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bobby1972
23-02-2006, 01:04 PM
:D :D :D Rapidly improving Adults... ,what about the 8 yes 8 trips to the toilet ,and that was only in the opening ,OPEN YOUR EYES PEOPLE.he he he he he,:D :D :D :D :D love it ,man some people go to the toilet even when its there move.:owned:

Rincewind
23-02-2006, 01:16 PM
:D :D :D Rapidly improving Adults... ,what about the 8 yes 8 trips to the toilet ,and that was only in the opening ,OPEN YOUR EYES PEOPLE.he he he he he,:D :D :D :D :D love it ,man some people go to the toilet even when its there move.:owned:

Well you know Bobby, Nature is an unforgiving mistress. I've seen some players go to the toiulet in the middle of a game of blitz (not in the opening) and still come back and win the game.

But tell me who is it you are talking about and what exactly are you alleging?

bobby1972
23-02-2006, 01:33 PM
if a person is not with a medical condition,how many toilet visits are ok ,i have seen, and this was not my observation alone that some healthy people go to the toilet well over 10 times a game ,i counted 8 for someone in the opening.:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) love this game

Kevin Bonham
23-02-2006, 01:43 PM
:D :D :D Rapidly improving Adults... ,what about the 8 yes 8 trips to the toilet ,and that was only in the opening ,OPEN YOUR EYES PEOPLE.he he he he he,:D :D :D :D :D love it ,man some people go to the toilet even when its there move.:owned:

Not widely known but Art 12.5 states that "The player having the move is not allowed to leave the playing area without permission of the arbiter". The playing area does not include the toilets.

PHAT
23-02-2006, 01:46 PM
:D :D :D Rapidly improving Adults... ,what about the 8 yes 8 trips to the toilet ,and that was only in the opening ,OPEN YOUR EYES PEOPLE.he he he he he,:D :D :D :D :D love it ,man some people go to the toilet even when its there move.:owned:

In my previous sporting life as a road racer (cycling) we would simply take a piss on the bike while riding at the pack of the peliton. I can tell you that if I was playing for 1st place in a blitz final round, I would hold it until I couldn't help it and piss where I sat. There could be no penalty - other than ignominy.

bobby1972
23-02-2006, 02:25 PM
take the piss:D :D :D :D :lol:

ursogr8
23-02-2006, 02:31 PM
Not widely known but Art 12.5 states

hi KB

Not 'widely known', but none-the-less 'well known' to many-that-matter at our Club, because that defines the boundaries for the carry-phone rule. ;)




that "The player having the move is not allowed to leave the playing area without permission of the arbiter".


The playing area does not include the toilets.
Is this not subject to local ruling? :confused:

regards
starter

bobby1972
23-02-2006, 02:56 PM
seriously in this age with so much technology available,it makes some people think,has anyone seen the interview with kasimdzhanov were he said he might leave the game because of this,the good thing about this thread is next time i am in a hurry during a game the toilets might be free :clap:

bobby1972
23-02-2006, 03:24 PM
"rating increases are directly comparable regardless of where they appear on the distribution curve." maybe they are all directly proprtional to the amount of time spent near the "s bend":)

Kevin Bonham
23-02-2006, 06:59 PM
Is this not subject to local ruling? :confused:

Not in my view. Art 12.5 says "The playing venue is defined as the playing area, rest rooms, refreshment area, area set aside for smoking and other places as designated by the arbiter". Taking "rest rooms" as a euphemism including "toilets" then they are clearly outside the playing area. It is true that in some very high-level tournaments the players may have rest rooms that are exactly that - rooms to rest in.

ursogr8
23-02-2006, 07:09 PM
Not in my view. Art 12.5 says "The playing venue is defined as the playing area, rest rooms, refreshment area, area set aside for smoking and other places as designated by the arbiter". Taking "rest rooms" as a euphemism including "toilets" then they are clearly outside the playing area. It is true that in some very high-level tournaments the players may have rest rooms that are exactly that - rooms to rest in.


:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: Bill is correct. My brain-cells are going off.
Your #4 says toilets are not part of the playing area.
Your quote above says the playing venue does include rest-rooms. Is there a distinction implied between area and venue?

regards
starter

Rincewind
23-02-2006, 07:12 PM
Is there a distinction implied between area and venue?

Yes I believe so. Area is the playing hall where games are actually played. The venue includes all the support areas as well (smoking area and toilets etc).

Kevin Bonham
23-02-2006, 07:22 PM
Is there a distinction implied between area and venue?

The distinction is not implied but explicit. The rule says the playing venue is defined as (the playing area plus a bunch of other things), so obviously "playing area" is a subset of "playing venue". So you can go to the toilet, go for a smoke, get a drink, etc, but you cannot leave the playing area to do these things on your turn.

ursogr8
23-02-2006, 07:29 PM
Yes I believe so. Area is the playing hall where games are actually played. The venue includes all the support areas as well (smoking area and toilets etc).

The distinction is not implied but explicit. The rule says the playing venue is defined as (the playing area plus a bunch of other things), so obviously "playing area" is a subset of "playing venue". So you can go to the toilet, go for a smoke, get a drink, etc, but you cannot leave the playing area to do these things on your turn.

What a relief. ;) :P
At least now I understand what I don't understand.



Just one last thing. Where does it say that locally we cannot declare toilets separate from the rest-room? And define the toilets inside the area.

starter

Kevin Bonham
23-02-2006, 08:17 PM
Just one last thing. Where does it say that locally we cannot declare toilets separate from the rest-room? And define the toilets inside the area.

Only do this if you want people playing chess in there.

The rule is commonly disregarded but it is useful to have it there and enforce it as needs be when someone's conduct is suspicious.

bobby1972
23-02-2006, 09:23 PM
Observing too many toilet trips can have a strong influence on the paranoind-minded.
this could also be a possibility he he he :) :)

Denis_Jessop
24-02-2006, 03:41 PM
I'm not sure that the situation has been fully comprehended here. What Art. 12.5 does is to prohibit players from leaving the "playing venue" without the arbiter's permission and further to prohibit the player with the move leaving the "playing area" (one element of the playing venue) without the arbiter's permission. I assume the latter restriction is to prevent cheating of the kind discovered in a Doeberl Cup many years ago when copious notes of analysis were found on a roll of toilet paper:doh:

DJ

WhiteElephant
25-02-2006, 03:09 AM
At one tournament I played in, a player kept going to the toilet non-stop for the first hour of his game. It was a fairly strong player (2000+). After this went on for a while, his opponent and a few observers accused him of cheating. Turned out he was going to the toilet to drink from his hip flask.

Bereaved
26-02-2006, 12:55 AM
Hello, everyone,

I do not see that a person should be denied the opportunity to go to the toilet on their move. We are not pieces of machinery, we are organic beings, and we have by products of our biological processes. We must eliminate said byproducts.

Failing to do so can cause discomfort. At times, the need to eliminate, is proportional not just to ingestion, but also to nerves.

I am only too aware that I go to the toilet heaps during a game, because of nerves; so what? If it is truly to be a contentious issue, I will be fighting on the side of those in favour of removing the restriction, and will elsewise ignore this statute and wait to see some one try and stop me going to the toilet.

This whole statute is barbaric, and makes me feel like I am back in primary school.

I do appreciate the dilemma regarding cheating on some abstract level through the worries of technology, but my dumb savannah brain is always going to be able to persuade me to go to the toilet hands down.

Take care and God Bless, Macavity,

PS I have heard that some professional card players wear catheters to the table, and that others will simply ignore the necessity, socially supported, of travelling to the toilet prior to elimination.

Kevin Bonham
26-02-2006, 02:51 AM
So you can go to the toilet, go for a smoke, get a drink, etc, but you cannot leave the playing area to do these things on your turn.

Sorry; I should have added "without permission" of course.