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arosar
22-01-2004, 11:09 AM
Where: North Sydney Leagues Club
When: Saturday 24th / Sunday 25th January
Director: Jason Lyons [International Arbiter]
Time Control: FIDE time control 90 minutes + 30 seconds per move from the start
Entry Fees: Adult: $70.00 Junior [u/18]: $40.00
entries due Friday January 23rd. Register by phone, email or mail and pay on the day. Late entries will be accepted on the day.
Schedule: Saturday: 9am Registration; 9:30 Round 1; 2:00 round 2; 6:30 round 3
Sunday: 9:30 Round 4; 2:00 round 5; 6:30 round 6
Prizes:
(based on 75 players) Open 1st $600 2nd $400 3rd $200
U2000, U1800 1st $250 2nd $175 3rd $100
U1600, U1400 1st $250 2nd $175 3rd $100

The tournament will be FIDE rated
Players are eligible for only 1 prize.
A $10 late fee will be charged to all entries received on Saturday 24th January 2004, and an additional $10 for entries received after the scheduled start of round 1.
All NSW resident players must be members of (or join) the NSWCA or the NSWJCL
For further information contact Ralph Seberry by telephone [0403 991 730], email ralphseberry@optushome.com.au, or visit the NSWCA website: http://www.nswca.org.au/

bobby1972
22-01-2004, 01:00 PM
looks like this will atract some big players and there will be some nice chess,maybe some one can get some of the games and put them on the bb

arosar
22-01-2004, 01:26 PM
I will try mate. I won't be playing though.

AR

Bob1
22-01-2004, 07:27 PM
This will be a really great event to kick off the 2004 GP series.
North Sydney always attracts both a strong field and a big field. (there will also be a shortage of {good} juniors as they are at a decoy event in Perth - pretty clever ploy by us oldies - and even if they manage to get back here they will be easy pickings!)

The prize money for this event is the best ever and Jason is a fantastic DOP.

Better still we can all spend Monday with the family and pretend we are caring / sharing family people!!
(although everyone on this BB knows better)

Paul S
24-01-2004, 01:40 PM
As someone who has played in the last two (2002 and 2003) Australia Day Weekenders, I thought I should give my reasons as to why I am NOT playing today (and tomorrow). The time (availability) is not an issue, as I could have spared 2 out of 3 days this long weekend (instead I am now doing other things, such as making posts on this BB - this is my my first post for 2004!).

First, some good things about this comp! I think the tournament flyer is a considerable improvement on last years NSWCA tournament flyers (although there are still a couple of "imperfections"). It's good to see that a similar format for the flyers is being used for the upcoming City of Sydney tournament (and hopefuly for other NSWCA tournaments).

Also, the prizemoney is good! OK, the entry fee ($70 for adults) is a little expensive (especially for pensioners), but chess players have to realise that they cannot have it both ways! Obviously higher entry fees means more prizemoney and less entry fees means less prizemoney. Personally I would have preferred to see penioners/unemployed/students etc have a discounted entry fee of $55 with the prizemoney remaining the same - this could have been easily achieved by getting rid of the Grand Prix fees (which I think is a waste of money - I'll expand on this in another thread).

The promotion was reasonable as far as emails of flyers goes, but I was surpised that it was only on Thursday (2 days before start of tournament!) before someone started a BB thread on it! I am also surpised that Jason Lyons (who is usually quite good at promoting tournaments that he arbiters) did not put any posts on this BB to promote the Australia Day Weekender. Anyway, I think Amiel (Arosar) deserves some credit for iniating (and informing) people on this BB about this tournament, even if it was only two days ago.

The time limits for this year's Australia Day Weekender are 90 minutes plus 30 seconds per player per move per player. Like most players of around my rating (just under 1400), when I play games of this sort of length (eg in Grade Matches, Doeberl Cup etc) they last on average 2 hours. There are 3 rounds today and tomorrow (6 in total). They start at 9.30am, 2.00pm and 6.30pm. So, assuming my games last for 2 hours, what am I supposed to do for the 2.5 hors until the next round? To me this represents 5 hours wasted per day (10 hours for the tournament). Now, supposing I was to win a prize in the U1400 division (1st=$250, 2nd = $175, 3rd = $100), which is a strong possibility, as my rating is 1387. If I was likely to win a prize, then I would have to wait until 11pm on Sunday for the prizegiving! Of course, that is assuming all goes to plan! With a comp with time limits of 90 mins + 30 secs/move, there is bound to be at least one game per round that lasts 4.5 hours and one game per day that lasts 5 hours, so the presentation could well be at midnight on Sunday!!! - as John McEnroe would say "that's absurd - you cannot be serious"! At least it only takes me 30 minutes to get home from North Sydney Leagues (thanks mainly to the recently completed Eastern Distributor and M5 East - prior to this it would have taken me around 50 minutes), but how would players from say Richmond/Wollongong (ie Brian Jones / Matthew Sweeney) feel about having to leave home on Sunday at 8am (to get to North Sydney Leagues at 9.30am) and get home at 1.30pm on Monday morning (asssuming they had to wait around to collect a prize and assuming prizegiving is at MIDNIGHT - yes, I think it is a strong possibility that this is when the prizes will be handed out)!

What about Juniors? It seems incongrous to me that there is a $40 entry fee for Juniors (considerablly cheaper than the $70 entry fee for adults) to try to encourage them to play. Yet how many parents would want their kids up at midnight in order to collect their prize? BTW, from my irregular attendance at weekenders, I have noticed that Juniors (especially young ones, say U14) get more of a thrill (and encouragement!) out of winning a prize than us adults.

Simply put, I cannot justify wasting 10 hours (minimum) to 15 hours (maximum) of my time waiting for the next round (or presentation) to start over a 48 hour period, so this is the main reason why I am not playing this year. Had the time limits been the same (or similar) to last year's (1 hour per player per game) then I would have played today (and tomorrow).

There are a couple of other issues with this tournament that I don't like, which I will expand on in another post in this thread (this one is long enough already!).

ursogr8
24-01-2004, 01:54 PM
As someone who has played in the last two (2002 and 2003) Australia Day Weekenders, I thought I should give my reasons as to why I am NOT playing today (and tomorrow).


Welcome back Paul S.

I have missed your long and considered posts, and this most recent post is very interetsing analysis that I will refer to my Captain who is planning and carrying out the necessary actions to run this years VIC OPEN, which will be a week-ender.

starter

Paul S
24-01-2004, 03:23 PM
Welcome back Paul S.

I have missed your long and considered posts, and this most recent post is very interetsing analysis that I will refer to my Captain who is planning and carrying out the necessary actions to run this years VIC OPEN, which will be a week-ender.

starter

Hi Starter

Thanks for your kind words - its good to be back, and nice to know that someone misses me!

Just a couple more points to add about the 2004 Australia Day Weekender and aspects related to it.

As a general rule, the longer the time limits in chess, the better the quality of games. For a comp with, say 90 mins + 30 secs/move per player, I think 1 or 2 games per day is fine. To me the advantages of one game per day (eg some players can only afford half a day due to other commitments, no "waiting around period" between games 1 and 2 etc) versus 2 games per day (eg cost savings on rent/arbiters fees, more economical/practical for players who live a long distance from venue, shorter tournament duration etc) more or less cancel each other out. However, I think that by the third game per day of these type of time limits (eg 90 mins + 30 secs/move per player), the quality of the games would be a lot less than that of the first two games and the extra "waiting around period" between games (2 and 3) would be of sufficient annoyance factor to negate any cost savings from arbiters fees/rent etc. Therefore, IMHO there should only be one or two rounds per day for tournaments with these sort of longer time limits.

If for the 2004 Australia Day Weekender there are 75 players expected (BTW, I think it will be more like last years of 60 to 65), then 6 rounds is not sufficient length to get a reasonable "spread" of the field. Also you get some players who will have a 4-2 colour split. 6 rounds is probably suitable number of rounds for a tournament of less than 30 players, but not for 75 (or for that matter motre than 30). The 2002 and 2003 Australia Day Weekenders were 7 rounds.

Anyway, to be more positive, here are some of my ideas for the 2005 Australia Day Weekender. Games to be 1 hour per player per game (or 1 houur plus tiny increment). There should be 9 rounds, 5 on Saturday and 4 on Sunday (yes, I know, knockers will say what about time on Saturday - to which I say that the completion of 5 rounds with 1 hour per player per game will take less time than the completion of 3 rounds under the present format). If 9 rounds is not possible/practical, then have 8 rounds with 4 on Saturday and 4 on Sunday (yes, I know, what about the likely 5-3 colour split for some players - to which I say 5-3 is not ideal, but is better than a 4-2 split at the 2004 Australia Day Weekender!). The more number of rounds the better the accuracy in determining TRUE winners/placegetters!

Bill Gletsos
24-01-2004, 05:37 PM
The NSWCA Council has decided to highlight a few of tournaments this year.

The Council was well prepared to support any initiatives of its new Toiurnaments Officer Ralph Seberry.


Some of these decisions were:

1) Have good prize money

2) FIDE rate it. That therefore forces a particular time limit.

3) Grand Prix Cat 3

The Australia Day weekender meets these criteria.

We also wanted to try some different formats of 6 round V 7 round.

The NSW Open will be 7 rounds with the same 3 objectives above.

I guess we will see from the number of entries if we got it right, however we would hope for around 80.

Bill Gletsos
24-01-2004, 05:41 PM
Although there may be issues with the publication of GP scores, that is no reason not to support it.

The players will enter to chase GP points.

Also FIDE rating tournaments does attract players.
If its FIDE rated it must meet minimum time limits.

As for the 6 rounds, we decided not to force players to waste all 3 days of the long weekend.

Last year in the NSW Open we had 3 rounds in one day which finished late. It was FIDE rated and got 80 players. There were a fair number of juniors some even from the ACT. Clearly the late finishing time did not stop players from participating.

Bill Gletsos
24-01-2004, 05:42 PM
[ to which I say 5-3 is not ideal, but is better than a 4-2 split at the 2004 Australia Day Weekender!).
With all due respect thats one of the silliest statements I have read. :rolleyes:

chesslover
24-01-2004, 06:08 PM
I normally do not play chess regularly, because my partner gets grumpy when I play chess all weekend, but I thought what Bill posted about FIDE rating, grand prix points and prizemoney were all good points

does anyone know how many people entered the tourney? the big name players?

Is it a "success", or does it vindicate what Paul stated in this thread?

Bill Gletsos
24-01-2004, 06:11 PM
One other point.

NSWCA does not offer discounts to pensioners and the unemployed on tournament entry fees.
It has not done so for many years.

Also the entry fee for juniors has always been based on a particular % discount.

I believe that was 25% for juniors U18 and 50% for juniors U14.

However based on discussions at the last AGM it was felt we should try and increase junior participation.

Thats why for this tournament we changed the %.

Given that most of the top juniors are all over this will give us an indication of how many others may be prepared to play in our tournaments.

Bill Gletsos
24-01-2004, 06:14 PM
I normally do not play chess regularly, because my partner gets grumpy when I play chess all weekend, but I thought what Bill posted about FIDE rating, grand prix points and prizemoney were all good points

does anyone know how many people entered the tourney? the big name players?

Is it a "success", or does it vindicate what Paul stated in this thread?

I have an idea of numbers based on pre-entries, however I will wait to hear the official numbers before posting anything.

I think some of the "big" names are still in WA acting as coaches.

We have a number of other weekenders planned during the year that are not FIDE rated, with less entry fees and less prize money and only GP cat 1 events.

arosar
24-01-2004, 07:57 PM
Hello you boys. Just been back from the tourn. Not that big a turnout it seemed to me. I shoulda counted numbers. Anyway - not that strong either. I think only Seberry and Xie were 2K+. Interesting observation about time control by Paul S. I heard a coupla 'complaints' that TC just made them buggered.

And for you Ascaro I have here with me a coupla games. One has a very interesting Muzio. Will convert to pgn and post when I am here next.

AR

Paul S
24-01-2004, 08:56 PM
One other point.

NSWCA does not offer discounts to pensioners and the unemployed on tournament entry fees.
It has not done so for many years.



IMHO the NSWCA should offer discounted entry fees to pensioners/unemployed/students etc for its tournaments. However, I know that from my time on the NSWCA Council last year (when I raised this issue) I seemed to be in a minority of one on this issue, so I can't see this being changed. To be fair to the NSWCA, most other chess organisations also do not have discounted entry fees to pensioners/unemployed/students etc. I think that the chess community should be in step with virtually all other organisations in offering financial discounts for those who are less financially fortunate. More importantly it would help to boost tournament numbers (ie bums on seats)!

Just because something has been the case for many years does not necessarily mean that it should always be the case. Taking this logic to the extreme I could say that I should not buy a mobile phone just because I have not had one in the past.

Paul S
24-01-2004, 09:49 PM
The players will enter to chase GP points.


I think players would play in a tournament whether there were Grand Prix points or not. IMHO more players would play in a tournament if it was not in the GP and instead this "GP fee money" was used for either increased prize money and/or reduced entry fees.

Unlike say, the ACF Ratings, the Grand Prix is NOT an essential part of Australian Chess.




Also FIDE rating tournaments does attract players.



I don't believe that this is as big a factor in player participation as what you seem to infer. As with GP fees, I reckon that more players would play in a tournament if it was not FIDE rated and instead the "FIDE fee money" was instead used for either increased prize money and/or reduced entry fees.



As for the 6 rounds, we decided not to force players to waste all 3 days of the long weekend.


Yes, a lot of players (like myself!) could only afford 2 days out of 3 to play chess on a long weekend.

However, if you are going to have a 6 round competition with the time limits of 90 minutes plus 30 seconds per move, then there should be no more than 2 rounds per day for reasons I mentioned earlier.



Last year in the NSW Open we had 3 rounds in one day which finished late. It was FIDE rated and got 80 players. There were a fair number of juniors some even from the ACT. Clearly the late finishing time did not stop players from participating.

This is misleading. The NSW Open had 2 rounds on the Saturday (registration plus rounds 1 and 2), 3 rounds on the Sunday (rounds 3, 4 and 5) and 2 rounds on the Monday (rounds 6 and 7 plus presentation).

So, as soon as they finished their round 5 game, players could go home. They did NOT have to wait around until midnight for the presentation/prizegiving (as will be the case tomorrow with the 2004 Australia Day Weekender).

chesslover
24-01-2004, 10:02 PM
IMHO the NSWCA should offer discounted entry fees to pensioners/unemployed/students etc for its tournaments. However, I know that from my time on the NSWCA Council last year (when I raised this issue) I seemed to be in a minority of one on this issue, so I can't see this being changed. To be fair to the NSWCA, most other chess organisations also do not have discounted entry fees to pensioners/unemployed/students etc. I think that the chess community should be in step with virtually all other organisations in offering financial discounts for those who are less financially fortunate. More importantly it would help to boost tournament numbers (ie bums on seats)!

Just because something has been the case for many years does not necessarily mean that it should always be the case. Taking this logic to the extreme I could say that I should not buy a mobile phone just because I have not had one in the past.

Probably this is a discussion that should be started on a new thread in the australian chess section of teh board, but I agree with you

I do think that the less fortunate amongst us should have discounted entry to chess. People who are pensioners, unemployed have concessions available for everyday activities by the government, in recognition of the megre relative income they earn, and I think chess in NSW should be no exception

I work full time, and can afford to pay $hundreds for a two day weekend (if my partner allowed ;) ), but how many penioners and unemployed could do that?

alexmdc
24-01-2004, 10:11 PM
Hiya,

Since I'm playing in this weekender, I want to say that 3 games at 90 + 30 is TOO MUCH! My first game lasted 4.5 hours so I was already buggered with 2 more rounds to go :( Are we only playing such a long time control to make the tournament fide rated?

Other than that, lots of fun, good players nice venue etc we'll see how we go tomorrow!

Bill Gletsos
24-01-2004, 10:25 PM
The players will enter to chase GP points.


I think players would play in a tournament whether there were Grand Prix points or not. IMHO more players would play in a tournament if it was not in the GP and instead this "GP fee money" was used for either increased prize money and/or reduced entry fees.
Thats your opinion .
I disagree.






Also FIDE rating tournaments does attract players.



I don't believe that this is as big a factor in player participation as what you seem to infer. As with GP fees, I reckon that more players would play in a tournament if it was not FIDE rated and instead the "FIDE fee money" was instead used for either increased prize money and/or reduced entry fees.
Again I disagree.
Plus you are ignoring the fact that last year we ran two identical tournaments. The NSW Open and the Ryde Eastwood Open.
Both had the same prize money. Both were seven rounds over 3 days. Both were GP cat 3's. The NSW Open was FIDE rated. The Ryde Eastwood wasnt.
We got significantly more at the NSW OPen than the Ryde eastwood open.




As for the 6 rounds, we decided not to force players to waste all 3 days of the long weekend.


Yes, a lot of players (like myself!) could only afford 2 days out of 3 to play chess on a long weekend.

However, if you are going to have a 6 round competition with the time limits of 90 minutes plus 30 seconds per move, then there should be no more than 2 rounds per day for reasons I mentioned earlier.
Again just your opinion.
Not one I share and obviously not one shared by those that played in last years NSW Open.




Last year in the NSW Open we had 3 rounds in one day which finished late. It was FIDE rated and got 80 players. There were a fair number of juniors some even from the ACT. Clearly the late finishing time did not stop players from participating.

This is misleading. The NSW Open had 2 rounds on the Saturday (registration plus rounds 1 and 2), 3 rounds on the Sunday (rounds 3, 4 and 5) and 2 rounds on the Monday (rounds 6 and 7 plus presentation).

So, as soon as they finished their round 5 game, players could go home. They did NOT have to wait around until midnight for the presentation/prizegiving (as will be the case tomorrow with the 2004 Australia Day Weekender).
Rather than actual fact this is is all just supposition on your part.
Therefore I am equally intitled to make my own supposition that it is more than likely the last round will finish by 10.30 or maybe 11 at the latest and not your after midnight scenario.

Bill Gletsos
24-01-2004, 10:26 PM
I work full time, and can afford to pay $hundreds for a two day weekend (if my partner allowed ;) ), but how many penioners and unemployed could do that?
Get real, no one is suggesting they pay hundreds of dollars for a 2 day weekender.

chesslover
24-01-2004, 10:26 PM
you do ot think that $70 for a pensioner ot unemployed person for a weekender is too much? :? :rolleyes:

when I said I would play $hundreds, I meant it in the context that if the fee was ever raised to $hundreds I would still be able to afford it - unlike say a poor pensioner or unemployed person who would struggle to scrape together $70

ursogr8
24-01-2004, 10:29 PM
One other point.

NSWCA does not offer discounts to pensioners and the unemployed on tournament entry fees.
It has not done so for many years.



IMHO the NSWCA should offer discounted entry fees to pensioners/unemployed/students etc for its tournaments. To be fair to the NSWCA, most other chess organisations also do not have discounted entry fees to pensioners/unemployed/students etc. I think that the chess community should be in step with virtually all other organisations in offering financial discounts for those who are less financially fortunate. More importantly it would help to boost tournament numbers (ie bums on seats)!




hey Paul S
Come to Box Hill for concession discounts.
Autumn Cup starts next week. 7 week SWISS. $20 Full $15 Concession (juniors, pensioners, unemployed). Last year 100 starters.

Bill Gletsos
24-01-2004, 10:53 PM
you do ot think that $70 for a pensioner ot unemployed person for a weekender is too much? :? :rolleyes:

when I said I would play $hundreds, I meant it in the context that if the fee was ever raised to $hundreds I would still be able to afford it - unlike say a poor pensioner or unemployed person who would struggle to scrape together $70
I don't recall any decline in player numbers at the time we removed the pensioner and unemployed discount.

Garvinator
24-01-2004, 11:18 PM
[
We got significantly more at the NSW OPen than the Ryde eastwood open.


Ill challenge this one comment ;) . my opinion as to why there were more players at the nsw open is the title. I would assume that the nsw open winner gets some sort of title that the ryde eastwood champion does not?

jase
24-01-2004, 11:20 PM
Australia Day weekender

54 players [satisfactory at best. reasons for lower than expected turnout, I suggest, are high entry fees and the 12 hour playing schedule]

I just got home. I arrived at the venue at 9am sharp, and departed just after 11:30pm.

FIDE rated events are an incentive - no question. Many players were interested in how they could get a FIDE rating today. Unfortunately with only 6 rounds and just 8 FIDE rated players competing, their chances are poor.

Leaders: George Xie [top seed], Ralph Seberry [2nd seed], Johnny Bolens, Andrew Field [rated 1595 - well done Andrew]

Another 14 hours tomorrow; even at 10:30pm that's a late presentation.

Many players were quite drained after round 2 [wimps!]. I applaud the NSWCA and Ralph in particular for trying some new things for this event. Innovation is great; but this format is not ideal.

Bill Gletsos
24-01-2004, 11:22 PM
[
We got significantly more at the NSW OPen than the Ryde eastwood open.


Ill challenge this one comment ;) . my opinion as to why there were more players at the nsw open is the title. I would assume that the nsw open winner gets some sort of title that the ryde eastwood champion does not?
We just decided to stop calling it the Queen's Birthday weekender and settled on the name NSW Open.
It certainly wasnt advertised as a sort of title event.

Paul S
25-01-2004, 01:06 AM
Also FIDE rating tournaments does attract players.



I don't believe that this is as big a factor in player participation as what you seem to infer. As with GP fees, I reckon that more players would play in a tournament if it was not FIDE rated and instead the "FIDE fee money" was instead used for either increased prize money and/or reduced entry fees.
Again I disagree.
Plus you are ignoring the fact that last year we ran two identical tournaments. The NSW Open and the Ryde Eastwood Open.
Both had the same prize money. Both were seven rounds over 3 days. Both were GP cat 3's. The NSW Open was FIDE rated. The Ryde Eastwood wasnt.
We got significantly more at the NSW OPen than the Ryde eastwood open.



Bill, I think you are being a little mischievous here with your use of statistics!

80 players played in the 2003 NSW Open (June Long Weekend).

54 players played in the 2003 Ryde-Eastwood Open (October Long Weekend).

However, 84 players played in the 2002 Koala Open (October Long Weekend). The 2002 Koala Open was NOT FIDE rated.

It seems to me that the MAIN reason for only 54 players at the 2003 October Long Weekender (as compared to 84 at the 2002 October Long Weekender) was due to the fact that in 2003 the 5th round of the Ryde-Eastwood Open clashed with the Grand Final of the Rugby League. I am sure that if the Rugby League Grand Final had been played at the same time as round 5 of the 2003 NSW Open (June Long Weekend) then there would have only been around 54 players there, regardless of whether or not it was FIDE rated! The 2002 Koala Open did NOT clash with the Rugby League Grand Final.

FIDE rating had minimal impact in the difference in numbers between the 2003 NSW Open and 2003 Ryde-Eastwood Open.

Paul S
25-01-2004, 01:19 AM
hey Paul S
Come to Box Hill for concession discounts.
Autumn Cup starts next week. 7 week SWISS. $20 Full $15 Concession (juniors, pensioners, unemployed). Last year 100 starters.

Dear Starter

Unfortunately I live in Sydney, so its just a little too far for me to commute each week for 7 weeks! :)

Howver, if I lived in Melbourne I would be more than happy to play in this competition! :D

(BTW, for the benefit of BB viewers living outside Sydney, I am employed, so I would get no direct benefit from my proposal for pensioner/unemployed/student concession fees for chess tournaments).

Bill Gletsos
25-01-2004, 01:31 AM
The 2002 Koala Open did NOT clash with the Rugby League Grand Final.
You sure about this?
The 2002 Grand final was on the 6th of October.
The 2002 Koala Open was on the 6th and 7th October.

Paul S
25-01-2004, 01:45 AM
The 2002 Koala Open did NOT clash with the Rugby League Grand Final.
You sure about this?
The 2002 Grand final was on the 6th of October.
The 2002 Koala Open was on the 6th and 7th October.

Yes, I am sure! After all, I played in the 2002 Koala Open!

I can't remember if there were 3 rounds on the first day and 4 rounds on the second day or vice versa. BTW, the time limits were either 1 hour per player per game or one hour plus 10 seconds per player per game (I can't remember which).

What I do remember though is after my last game finished on the first day I left the venue (Rooty Hill RSL, which is about 40km from where I live) and got home in plenty of time to see the 2002 Grand Final on TV! Don't forget that for the last few years the Grand Final has been played at NIGHT on the Sunday of the October Long Weekend!

Brian Jones ran a lightning comp in the evening of the 6th which myself (and quite a few other chess players!) had to decline playing in because we wanted to watch the Grand Final.

Bob1
25-01-2004, 10:52 AM
Concessional entry fees are something that the NSWCA & I disagree on - and I will continue to lobby for their acceptance in NSW. I figure I have 15 years before I will actually benefit from them - so time is on my side - It would only take a small number of committed eligible people to win a motion on this issue at an AGM in NSW. (so I guess those eligible have only themselves to blame for not takling the issue where it matters)

I have used concession entry fees when ever possible - but I could not make the claim that the use of concessional entries increase player participation.

I do know that there are a number of older players that find that entry fees above $20/$30 are a inhibiting factor to playing in organised chess.
So the modest concessions I have provided in the past still (typically $10)exclude these keen players that I see at the local clubs.

There is definitely a place in NSW Chess for low entry fee events.
Maybe we could look at a mini one day rapid series (say 5 events). The big inhibitor is venue hire costs. (but now we are back with the Chess centre argument)

Bob1
25-01-2004, 10:59 AM
Australia Day weekender

54 players [satisfactory at best. reasons for lower than expected turnout, I suggest, are high entry fees and the 12 hour playing schedule]

I just got home. I arrived at the venue at 9am sharp, and departed just after 11:30pm.



Jason
Thanks for taking the time (after a huge day) to update everone on the size of the event and a few comments/observations.
This is the type of commitment that is needed if chess to move forward.

Bob

Bill Gletsos
25-01-2004, 12:14 PM
Concessional entry fees are something that the NSWCA & I disagree on - and I will continue to lobby for their acceptance in NSW. I figure I have 15 years before I will actually benefit from them - so time is on my side - It would only take a small number of committed eligible people to win a motion on this issue at an AGM in NSW. (so I guess those eligible have only themselves to blame for not takling the issue where it matters)
I cannot recall anyone raising the issue of lack of concessional entry fees at any AGM since concessional entries were abolished.

arosar
25-01-2004, 01:02 PM
Hey alexmdc - don't forgt to email me a PGN of your game from round 1 yesterday. Or just post it here directly. Actually, as I watching this game and you missing a simple win, I immediately thought of me mate here Mr. Gletsos and how he traumatised you once.

AR

Paul S
25-01-2004, 01:11 PM
I cannot recall anyone raising the issue of lack of concessional entry fees at any AGM since concessional entries were abolished.

If I am present at the next NSWCA AGM (BTW, I plan to be there!), I will raise this as an issue!

Actually, I am surprised that people like Johnny Bolens (and other pensioners/unemployed/students etc) who usually attend the NSWCA AGM have not already raised it!

BTW, I am fully employed (have been with the one company, Energy Australia, for 22 years and don't expect to get retrenched/sacked any time soon), and so I don't expect to get any personal gain from reduced entry fees to chess tournaments myself! Simply put, I think it is the right thing to do, that people who are less financially fortunate (pensioners/unemployed/students etc) should get a discount in entry fees for chess tournaments. After all, this is what most other organisations/communities do, so why should chess be any different?

Garvinator
25-01-2004, 02:43 PM
Simply put, I think it is the right thing to do, that people who are less financially fortunate (pensioners/unemployed/students etc) should get a discount in entry fees for chess tournaments. After all, this is what most other organisations/communities do, so why should chess be any different?

actually paul, the unemployed dont get any discounts when travelling on public transport etc. they only get a health care card which is available to all people earning less than a set amount.

Bob1
25-01-2004, 02:55 PM
[quote="Bill Gletsos
I cannot recall anyone raising the issue of lack of concessional entry fees at any AGM since concessional entries were abolished.[/quote]

Bill
Not sure myself really - but think it has been discussed in general (ie not in relation to any actual motion - more mixed up in the setting of the membership fees) - I do know we have discussed junior entry fees at an AGM (Paul Dozsa was quite vocal on this issue).

The avenue to deal with this is there (AGM) - it appears none of us are committed enought to persue it further - so it is understandable (and sensible) that succesive NSWCA councils have maintained the status quo on this issue.

ursogr8
25-01-2004, 03:02 PM
Concessional entry fees are something that the NSWCA & I disagree on - and I will continue to lobby for their acceptance in NSW. I figure I have 15 years before I will actually benefit from them - so time is on my side - It would only take a small number of committed eligible people to win a motion on this issue at an AGM in NSW. (so I guess those eligible have only themselves to blame for not takling the issue where it matters)
I cannot recall anyone raising the issue of lack of concessional entry fees at any AGM since concessional entries were abolished.

Bill

Does the NSWCA 'policy' on non-concessional concessions amount to a mandatory tournament condition for NSW Clubs holding an OPEN week-ender?
Or is it only a mandatory condition for events run directly by the NSWCA?

starter

Bill Gletsos
25-01-2004, 03:22 PM
I cannot recall anyone raising the issue of lack of concessional entry fees at any AGM since concessional entries were abolished.

Bill
Not sure myself really - but think it has been discussed in general (ie not in relation to any actual motion - more mixed up in the setting of the membership fees) - I do know we have discussed junior entry fees at an AGM (Paul Dozsa was quite vocal on this issue).

The avenue to deal with this is there (AGM) - it appears none of us are committed enought to persue it further - so it is understandable (and sensible) that succesive NSWCA councils have maintained the status quo on this issue.
Even junior fees were only discussed with regards to NSWCA membership fees for juniors who were no longer NSWJCL members due to age.

We have always had and still do have concession membership fees.

As far as I can determine we still had concession entry fees until about mid 1997 when the QB weekender was the first without them.

chesslover
25-01-2004, 04:31 PM
I cannot recall anyone raising the issue of lack of concessional entry fees at any AGM since concessional entries were abolished.

If I am present at the next NSWCA AGM (BTW, I plan to be there!), I will raise this as an issue!

Actually, I am surprised that people like Johnny Bolens (and other pensioners/unemployed/students etc) who usually attend the NSWCA AGM have not already raised it!

Simply put, I think it is the right thing to do, that people who are less financially fortunate (pensioners/unemployed/students etc) should get a discount in entry fees for chess tournaments. After all, this is what most other organisations/communities do, so why should chess be any different?

I agree with you 100%.Whilst people like us who are employed can pay these entry fees, those who are financially less fortunate will find it hard. I fidn it hard to think how someone who is unemployed or a peniosner can afford $70 for an entry fee :(

I too was surprised that people like Loyd fell, Bolens etc who have been to numerous AGM, and are quick to have strong opinions on a lot of issues(which i most frequently disagree with), have not raised this issue at our AGMs before :?

Bill Gletsos
25-01-2004, 05:44 PM
Concessional entry fees are something that the NSWCA & I disagree on - and I will continue to lobby for their acceptance in NSW. I figure I have 15 years before I will actually benefit from them - so time is on my side - It would only take a small number of committed eligible people to win a motion on this issue at an AGM in NSW. (so I guess those eligible have only themselves to blame for not takling the issue where it matters)
I cannot recall anyone raising the issue of lack of concessional entry fees at any AGM since concessional entries were abolished.

Bill

Does the NSWCA 'policy' on non-concessional concessions amount to a mandatory tournament condition for NSW Clubs holding an OPEN week-ender?
Or is it only a mandatory condition for events run directly by the NSWCA?

starter
Clubs running their own tournaments can do what they like.
Its only in NSWCA events where there is no concession entries.

In 1996 the QB weekender entry fee was $45 and the concession was $36. Only a first prize of $500 was guaranteed.

Seven years later in 2003 the entry fee was $70 and total prizes of $2700 were paid. Compared to the 1996 concession fee this equates to nearly a 95% increase and a 56% increase compared to the normal entry fee over seven years.
Based on the rate that other costs have risen over the same 7 year period, I'm not sure it is unreasonable.

I suspect if we re-introduced concessional entry fees then the concessional fee would be $70 and the regular fee $85. ;)

jase
26-01-2004, 02:05 PM
Back to the chess ...

George Xie is the winner of the Australia Day weekender, held at North Sydney Leagues Club, January 24-25, 2004.

A slightly less than satisfactory 54 players competed in an event dominated by the top two seeds, Geirge Xie and Ralph Seberry.

Their round 4 clash seemed likely to be a definitive match in determining podium places, however not for the first time the two declined to play chess, agreeing to a draw after some 5 moves.

Both players held a significant edge over their 52 rivals, hence the conservative decision to split the top two prizes between them.

The chess gods would not have it so. Final round, George sitting on board 1 against Jason Chan, Ralph on board 2 against Kostia Lubarsky. Kosti offers a draw. Ralph has a slight edge, but no significant imbalance to exploit. Ralph analyses Goerge's position, concludes that George is likely to win, and declines the draw.

George duly wins his game, Ralph's position is on the slide...he finds himself in what appeared to be a lost pawn ending...

[intermezzo: George and I are discussing the sad fate of Ralph's game, when George related this amuswing tale: In much the same circumstances in a tournament some time ago, Gary Lane and George Xie are leading on 5/6 in the final round, having drawn their match. They lead the field by half a point. Gary's opponent offers a draw. Rather than respond, Gary goes ito analysis mode on George's game. Mid-analysis, George's opponent also offers a draw. George checks out Gary's position, fears that Gary will probably win, and so declines the draw. Gary immediately declines the draw offered. Both players [i]lose their games, are overtaken by those half a point behind, and win nothing. At least George could laugh about it. ;)]

Back to Ralph's game...he wander past the arbiter's table and mutters that the ending has many complications. His expression is one of dead loss. A fine victory to Kostia Lubarsky, propelling him to a share of 2nd place!

1st George Xie
=2nd Joel Harp, Kostia Lubarsky
=4th Johny Bolens, Ralph Seberry, Gareth Charles

This event was FIDE rated. Unfortunately a combination of only 6 rounds and a lower than expected turnout of FIDE rated players, made it very difficult for those seeking a FIDE rating to play the minimum 4 FIDE-rated players required.

One who achieved that feat was Andrew Field, rated a modest 1595, who performed well above his current station to share the u/1600 ratings prize, and score 2/4 against FIDE rated opponents with an average rating of 2123 - outstanding!

There were no disputes; my most difficult tasks were explaining some laws of chess to juniors, and explaining to one young boy's father why a FIDE-rated tournament with 4 hour playing sessions is not the best choice for his boy, who has never played a chess tournament of any description in his life. Some examples of this young lad's indiscretions:
- talking to opponents during games
- talking to players seated next to him during games
- talking to himself as he plays through his game, still at the table, an hour after his game
-not recording moves
- refusing to resign, instead insisting the game is a draw because "i'm stuck" [really]
- making two moves in a row whilst his opponent is in the bathroom
- withdrawing moves during games
- refusing to agree to the 'touch move' rule

Mobile Phone Report: one spectator ejected on the Saturday. One player [a NSWCA Councillor, no less] incurring the extremeties of my goodwill. In round 4 his phone loudly beeped a message. I couldn't identify the culprit, so it went unchecked. Many in the playing hall were looking around, then looking at me, like "Ooooooh, someone's in trouble". Next round, same beep, and this time I spy the offender fiddling with his pocket! As it was a message rather than a ring tone, I issued a stern warning. [Soft, I know!]

Thanks to Miro Nowak for providing some demo boards, to arosar who dropped in and took some photos, and to the players for their generous demeanour throughout the event.

Jason Lyons
IA

arosar
26-01-2004, 02:33 PM
Will send photos when I get them processed. Btw, if anyone knows Joel Harp, can someone please ask him for his last round game. I couldn't as I had a bus to catch. What a brilliant game that was. Musta been game of the round if not the tourney.

AR

Paul S
26-01-2004, 02:37 PM
Hi Jason

Out of curiosity, at what time was the presentation last night?

Who was closer to the mark, myself (midnight) or Bill (10.30pm)?

BTW, I think 10.30pm is way too late for a presentation (especialy for Juniors, who get more satisfaction out of winning a prize than us adults), although I guess 10.30 pm is better than midnight!!!

arosar
26-01-2004, 02:38 PM
Here are some games.

[Event "NSWCA Aust Day we"]
[Site "North Sydney"]
[Date "2004.??.??"]
[Round "5"]
[White "Xie, George"]
[Black "Peters, Duncan"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "D33"]
[PlyCount "83"]
[EventDate "2004.??.??"]

1. d4 d5 2. c4 e6 3. Nf3 c5 4. cxd5 exd5 5. Nc3 Be6 6. g3 Nc6 7. Bg2 Nf6 8. O-O
Be7 9. dxc5 Bxc5 10. Bg5 Be7 11. Qa4 h6 12. Bxf6 Bxf6 13. Rfd1 Bxc3 14. bxc3 Qc7 15. c4 dxc4 16. Nd4 O-O 17. Nxe6 fxe6 18. Qxc4 Qe5 19. Rab1 Qf5 20. Rf1 Rab8 21. Rb5 Qf6 22. Bxc6 bxc6 23. Ra5 Qf7 24. Qxc6 Rfc8 25. Qa4 Rc7 26. Rd1 Rcb7 27. Kg2 Qc7 28. Ra6 Qe5 29. Qc4 Rc7 30. Qxe6+ Qxe6 31. Rxe6 Rb2 32. a4 Rcc2 33. Rd8+ Kh7 34. Rd7 a5 35. Ree7 Kg6 36. Rxg7+ Kf6 37. Rdf7+ Ke6 38. Rf4 Rxe2 39. Rg6+ Ke7 40. Ra6 Rb4 41. Rxb4 axb4 42. Rb6 1-0

[Event "NSWCA Aust Day we"]
[Site "North Sydney"]
[Date "2004.??.??"]
[Round "5"]
[White "Charles, Gareth"]
[Black "Chan, Jason"]
[Result "0-1"]
[ECO "B51"]
[PlyCount "126"]
[EventDate "2004.??.??"]

1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 d6 3. Bb5+ Nd7 4. O-O e6 5. Re1 a6 6. Bxd7+ Bxd7 7. d4 cxd4 8. Qxd4 e5 9. Qd3 b5 10. Nc3 h6 11. a4 b4 12. Nd5 a5 13. Be3 Rb8 14. Nd2 Ne7 15. Nc4 Nxd5 16. Qxd5 Be6 17. Qc6+ Qd7 18. Nxa5 Be7 19. Red1 Rc8 20. Qxd7+ Kxd7 21.
Rd2 Kc7 22. Nb3 Bg5 23. Bxg5 hxg5 24. Rad1 Rhd8 25. Nc1 g4 26. b3 g6 27. Nd3 Rb8 28. Rc1 Rd7 29. c3 Bxb3 30. cxb4+ Kd8 31. a5 Rc7 32. Rxc7 Kxc7 33. Rb2 Ba4 34. f3 gxf3 35. gxf3 Kc6 36. Kf2 Kb5 37. Ke3 Rh8 38. Rd2 f5 39. Rg2 f4+ 40. Kd2
Rh6 41. Kc3 Bd1 42. Ne1 Rh3 43. Rd2 Bxf3 44. Rd5+ Ka4 45. Rxd6 Bxe4+ 46. Kc4 Rb3 47. Rb6 Re3 48. Nc2 Bxc2 49. a6 Be4 50. a7 Ka3 51. Ra6+ Kb2 52. b5 f3 53. Rf6 Rc3+ 54. Kb4 Rc2 55. b6 Rxh2 56. Kc5 Rh5 57. Kd6 Rf5 58. Rxg6 f2 59. Kc7
f1=Q 60. b7 Qc4+ 61. Kd7 Rf7+ 62. Ke8 Rxb7 63. a8=Q Qf7+ 0-1

Nice one by alexmdc:

[Event "NSWCA Aust Day we"]
[Site "North Sydney"]
[Date "2004.??.??"]
[Round "4"]
[White "Mendes da Costa, Alex"]
[Black "Tracy, Michael"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "C51"]
[PlyCount "49"]
[EventDate "2004.??.??"]

1. e4 Nc6 2. Nf3 e5 3. Bc4 Bc5 4. b4 Bxb4 5. c3 Bc5 6. d4 exd4 7. O-O h6 8.cxd4 Bb6 9. Nc3 d6 10. Re1 Nge7 11. Ba3 O-O 12. Bb3 Bg4 13. Ne2 Bxf3 14. gxf3 Kh8 15. Qd3 f5 16. Rad1 f4 17. Kh1 Ng6 18. Bc2 Nh4 19. Rg1 h5 20. Qb5 Qe8 21. Qg5 Qe7 22. Qxh5+ Kg8 23. Bb3+ Rf7 24. Rxg7+ Kxg7 25. Rg1+ 1-0

FM Jones held to a draw.

[Event "NSWCA Aust Day we"]
[Site "North Sydney"]
[Date "2004.??.??"]
[Round "2"]
[White "Tomac, J."]
[Black "Jones, Lee"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "B01"]
[PlyCount "53"]
[EventDate "2004.??.??"]

1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Nf6 3. d4 Nxd5 4. Nf3 Bg4 5. Be2 e6 6. O-O Be7 7. Ne5 Bxe2 8. Qxe2 O-O 9. c4 Nf6 10. Rd1 c6 11. Nc3 Qa5 12. Bg5 h6 13. Bh4 a6 14. Rd3 b5 15. Rg3 Kh8 16. Bxf6 Bxf6 17. Qh5 Ra7 18. Ng4 Bg5 19. Ne5 Qd8 20. Ne4 Bf4 21. Rf3 Bxe5 22. dxe5 Rd7 23. Rf6 Kh7 24. Rxh6+ gxh6 25. Nf6+ Kg7 26. Qg4+ Kh8 27. Qh5 1/2-1/2

And one I promised earlier. Not actually the Muzio but the so called Hammpe-Allgeair (sp?). Scary stuff. Black missed mate somewhere there.

[Event "NSWCA Aust Day we"]
[Site "North Sydney"]
[Date "2004.??.??"]
[Round "2"]
[White "Peters, Duncan"]
[Black "Keuning, Anthony"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "C25"]
[PlyCount "122"]
[EventDate "2004.??.??"]

1. e4 e5 2. Nc3 Nc6 3. f4 exf4 4. Nf3 g5 5. h4 g4 6. Ng5 h6 7. Nxf7 Kxf7 8. Bc4+ d5 9. Bxd5+ Ke8 10. d4 Bd6 11. e5 Bb4 12. Bxc6+ bxc6 13. Bxf4 Bxc3+ 14. bxc3 Be6 15. g3 Bd5 16. Qxg4 Bxh1 17. Qg7 Qd5 18. Qxh8 Qe4+ 19. Kd2 Qg2+ 20. Kd1 Qf3+ 21. Kd2 Qg2+ 22. Kd1 Qf3+ 23. Kd2 Qg2+ 24. Ke1 Qe4+ 25. Kf1 Qf3+ 26. Ke1 Qxc3+ 27. Ke2 Qxc2+ 28. Bd2 Qc4+ 29. Ke3 Bd5 30. Qg7 Ne7 31. Qh8+ Bg8 32. Re1 Kd7 33. Qg7 Bf7 34. Kf2 Qxd4+ 35. Be3 Qd5 36. Bxh6 Rg8 37. Qf6 Rg6 38. Qf4
Qxa2+ 39. Re2 Qe6 40. Bg5 Nd5 41. Rd2 Ke8 42. Qa4 Qxe5 43. Qxa7 Qf5+ 44. Kg2 Qe4+ 45. Kh2 Rg8 46. Bf4 Qe7 47. Qa6 Kd7 48. Rc2 Nb4 49. Rd2+ Bd5 50. Qb7 Rc8 51. Qa7 Qe4 52. Kh3 Qh1+ 53. Kg4 Rg8+ 54. Kh5 Qf3+ 55. Kh6 Rc8 56. Qd4 Qg4 57. Qg7+ Qxg7+ 58. Kxg7 Rg8+ 59. Kf6 Rf8+ 60. Kg7 Rf7+ 61. Kg6 Rf8 1/2-1/2

AR

skip to my lou
26-01-2004, 02:41 PM
This is arosar's post with replayable games:

[Event "NSWCA Aust Day we"]
[Site "North Sydney"]
[Date "2004.??.??"]
[Round "5"]
[White "Xie, George"]
[Black "Peters, Duncan"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "D33"]
[PlyCount "83"]
[EventDate "2004.??.??"]

1. d4 d5 2. c4 e6 3. Nf3 c5 4. cxd5 exd5 5. Nc3 Be6 6. g3 Nc6 7. Bg2 Nf6 8. O-O Be7 9. dxc5 Bxc5 10. Bg5 Be7 11. Qa4 h6 12. Bxf6 Bxf6 13. Rfd1 Bxc3 14. bxc3 Qc7 15. c4 dxc4 16. Nd4 O-O 17. Nxe6 fxe6 18. Qxc4 Qe5 19. Rab1 Qf5 20. Rf1 Rab8 21. Rb5 Qf6 22. Bxc6 bxc6 23. Ra5 Qf7 24. Qxc6 Rfc8 25. Qa4 Rc7 26. Rd1 Rcb7 27. Kg2 Qc7 28. Ra6 Qe5 29. Qc4 Rc7 30. Qxe6+ Qxe6 31. Rxe6 Rb2 32. a4 Rcc2 33. Rd8+ Kh7 34. Rd7 a5 35. Ree7 Kg6 36. Rxg7+ Kf6 37. Rdf7+ Ke6 38. Rf4 Rxe2 39. Rg6+ Ke7 40. Ra6 Rb4 41. Rxb4 axb4 42. Rb6 1-0

[Event "NSWCA Aust Day we"]
[Site "North Sydney"]
[Date "2004.??.??"]
[Round "5"]
[White "Charles, Gareth"]
[Black "Chan, Jason"]
[Result "0-1"]
[ECO "B51"]
[PlyCount "126"]
[EventDate "2004.??.??"]

1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 d6 3. Bb5+ Nd7 4. O-O e6 5. Re1 a6 6. Bxd7+ Bxd7 7. d4 cxd4 8. Qxd4 e5 9. Qd3 b5 10. Nc3 h6 11. a4 b4 12. Nd5 a5 13. Be3 Rb8 14. Nd2 Ne7 15. Nc4 Nxd5 16. Qxd5 Be6 17. Qc6+ Qd7 18. Nxa5 Be7 19. Red1 Rc8 20. Qxd7+ Kxd7 21.Rd2 Kc7 22. Nb3 Bg5 23. Bxg5 hxg5 24. Rad1 Rhd8 25. Nc1 g4 26. b3 g6 27. Nd3 Rb8 28. Rc1 Rd7 29. c3 Bxb3 30. cxb4+ Kd8 31. a5 Rc7 32. Rxc7 Kxc7 33. Rb2 Ba4 34. f3 gxf3 35. gxf3 Kc6 36. Kf2 Kb5 37. Ke3 Rh8 38. Rd2 f5 39. Rg2 f4+ 40. Kd2 Rh6 41. Kc3 Bd1 42. Ne1 Rh3 43. Rd2 Bxf3 44. Rd5+ Ka4 45. Rxd6 Bxe4+ 46. Kc4 Rb3 47. Rb6 Re3 48. Nc2 Bxc2 49. a6 Be4 50. a7 Ka3 51. Ra6+ Kb2 52. b5 f3 53. Rf6 Rc3+ 54. Kb4 Rc2 55. b6 Rxh2 56. Kc5 Rh5 57. Kd6 Rf5 58. Rxg6 f2 59. Kc7 f1=Q 60. b7 Qc4+ 61. Kd7 Rf7+ 62. Ke8 Rxb7 63. a8=Q Qf7+ 0-1

Nice one by alexmdc:

[Event "NSWCA Aust Day we"]
[Site "North Sydney"]
[Date "2004.??.??"]
[Round "4"]
[White "Mendes da Costa, Alex"]
[Black "Tracy, Michael"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "C51"]
[PlyCount "49"]
[EventDate "2004.??.??"]

1. e4 Nc6 2. Nf3 e5 3. Bc4 Bc5 4. b4 Bxb4 5. c3 Bc5 6. d4 exd4 7. O-O h6 8.cxd4 Bb6 9. Nc3 d6 10. Re1 Nge7 11. Ba3 O-O 12. Bb3 Bg4 13. Ne2 Bxf3 14. gxf3 Kh8 15. Qd3 f5 16. Rad1 f4 17. Kh1 Ng6 18. Bc2 Nh4 19. Rg1 h5 20. Qb5 Qe8 21. Qg5 Qe7 22. Qxh5+ Kg8 23. Bb3+ Rf7 24. Rxg7+ Kxg7 25. Rg1+ 1-0

FM Jones held to a draw.

[Event "NSWCA Aust Day we"]
[Site "North Sydney"]
[Date "2004.??.??"]
[Round "2"]
[White "Tomac, J."]
[Black "Jones, Lee"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "B01"]
[PlyCount "53"]
[EventDate "2004.??.??"]

1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Nf6 3. d4 Nxd5 4. Nf3 Bg4 5. Be2 e6 6. O-O Be7 7. Ne5 Bxe2 8. Qxe2 O-O 9. c4 Nf6 10. Rd1 c6 11. Nc3 Qa5 12. Bg5 h6 13. Bh4 a6 14. Rd3 b5 15. Rg3 Kh8 16. Bxf6 Bxf6 17. Qh5 Ra7 18. Ng4 Bg5 19. Ne5 Qd8 20. Ne4 Bf4 21. Rf3 Bxe5 22. dxe5 Rd7 23. Rf6 Kh7 24. Rxh6+ gxh6 25. Nf6+ Kg7 26. Qg4+ Kh8 27. Qh5 1/2-1/2

And one I promised earlier. Not actually the Muzio but the so called Hammpe-Allgeair (sp?). Scary stuff. Black missed mate somewhere there.

[Event "NSWCA Aust Day we"]
[Site "North Sydney"]
[Date "2004.??.??"]
[Round "2"]
[White "Peters, Duncan"]
[Black "Keuning, Anthony"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "C25"]
[PlyCount "122"]
[EventDate "2004.??.??"]

1. e4 e5 2. Nc3 Nc6 3. f4 exf4 4. Nf3 g5 5. h4 g4 6. Ng5 h6 7. Nxf7 Kxf7 8. Bc4+ d5 9. Bxd5+ Ke8 10. d4 Bd6 11. e5 Bb4 12. Bxc6+ bxc6 13. Bxf4 Bxc3+ 14. bxc3 Be6 15. g3 Bd5 16. Qxg4 Bxh1 17. Qg7 Qd5 18. Qxh8 Qe4+ 19. Kd2 Qg2+ 20. Kd1 Qf3+ 21. Kd2 Qg2+ 22. Kd1 Qf3+ 23. Kd2 Qg2+ 24. Ke1 Qe4+ 25. Kf1 Qf3+ 26. Ke1 Qxc3+ 27. Ke2 Qxc2+ 28. Bd2 Qc4+ 29. Ke3 Bd5 30. Qg7 Ne7 31. Qh8+ Bg8 32. Re1 Kd7 33. Qg7 Bf7 34. Kf2 Qxd4+ 35. Be3 Qd5 36. Bxh6 Rg8 37. Qf6 Rg6 38. Qf4 Qxa2+ 39. Re2 Qe6 40. Bg5 Nd5 41. Rd2 Ke8 42. Qa4 Qxe5 43. Qxa7 Qf5+ 44. Kg2 Qe4+ 45. Kh2 Rg8 46. Bf4 Qe7 47. Qa6 Kd7 48. Rc2 Nb4 49. Rd2+ Bd5 50. Qb7 Rc8 51. Qa7 Qe4 52. Kh3 Qh1+ 53. Kg4 Rg8+ 54. Kh5 Qf3+ 55. Kh6 Rc8 56. Qd4 Qg4 57. Qg7+ Qxg7+ 58. Kxg7 Rg8+ 59. Kf6 Rf8+ 60. Kg7 Rf7+ 61. Kg6 Rf8 1/2-1/2

arosar
26-01-2004, 02:41 PM
And last one. Could black have drawn?

[Event "NSWCA Aust Day we"]
[Site "North Sydney"]
[Date "2004.01.24"]
[Round "1"]
[White "Mendes da Costa, Alex"]
[Black "Nguyen, Dominic"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "C50"]
[WhiteElo "1620"]
[BlackElo "692"]
[PlyCount "201"]
[EventDate "2004.??.??"]

1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 h6 4. O-O Nf6 5. Re1 g6 6. d4 Qe7 7. b3 d6 8. c3 Bg7 9. b4 O-O 10. d5 Nd8 11. Qc2 b6 12. a4 c5 13. a5 Qc7 14. axb6 Qxb6 15. Be3 Nb7 16. Ra6 Qc7 17. Nbd2 Ng4 18. Rea1 Nxe3 19. fxe3 Nd8 20. R6a3 cxb4 21. cxb4 Bg4 22. Qa2 Bxf3 23. gxf3 Qb6 24. Qb3 f5 25. Ra6 Qc7 26. b5 Rf7 27. Qb4 Bf8 28. b6 Qc5 29. Qxc5 dxc5 30. Rxa7 Rb8 31. Ra8 Rfb7 32. Rxb8 Rxb8 33. Ra6 Bd6 34. Nb3 Nb7 35. exf5 gxf5 36. Bd3 f4 37. exf4 exf4 38. Kg2 Kf7 39. Ra7 Kf6 40. Ba6 Nd8 41. b7 Ke5 42. Na5 Kxd5 43. Bc4+ Ke5 44. Kf2 Kd4 45. Ba2 Bc7 46. Nb3+ Kd5 47. Ke2 Kc6 48. Ra6+ Bb6 49. Na5+ Kc7 50. Bd5 Bxa5 51. Rxa5 Kb6 52. Ra8 Kc7 53. Ra5 Kb6 54. Ra4 Nxb7 55. Rxf4 Re8+ 56. Kf2 Rc8 57. Rf6+ Ka7 58. Rxh6 c4 59. Rc6 Rxc6 60. Bxc6 c3 61. Be4 Nc5 62. Bc2 Kb6 63. h4 Nd7 64. h5 Ne5 65. Ke3 Kc5 66. h6 Nf7 67. h7 Nh8 68. Kd3 Kd5 69. Kxc3 Ke5 70. Kc4 Kf6 71. Kd5 Nf7 72. f4 Ke7 73. Bg6 Nh8 74. Bh5 Kf6 75. Bf3 Kf5 76. Kd6 Kf6 77. Be4 Nf7+ 78. Kd7 Nh8 79. Ke8 Kg7 80. Ke7 Nf7 81. f5 Ng5 82. f6+ Kh8 83. Bg6 Ne6 84. f7 Nf8 85. Bf5 Kg7 86. Be4 Kh8 87. Bd3 Kg7 88. Bf5 Kh8 89. Kf6 Ng6 90. Ke6 Nf8+ 91. Kd6 Kg7 92. Ke7 Kh8 93. Bg4 Kg7 94. Be2 Nxh7 95. Bd3 Nf8 96. Bf5 Nd7 97. Bxd7 Kh7 98. Bf5+ Kh6 99. f8=Q+ Kh5 100. Qg7 Kh4 101. Qg4# 1-0

AR

skip to my lou
26-01-2004, 02:43 PM
Arosar, use the PGN function:

[Event "NSWCA Aust Day we"]
[Site "North Sydney"]
[Date "2004.01.24"]
[Round "1"]
[White "Mendes da Costa, Alex"]
[Black "Nguyen, Dominic"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "C50"]
[WhiteElo "1620"]
[BlackElo "692"]
[PlyCount "201"]
[EventDate "2004.??.??"]

1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 h6 4. O-O Nf6 5. Re1 g6 6. d4 Qe7 7. b3 d6 8. c3 Bg7 9. b4 O-O 10. d5 Nd8 11. Qc2 b6 12. a4 c5 13. a5 Qc7 14. axb6 Qxb6 15. Be3 Nb7 16. Ra6 Qc7 17. Nbd2 Ng4 18. Rea1 Nxe3 19. fxe3 Nd8 20. R6a3 cxb4 21. cxb4 Bg4 22. Qa2 Bxf3 23. gxf3 Qb6 24. Qb3 f5 25. Ra6 Qc7 26. b5 Rf7 27. Qb4 Bf8 28. b6 Qc5 29. Qxc5 dxc5 30. Rxa7 Rb8 31. Ra8 Rfb7 32. Rxb8 Rxb8 33. Ra6 Bd6 34. Nb3 Nb7 35. exf5 gxf5 36. Bd3 f4 37. exf4 exf4 38. Kg2 Kf7 39. Ra7 Kf6 40. Ba6 Nd8 41. b7 Ke5 42. Na5 Kxd5 43. Bc4+ Ke5 44. Kf2 Kd4 45. Ba2 Bc7 46. Nb3+ Kd5 47. Ke2 Kc6 48. Ra6+ Bb6 49. Na5+ Kc7 50. Bd5 Bxa5 51. Rxa5 Kb6 52. Ra8 Kc7 53. Ra5 Kb6 54. Ra4 Nxb7 55. Rxf4 Re8+ 56. Kf2 Rc8 57. Rf6+ Ka7 58. Rxh6 c4 59. Rc6 Rxc6 60. Bxc6 c3 61. Be4 Nc5 62. Bc2 Kb6 63. h4 Nd7 64. h5 Ne5 65. Ke3 Kc5 66. h6 Nf7 67. h7 Nh8 68. Kd3 Kd5 69. Kxc3 Ke5 70. Kc4 Kf6 71. Kd5 Nf7 72. f4 Ke7 73. Bg6 Nh8 74. Bh5 Kf6 75. Bf3 Kf5 76. Kd6 Kf6 77. Be4 Nf7+ 78. Kd7 Nh8 79. Ke8 Kg7 80. Ke7 Nf7 81. f5 Ng5 82. f6+ Kh8 83. Bg6 Ne6 84. f7 Nf8 85. Bf5 Kg7 86. Be4 Kh8 87. Bd3 Kg7 88. Bf5 Kh8 89. Kf6 Ng6 90. Ke6 Nf8+ 91. Kd6 Kg7 92. Ke7 Kh8 93. Bg4 Kg7 94. Be2 Nxh7 95. Bd3 Nf8 96. Bf5 Nd7 97. Bxd7 Kh7 98. Bf5+ Kh6 99. f8=Q+ Kh5 100. Qg7 Kh4 101. Qg4# 1-0

arosar
26-01-2004, 02:43 PM
I dunno how, yet.

AR

skip to my lou
26-01-2004, 02:46 PM
Get rid of all \n, i.e try and get everything on one line, then look at http://www.chesschat.org/viewtopic.php?t=131

Basically its [code:1][pgn]moves (no headers)[/pgn][/code:1]

Kevin Bonham
26-01-2004, 03:08 PM
There were no disputes; my most difficult tasks were explaining some laws of chess to juniors, and explaining to one young boy's father why a FIDE-rated tournament with 4 hour playing sessions is not the best choice for his boy, who has never played a chess tournament of any description in his life. Some examples of this young lad's indiscretions:
- talking to opponents during games
- talking to players seated next to him during games
- talking to himself as he plays through his game, still at the table, an hour after his game
-not recording moves
- refusing to resign, instead insisting the game is a draw because "i'm stuck" [really]
- making two moves in a row whilst his opponent is in the bathroom
- withdrawing moves during games
- refusing to agree to the 'touch move' rule

Wowee. That's some catalogue.

Did he actually finish the tournament or did you persuade his father to withdraw him just in case it found a way to get worse? :shock:

skip to my lou
26-01-2004, 03:11 PM
:D

jase
26-01-2004, 10:05 PM
I was so tired by the end of the tournament I can't recall the finishing time. Weleft the club at 12:30am - working backwards, I would guess the last game finished around 10:30pm, and the presentation was at 11pm. We got to the bar dowstairs about 11:30pm.

The young player played the entire tournament. I provided his father with extensive information about the NSW Junior Chess League, and strongly encouraged him to let his boy 'find his feet' there.

Bill Gletsos
27-01-2004, 03:42 PM
Here is the cross table.


1 Xie, George NSW 2239 5.5 53:W 40:W 16:W 4:D 6:W 10:W
2 Lubarsky, Kostia NSW 1875 5 22:W 23:L 34:W 13:W 8:W 4:W
3 Harp, Joel NSW 1845 5 39:W 37:W 4:L 23:W 9:W 15:W
4 Seberry, Ralph B NSW 2172 4.5 31:W 17:W 3:W 1:D 7:W 2:L
5 Charles, Gareth NSW 2037 4.5 30:W 13:D 18:W 9:W 10:L 17:W
6 Peters, Duncan NSW 1887 4.5 34:W 18:D 35:W 11:W 1:L 20:W
7 Bolens, Johny NSW 2004 4.5 46:W 26:W 25:W 0:D 4:L 16:W
8 Tomac, Jack NSW 1676 4 20:W 11:D 12:D 14:W 2:L 29:W
9 Field, Andrew NSW 1595 4 36:W 12:W 14:W 5:L 3:L 25:W
10 Chan, Jason NSW 1883 4 29:W 35:D 13:D 26:W 5:W 1:L
11 Jones, Lee R NSW 2043 4 24:W 8:D 23:W 6:L 12:D 26:W
12 Nowak, Miroslaw NSW 1885 4 41:W 9:L 8:D 35:W 11:D 30:W
13 Clark, Domenic NSW 1636 4 54:W 5:D 10:D 2:L 39:W 27:W
14 Dekic, Biljana NSW 1981 4 28:W 48:W 9:L 8:L 34:W 24:W
15 Morris, Michael NSW 4 23:L 39:W 48:W 40:W 19:W 3:L
16 Dunn, Michael Gl NSW 1872 3.5 38:W 45:W 1:L 31:W 17:D 7:L
17 Yap, Aaron NSW 1768 3.5 27:W 4:L 41:W 43:W 16:D 5:L
18 Keuning, Anthony V NSW 1565 3.5 50:W 6:D 5:L 28:D 22:D 36:W
19 Murray, Bruce D NSW 1845 3.5 33:D 52:D 29:W 30:W 15:L 21:D
20 Adler, Nathan NSW 939 3.5 8:L 28:D 42:W 48:W 24:W 6:L
21 Pobert, Ariyadi NSW 3.5 42:W 25:L 24:L 47:W 23:W 19:D
22 Roberts, Jamie NSW 1354 3.5 2:L 36:D 52:D 49:W 18:D 37:W
23 Jurd, Sebastian NSW 1564 3 15:W 2:W 11:L 3:L 21:L 39:W
24 Greenwood, Norman NSW 1443 3 11:L 46:W 21:W 25:W 20:L 14:L
25 Sewell, Rob NSW 1809 3 32:W 21:W 7:L 24:L 28:W 9:L
26 Mendes da Costa, Alex NSW 1620 3 47:W 7:L 27:W 10:L 41:W 11:L
27 Cohn, Jason NSW 1187 3 17:L 32:W 26:L 45:W 31:W 13:L
28 Hoving, Eliot NSW 1434 3 14:L 20:D 36:W 18:D 25:L 40:W
29 Nguyen, Joseph NSW 1363 3 10:L 49:W 19:L 44:W 40:W 8:L
30 Hor, Stanton NSW 1442 3 5:L 47:W 44:W 19:L 43:W 12:L
31 Went, Lindsay NSW 1447 3 4:L 54:W 37:W 16:L 27:L 43:W
32 Nabulsi, Derek NSW 1488 3 25:L 27:L 54:W 37:L 51:W 41:W
33 Hogan, Terry NSW 1204 3 19:D 42:D 40:L 34:L 44:W 45:W
34 Bisson, Danny Wayne NSW 1413 2.5 6:L 50:W 2:L 33:W 14:L 35:D
35 Bergseng, Erik NSW 1523 2.5 49:W 10:D 6:L 12:L 37:D 34:D
36 Boyce, Jamie NSW 2.5 9:L 22:D 28:L 54:+ 38:W 18:L
37 Adler, David NSW 1064 2.5 52:W 3:L 31:L 32:W 35:D 22:L
38 Baldwin, A(Tony) C NSW 1331 2.5 16:L 44:L 47:D 42:W 36:L 51:W
39 Baker, John A NSW 1298 2 3:L 15:L 51:W 52:+ 13:L 23:L
40 McGregor, Allan NSW 1765 2 43:W 1:L 33:W 15:L 29:L 28:L
41 Tracey, Michael J NSW 1373 2 12:L 51:W 17:L 46:W 26:L 32:L
42 Nichas, John NSW 1494 2 21:L 33:D 20:L 38:L 47:W 46:D
43 Parker, Trent NSW 1181 2 40:L 53:+ 45:W 17:L 30:L 31:L
44 Sands, Roland 2 45:L 38:W 30:L 29:L 33:L 50:W
45 Losh, Gary NSW 1481 2 44:W 16:L 43:L 27:L 49:W 33:L
46 Reese, Peter NSW 1069 2 7:L 24:L 50:W 41:L 48:D 42:D
47 Nguyen, Dominic NSW 692 1.5 26:L 30:L 38:D 21:L 42:L 49:W
48 Katnic, Eddy NSW 1636 1.5 51:W 14:L 15:L 20:L 46:D 0:
49 Nalbandian, Alexander 1 35:L 29:L 0:W 22:L 45:L 47:L
50 Falzon, Glen NSW 1 18:L 34:L 46:L 51:L 0:W 44:L
51 Kemsley, Kevin NSW 918 1 48:L 41:L 39:L 50:W 32:L 38:L
52 Bleyer, Charles NSW 1680 1 37:L 19:D 22:D 39:- 0: 0:
53 Reid, Vaness NSW 1463 0 1:L 43:- 0: 0: 0: 0:
54 Brenner, Perry NSW 936 0 13:L 31:L 32:L 36:- 0: 0:

paulb
27-01-2004, 04:36 PM
Sounds like a good tourney - congrats to all involved.

By the way guys, please remember to pop me an email with any crosstables, games or even just the brief main results for the ACF Bulletin. email broekhuysep@bigpond.com

I can find it here, of course, ... eventually ... after wandering through the witty asides and learned debates ... pondering an insight or two ... enjoying the scenery ... but an email's quicker :)

(thanks Amiel for the games - very useful)

cheers - paulb

Bob1
28-01-2004, 08:10 AM
Btw, if anyone knows Joel Harp, can someone please ask him for his last round game. I couldn't as I had a bus to catch. What a brilliant game that was. Musta been game of the round if not the tourney.

AR
AR
I left a voicemail message for Joel yesterday - haven't heard anything yet.

Trent Parker
28-01-2004, 03:01 PM
Back to the chess ...

Mobile Phone Report: One player [a NSWCA Councillor, no less] incurring the extremeties of my goodwill. In round 4 his phone loudly beeped a message. I couldn't identify the culprit, so it went unchecked. Many in the playing hall were looking around, then looking at me, like "Ooooooh, someone's in [i]trouble". Next round, same beep, and this time I spy the offender fiddling with his pocket! As it was a message rather than a ring tone, I issued a stern warning. [Soft, I know!]
Jason Lyons
IA

I admit this was me. :mad: :o

I have decided that I am going to leave my phone at home in the future as I am a forgetful person especially when I have only had 3 hrs sleep the night before. As it turns out I lost all 3 of my 2nd day games due to the lack of sleep.

chesslover
28-01-2004, 07:10 PM
I have decided that I am going to leave my phone at home in the future as I am a forgetful person especially when I have only had 3 hrs sleep the night before. As it turns out I lost all 3 of my 2nd day games due to the lack of sleep.

poetic justice indeed :p