e6 12.0-0 Be7 13.Qg4 0-0 14.Bxc6 bxc6 15.Bh6 Bf6 16.Rfd1 Rfd8 17.Ne4 Qe7 18.Rac1 Rac8 19.h4 Rd5 20.Rc3 Nd7 21.Rg3 g6 22.Bg5 Kg7 23.Nxf6 Nxf6 24.h5 Nxg4 25.Bxe7 Rc7 26.Bc5 Nh6 27.hxg6 hxg6 28.Ra3 Nf5 29.Rxa7 Rxa7 30.Bxa7 Ra5 31.Bc5 Rxa2 32.Ba3 g5 33.g4 Nh6 34.f3 f5 35.gxf5 Nxf5 36.Kf2 Kf6 37.Ke2 e5 38.dxe5+ Kxe5 39.Kd3 Nh4 40.Kc3 Nxf3 41.Kb3 Rxa3+ 42.bxa3 Nd4+ 43.Kc4 Nc2 44.Rd3 Kf4 45.a4 c5 46.a5 Nb4 47.Rd1 Na6 48.Kb5 1-0

Kevin Bonham
02-10-2012, 02:23 AM
And another! Actually the program played like a womble in this one. Might be time to upgrade soon. :lol:

Bonham,Kevin (2345) - Fritz 11 (3007) [B30]
Blitz:4'+2", 02.10.2012

600MB, Fritz11.ctg

1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 e6 3.Bb5 Nc6 4.0-0 Nge7 5.c3 a6 6.Bxc6 Nxc6 7.d4 d5 8.e5 cxd4 9.cxd4 Be7 10.Nc3 0-0 11.Bf4 Bd7 12.Qd2 h6 13.Bxh6 gxh6 14.Qxh6 Rc8 15.g3 Nb4 16.h4 Re8 17.Ng5 Bxg5 18.hxg5 Qe7 19.Kg2 Qf8 20.Qf6 Qg7 21.Rh1 Nc6 22.Rh6 Ne7 23.Rah1 Qxf6 24.gxf6 Ng6 25.Ne2 Bb5 26.Nf4 Bf1+ 27.Kf3 Be2+ 28.Kxe2 Rc2+ 29.Kd3 Rec8 30.Nxg6 R2c3+ 31.bxc3 Rxc3+ 32.Kxc3 fxg6 33.Rh8+ Kf7 34.R1h7# 1-0

The thing with 3...Nc6 is amusing. It seems it prefers to transpose into book than play 3...a6 and think for itself.

Kevin Bonham
06-10-2012, 01:53 AM
Jono jokingly mentioned the sac above here (http://chesschat.org/showthread.php?p=344817#post344817).

Of course in saccing a piece in Fritz-blitz I don't bother thinking about whether it is sound since the computer will usually beat me anyhow unless I can trick it into one of the habitual computer errors (like underestimating very long-term compensation.) And losing only takes a few minutes.

But that said 13.Bxh6 actually is sound. Without the sac white is worse (one bishop is gone and the other is poor, and the board is not that closed - it's just a bad French Advanced) but with it white at least has the draw in hand.

On move 15 I could have drawn by Qh5 threatening just Qg4+ etc. Even if ...Re8 there is still a perpetual by Qg4+ Kf8, Qh5.

This idea is avoidable by 14...Qb6/a5 and 15...Rfc8 (for instance) but in that case 15.Qh5 and 16.Ng5 Bxg5 17.Qxg5+

Moreover after 16...Re8 in the game line, black is actually already lost. Poor computer just can't see at blitz time controls that 11 moves later it will be dropping material in a futile attempt to avoid mate.

It seems 16...f5 or 16...f6 would have drawn, but nothing else.

Capablanca-Fan
06-10-2012, 04:27 AM
Bonham,Kevin (2345) - Fritz 11 (3007) [B30]
Blitz:4'+2", 02.10.2012

1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 e6 3.Bb5 Nc6 4.0-0 Nge7 5.c3 a6 6.Bxc6 Nxc6 7.d4 d5 8.e5 cxd4 9.cxd4 Be7 10.Nc3 0-0 11.Bf4 Bd7 12.Qd2 h6 13.Bxh6 gxh6 14.Qxh6 Rc8 [14... Re8 15. h4 Bf8 16. Qh5 f6] 15.g3 Nb4 16.h4 Re8 17.Ng5 Bxg5 18.hxg5 Qe7 19.Kg2 Qf8 20.Qf6 Qg7 21.Rh1 Nc6 22.Rh6 Ne7 23.Rah1 Qxf6 24.gxf6 Ng6 25.Ne2 Bb5 26.Nf4 Bf1+ 27.Kf3 Be2+ 28.Kxe2 Rc2+ 29.Kd3 Rec8 30.Nxg6 R2c3+ 31.bxc3 Rxc3+ 32.Kxc3 fxg6 33.Rh8+ Kf7 34.R1h7# 1-0

Jono jokingly mentioned the sac above here (http://chesschat.org/showthread.php?p=344817#post344817). … 13.Bxh6 actually is sound.

Even against the regrouping in the note, as opposed to Fritzie's pointless Q-side maneuvres?


Without the sac white is worse (one bishop is gone and the other is poor, and the board is not that closed—it's just a bad French Advanced) but with it white at least has the draw in hand.
Yes, I thought that Black's position was something that Francophiles like you and road runner would dream about.

Kevin Bonham
06-10-2012, 12:39 PM
Even against the regrouping in the note, as opposed to Fritzie's pointless Q-side maneuvres?

Yes because if it plays 14...Re8 then instead of playing 15.h4 I can immediately play 15.Qh5 just going for the draw. Then 15...Bf8 is almost the worst move on the board, refuted by 16.Ng5 winning. A key point in the draw against virtually anything else on move 15 here is that if the R is only on e8 then if the K goes to f8 I will always have Qh5 with threat Qh8#, and thus the K is forced back to the g-file.

15.h4 Bf8 16.Qf4 Ne7 and I'm not convinced by white's attack anymore.

Kevin Bonham
24-01-2013, 01:47 AM
Fritz 11 (3022) - Bonham,Kevin (2390) [C01]
Blitz:4'+2", 24.01.2013

600MB, Fritz11.ctg
1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.exd5 exd5 4.Nf3 Nf6 5.Bd3 Bd6 6.0-0 0-0 7.Bg5 Bg4 8.Nbd2 Nbd7 9.c3 c6 10.Qc2 Qc7 11.Rae1 Rae8 12.Bh4 Bh5 13.Bg3 Bxg3 14.fxg3 Bg6 15.Bxg6 hxg6 16.Ng5 Rxe1 17.Rxe1 Qd8 18.Nf1 Re8 19.Qf2 Rxe1 20.Qxe1 Qe8 21.Qxe8+ Nxe8 22.Ne3 Nd6 23.Kf2 Nf5 24.Nxf5 gxf5 25.Ke3 g6 26.Nf3 Kf8 27.Ne5 Nxe5 28.dxe5 Ke7 29.b4 Ke6 30.Kd4 b6 31.a4 f6 32.exf6 Kxf6 33.Ke3 Ke5 34.b5 c5 35.Kf3 d4 36.Ke2 Ke4 37.Kd2 c4 38.h3 d3 39.h4 Ke5 40.Ke3 Kf6 41.Kf2 Kg7 42.g4 fxg4 43.Ke1 Kh6 44.g3 g5 45.hxg5+ Kxg5 0-1

Adamski
24-01-2013, 11:51 AM
I am impressed by Kev's victories against our "Metal Friend" (Vladimir Tukmakov's term).

James Peirce
14-02-2013, 10:17 AM
If Bonham played fritz13 on unleashed he would probably never win and so sticks to the older version of fritz

Kevin Bonham
14-02-2013, 01:17 PM
If Bonham played fritz13 on unleashed he would probably never win and so sticks to the older version of fritz

Naah; I just have other things to spend money on at the moment than upgrading it. If you want to buy me Fritz 13 I'll be happy to post my first win over it here sometime in 2027 or so. :lol:

James Peirce
16-02-2013, 09:59 AM
I happen to have it but copyright prevents me from evening loaning it out on anyone:evil:

ER
16-02-2013, 10:11 AM
I happen to have it but copyright prevents me from evening loaning it out on anyone:evil:

what about morning loaning? (as opposed to "evening"!) :P

James Peirce
16-02-2013, 10:24 AM
my speelling goes out the window when it is not ritten down:lol: :lol: :lol:

Kevin Bonham
02-08-2013, 01:27 AM
Don't know if the new versions do any better at avoiding endgame shockers like this in blitz:

Fritz 11 (3038) - Bonham,Kevin (2227) [E32]

1.d4 e6 2.c4 Nf6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.Qc2 0-0 5.a3 Bxc3+ 6.Qxc3 b6 7.Bg5 Bb7 8.f3 h6 9.Bh4 d5 10.e3 Nbd7 11.Nh3 c5 12.cxd5 cxd4 13.Qxd4 e5 14.Qd1 Bxd5 15.Bb5 Be6 16.Nf2 Nc5 17.0-0 Nb3 18.Qxd8 Raxd8 19.Rad1 Rxd1 20.Rxd1 Nd5 21.Ng4 f6 22.Bc6 Nc7 23.Be1 Na5 24.Bxa5 bxa5 25.Nf2 Rb8 26.Rd2 Rb6 27.Rc2 Nb5 28.Bxb5 Rxb5 29.Ne4 Bf5 30.Nd6 Bxc2 31.Nxb5 a6 32.Nd6 Bd3 33.Kf2 Kf8 34.e4 Ke7 35.Nf5+ Kf7 36.g4 Bb5 37.b3 Bd7 38.a4 Bxf5 39.gxf5 g6 40.fxg6+ Kxg6 41.Ke3 Kg5 42.Ke2 Kf4 43.Kf2 h5 44.h4 f5 45.exf5 Kxf5 46.Ke3 Kf6 47.Ke4 Ke6 48.Kd3 Kd5 49.Ke2?? Kd4 50.Kd2 e4 51.f4 e3+ 52.Ke2 Ke4 53.f5 Kxf5 54.Kxe3 Kg4 0-1

Garrett
02-08-2013, 03:53 AM
the computer resigned there ?

Kevin Bonham
02-08-2013, 12:09 PM
Yes. I think it automatically resigns at about -9 unless you choose a "never resign" option.

Garrett
02-08-2013, 12:56 PM
okay well played. Always nice to beat a full strength box !

Bofalon
06-10-2014, 03:37 PM
Hello everyone,

I just joined yesterday and seems like a very helpful site! I was wondering of purchasing a chess software. I've come across these: Hiarcs. Fritz 14, Deep Rybka, Rybka, Chessmaster 9000. Which one do you recommend? I play intermediate level and wanted to get for analysis and positional set up to see where I went wrong in a tournament game. Are there other softwares that are just as good as above also? Are there any for free to download? Please advise.
Thanks.

Adamski
07-10-2014, 01:23 PM
Hello everyone,

I just joined yesterday and seems like a very helpful site! I was wondering of purchasing a chess software. I've come across these: Hiarcs. Fritz 14, Deep Rybka, Rybka, Chessmaster 9000. Which one do you recommend? I play intermediate level and wanted to get for analysis and positional set up to see where I went wrong in a tournament game. Are there other softwares that are just as good as above also? Are there any for free to download? Please advise.
Thanks.I think at your / my level they are all much of a muchness. I use Fritz 14 and think it good value for money. It comes with a database of over 1 million games and has all the features you mention. Some of the other products may cost more and be slightly stronger, but all of them are generally too strong for us on high settings!

Rincewind
07-10-2014, 02:10 PM
Hello everyone,

I just joined yesterday and seems like a very helpful site! I was wondering of purchasing a chess software. I've come across these: Hiarcs. Fritz 14, Deep Rybka, Rybka, Chessmaster 9000. Which one do you recommend? I play intermediate level and wanted to get for analysis and positional set up to see where I went wrong in a tournament game. Are there other softwares that are just as good as above also? Are there any for free to download? Please advise.
Thanks.

I recommend SCID (or the fork SCID vs PC) with Stockfish. It's plenty strong enough for analysis and free!

http://scid.sourceforge.net/
http://scidvspc.sourceforge.net/
http://stockfishchess.org/

Adamski
07-10-2014, 02:16 PM
I recommend SCID (or the fork SCID vs PC) with Stockfish. It's plenty strong enough for analysis and free!

http://scid.sourceforge.net/
http://scidvspc.sourceforge.net/
http://stockfishchess.org/I like Steve's SCID vs PC too but so far I have only used it for analysis, not for playing games against. Perhaps I should give that a whirl.