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Javier Gil
09-05-2005, 07:53 PM
Peter Parr published it today (SMH), Senior International Master Correspondence title.
Congratulations, Stephen! :clap:

I'd like to take this opportunity to say that Stephen is a really talented player. When I won the City of Sydney Championship some 20 years ago, I had to adjourn my game against Fred Flatow. I was sure the position was a dead draw and no matter how much I tried, I couldn't see any way to break my opponent's defences.
Suddenly, Stephen walks by and takes a look at the position, and a few minutes later suggests what seemed like a really silly idea: letting my opponent's rook become very active. With a "what are you doing????" look in my face, I told him that the whole thing looked very suspicious. Stephen, very patiently, showed me the brilliant trick: by activating his rook, a couple of moves later (and that's what made it so hard to see) my own rook could get into the enemy's position. I couldn't believe it!! :uhoh:
Needless to say, that's exactly what happened in the game.
I'm sure Stephen had nothing against good old Fred, and would have behaved exactly the same if it had been me the victim.

Unfortunately, I lost a bag with most of the games I played in those days, and I don't think Fred will still have it. :(

Trent Parker
09-05-2005, 11:59 PM
Slightly off topic But... :uhoh:

Your Sig says you'll be back April 6

Are you in Sydney yet?

Will we be seeing you at any tourneys?

antichrist
10-05-2005, 12:41 AM
Peter Parr published it today (SMH), Senior International Master Correspondence title.
Congratulations, Stephen! :clap:

I'd like to take this opportunity to say that Stephen is a really talented player. When I won the City of Sydney Championship some 20 years ago, I had to adjourn my game against Fred Flatow. I was sure the position was a dead draw and no matter how much I tried, I couldn't see any way to break my opponent's defences.
Suddenly, Stephen walks by and takes a look at the position, and a few minutes later suggests what seemed like a really silly idea: letting my opponent's rook become very active. With a "what are you doing????" look in my face, I told him that the whole thing looked very suspicious. Stephen, very patiently, showed me the brilliant trick: by activating his rook, a couple of moves later (and that's what made it so hard to see) my own rook could get into the enemy's position. I couldn't believe it!! :uhoh:
Needless to say, that's exactly what happened in the game.
I'm sure Stephen had nothing against good old Fred, and would have behaved exactly the same if it had been me the victim.

Unfortunately, I lost a bag with most of the games I played in those days, and I don't think Fred will still have it. :(

Hey dude, is it legal getting outside help??

Rincewind
10-05-2005, 02:00 AM
Hey dude, is it legal getting outside help??

Yes, AC. It happened al the time. Even in conservative Lebo villages.

antichrist
10-05-2005, 02:21 AM
Yes, AC. It happened al the time. Even in conservative Lebo villages.

RWIPI 8.5
They play glorified Ludo (backgammon) over there in the village. But Lebo was the first country in Middle-East to register with FIDE, about 50 years ago.

One of those Soviet women married a guy in village close to mine and represents Leboland. My village proudly boasts that every square inch of their land is still owned by our village people.

If you looked at that site, when they bought their winter village hundreds of years ago the goat droppings had to go back to the seller. I did not know it made good manure.

Very in thread this post.

EGOR
10-05-2005, 05:38 AM
Hey dude, is it legal getting outside help??

It was ok because it was an adjourned game. You could ask anybody about your adjourned games, the Soviates used to gang up on people that way.

antichrist
10-05-2005, 08:44 AM
It was ok because it was an adjourned game. You could ask anybody about your adjourned games, the Soviates used to gang up on people that way.

It is only adjourned, not a new game. As stated last night, they should be locked up like jurymen and not be allowed to consult any chess whatsoever.

Maybe your opponent is about to trap involved with the relevant opening, you don't know about it, but read up on it overnight and escape. Totally unfair. Everything should be equal just as when left the board.

And what about if your opponent is Bill, who at this time people would not give the time of day to, outsiders may deliberately give him bad advice.

Rincewind
10-05-2005, 08:59 AM
It is only adjourned, not a new game. As stated last night, they should be locked up like jurymen and not be allowed to consult any chess whatsoever.

Maybe your opponent is about to trap involved with the relevant opening, you don't know about it, but read up on it overnight and escape. Totally unfair. Everything should be equal just as when left the board.

I think everyone gets it except you.

Ian Rout
10-05-2005, 09:06 AM
Younger readers might not have heard of adjournments. Up to about the early 1990s games would be played for the scheduled session and then adjourned.

Initially players were not allowed to look at adjourned positions, much less get assistance from other players. However it eventually became apparent that this was unenforceable so it merely penalised the honest. By allowing open slather a more level playing field was created.

More recently adjournments have been abandoned partly because computers made the playing field too level - players could consult engines and databases and come back with perfect analysis.

At the time the game in question was played getting help with adjourned games was entirely legal and acceptable.

antichrist
10-05-2005, 09:28 AM
Younger readers might not have heard of adjournments. Up to about the early 1990s games would be played for the scheduled session and then adjourned.

Initially players were not allowed to look at adjourned positions, much less get assistance from other players. However it eventually became apparent that this was unenforceable so it merely penalised the honest. By allowing open slather a more level playing field was created.

More recently adjournments have been abandoned partly because computers made the playing field too level - players could consult engines and databases and come back with perfect analysis.

At the time the game in question was played getting help with adjourned games was entirely legal and acceptable.

If this occurred in OZ at a time when there was only one grandmaster or a famous visiting player, the quality of help one may obtain may be greatly unequal well is very unfair.

Ian Rout
10-05-2005, 09:32 AM
If this occurred in OZ at a time when there was only one grandmaster or a famous visiting player, the quality of help one may obtain may be greatly unequal well is very unfair.
Arguably so. However it's a little late to be worrying about it now. Those were the rules then, and adjournments don't happen at all now.

Javier Gil
11-05-2005, 08:35 AM
Are you in Sydney yet?
Will we be seeing you at any tourneys?


Hi Chess nut!
Yes, I am.
As for tournaments, I wont be playing much, but I hope I can visit some and greet the old friends. :)

Rhubarb
11-05-2005, 08:46 AM
The talented Kerr may well have the ability to become Australia's first CC Grandmaster. He has an uncanny ability to out-think machines, if and when necessary, combined with a natural analytical proficiency.

rob
11-05-2005, 02:56 PM
Arguably so. However it's a little late to be worrying about it now. Those were the rules then, and adjournments don't happen at all now.
Not quite correct. In WA the Midland Masters (MM) & Midland Challengers have had adjournments each year (1995-2005). The MM used to be the top rated event in WA. Currently the MM first time control is 40/105 to allow play from 7.30 to 11.00pm. Haydn Barber and other top WA players are big fans of slower chess (for improved quality) and if ppl go away and study their adjournmed positions it should benefit their chess.

Also, the WA State Championship had adjournments up until & including 2003. If we hadn't been able to get away from the demanding 3 rounds a week: Wednesday, Saturday, Sunday (plus adj) format we'd have still have adjournements. Fortunately sanity prevailed last year & this year so the State Ch is one round per week from 1pm on Sundays :)

Ian Rout
11-05-2005, 03:03 PM
I stand corrected.

Do the same rules still apply for adjournments; that is, that players may analyse and consult books, computers and GM friends during the adjournment?

Bill Gletsos
11-05-2005, 03:58 PM
The talented Kerr may well have the ability to become Australia's first CC Grandmaster. He has an uncanny ability to out-think machines, if and when necessary, combined with a natural analytical proficiency.No doubt Greg you are going by Peter's comments in the article and there by believe that Steve would be our first CC Grandmaster.
Unfortunately Peters comment in the article where he says (no Grandmasters) is unclear.
What I suspect Peter meant was that Australia currently has no living CC Grandmaster but even that appears to be incorrect.
Cecil Purdy was Australia's first CC Grandmaster.
The ICCF web site lists Cecil Purdy as having obtained the GM title in 1959.

Bill Gletsos
11-05-2005, 04:11 PM
In fact the ICCF web site shows the following as being Australian CC GM's.

Cecil Purdy in 1959
Lucius Endzelins in 1959
Romanas Arlauskas in 1965

with the first two shown as being deceased.

Endzelins represented Australia and came =2nd in the 2nd CC World Championship (started in 1956 - ended in 1959) 0.5 point behind the winner.

Arlauskas represented Australia and came 3rd in the 4th CC World Championship (started in 1962 - ended in 1965) 2 points behind the winner.

Oepty
11-05-2005, 06:46 PM
I believe Romanus Arlauskas is still alive and lives quite near Robin Wedding who has played some games with him. He hasn't played correspondance chess since 1965. I don't when he last played over the board, but I think he considered playing in the last Australian Seniors championships in Adelaide but decided that it would be too much for him.
Scott

Bill Gletsos
11-05-2005, 07:20 PM
I believe Romanus Arlauskas is still alive and lives quite near Robin Wedding who has played some games with him. He hasn't played correspondance chess since 1965. I don't when he last played over the board, but I think he considered playing in the last Australian Seniors championships in Adelaide but decided that it would be too much for him.
ScottThe ACF rating system shows him as having last played back in Dec 1990. The March 2005 ACF master file shows him rated as 2138??

Rhubarb
12-05-2005, 10:13 AM
No doubt Greg you are going by Peter's comments in the article and there by believe that Steve would be our first CC Grandmaster.Okay, what I said is wrong. Actually, I can't remember what Sutek himself told me about a year ago. It might have been something like he'd like to become the first Australian CC GM through norms.

eclectic
12-05-2005, 04:49 PM
Okay, what I said is wrong. Actually, I can't remember what Sutek himself told me about a year ago. It might have been something like he'd like to become the first Australian CC GM through norms.


Cecil Purdy was Australia's first CC Grandmaster.
The ICCF web site lists Cecil Purdy as having obtained the GM title in 1959.

and now from
http://www.chesschat.org/showpost.php?p=49437&postcount=63


Now my good mate eclectic, I thought I'd just done a pretty good hatchet job on the ill-informed crap that had infested this thread since ... since it started ... and now you try and reignite the bullshit.

Purdy's achievements are well documented. But when you refer to "purdy[sic] as a correspondence chess grandmaster("my emphasis - eclectic)" it disqualifies you from all intelligent comment. STFU.

P.S. You're trying too hard now.

now my good mate kegless, perhaps a "retraction" of sorts and an apology are in order ...

:whistle:

;)

eclectic

Rhubarb
12-05-2005, 06:22 PM
now my good mate kegless, perhaps a "retraction" of sorts and an apology are in order ...My good mate electic, you can have an apology for the tone (in fact I tried to PM you at the time, but you weren't accepting PMs) but I'll refrain from a retraction on a technicality. Titles are awarded "for life" and do not apply to the deceased.

EDIT: Just tried to send the same PM, which I saved, but eclectic still is not accepting PMs. This is an interesting twist. Eclectic sends me a PM then apparently disables PM capability so I cannot reply. I may post my reply publicly (after editing out all the eclectic quotes, of course).

Rhubarb
12-05-2005, 06:48 PM
Just spoken to Sutek and he confirmed what he told me a year ago. He was of course well aware of the three CC GMs but said he would like to become a GM through norms, rather than automatic qualification through the WC system.

EDIT: Perhaps I should make this even clearer. Steve said that if he were to become a CC GM, he would likely do it via norms. He also mentioned that he was aware of the high achievements of the three Australian CC GMs, who had spent the better part of a decade just qualifying for a WC final berth, and then another five years or more obtaining a high finish.

eclectic
13-05-2005, 12:04 AM
My good mate electic, you can have an apology for the tone (in fact I tried to PM you at the time, but you weren't accepting PMs) but I'll refrain from a retraction on a technicality. Titles are awarded "for life" and do not apply to the deceased.


i don't think we strip GM titles off people once they die do we?
t'would seem a bit callous plus there'd be a lot a database editing to do

i thought it was that titles were not awarded posthumously
except perhaps under exceptional circumstances

eclectic

Ian Rout
13-05-2005, 09:08 AM
In correspondence chess a player might have died before it is known that they have won a tournament; in such circumstances I expect (though I don't know for sure) that they would award any GM title that comes with it. Even in OTB a player could qualify but die before the meeting which officially endorses a title.

Maybe somebody like Edward Winter has a list of GM titles awarded posthumously, if not then he should.

This is not really on the topic, but mildly connected so I'll relate it for the amusement of those unfamiliar with it (and hope my slightly hazy memory of the circumstances is right):

Some years back the director of the European CC Championship announced that a player had won the event since remaining games could at best allow another player to catch him but that player would lose the tie-break in all scenarios. Subsequently it was discovered that this was not quite right, as the other player came equal first but in fact had a better tie-break. In the meantime, though, the first player had died with the satisfaction of believing himself to be the Champion; perhaps having achieved that goal he had nothing left to live for.

Aaron Bellette
14-06-2005, 03:42 PM
Given that this thread is about the attainment of CC master titles, and the CC-SIM title in particular, congratulations should also go to Garry Benson, who becomes the fourth Australian to attain the CC-SIM title, alongside Max Salm, Tim Runting, and Steve Kerr.

Well done Garry! :clap:

AB

Rhubarb
29-07-2005, 08:25 PM
The word from the Sutek is that he's about to get his first CC GM norm (http://www.iccf-webchess.com/EventCrossTable.aspx?id=72). He pulled off a difficult save in his second last game to draw and now needs just a draw from his final game, in which he has a much better endgame.

Rhubarb
13-09-2005, 08:32 PM
Sutek (Stephen Kerr) has scored his first correspondence grandmaster norm.

Playing on board 1 for Chess Allies in the International Correspondence Chess League's Champions League, our hero eschewed the proffered draw that would have guaranteed the norm, and went on to win his last game. Crosstable here (http://www.iccf-webchess.com/EventCrossTable.aspx?id=72).

Just as a note of interest, I though I'd give my own thoughts on modern correspondence. Humanity's not completely dead in the face of the silicon onslaught, at least not in the long-play form of chess. Computer "operators" (I forget the CC term, which is equally disparaging), who buy all the latest software and run it on their fastest machines, still can't seem to get above about 2100 strength.

While good software and hardware certainly helps and is a practical reality, it takes a peculiar combination of chess understanding, analytical capability (to beat the horizon level sometimes) and, of course, patience to succeed at the GM level.

PHAT
13-09-2005, 11:54 PM
Sutek (Stephen Kerr) has scored his first correspondence grandmaster norm.


:clap:

Congrats, Mr Kerr.

FM_Bill
05-10-2005, 11:23 PM
Kegless,

its not possible Stephen could become Ozs first cc GM.

C.J.S Purdy was the the first CC world champion. I think there there may have been other Oz CC GMs, Kellner, Endelzins, Max Salm come to mind.

I think the previous 3 have come in the top 5 or close in the world.

Bill Gletsos
06-10-2005, 12:00 AM
Kegless,

its not possible Stephen could become Ozs first cc GM.

C.J.S Purdy was the the first CC world champion. I think there there may have been other Oz CC GMs, Kellner, Endelzins, Max Salm come to mind.

I think the previous 3 have come in the top 5 or close in the world.This was discussed earlier in the thread.
According to the ICCF web site Kellner and Salm are not CC GM's.
Salm is a CC Senior IM awarded in 1999.
Kellener was a CC IM awarded in 1968.

Steve would be the first Australian to get the CC GM title via 'norm' qualification.