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Spiny Norman
27-04-2005, 03:36 PM
OK, I'll kick things off .... hmmmm .... how about:

1.b4

just to make things interesting. I've never tried to play the Orang-Utan before, so this might be a bit of fun...

ElevatorEscapee
28-04-2005, 06:30 PM
*EE experiences the following internal monologue prior to his first move.

Ah, up to monkey business right from the start. I've always thought that White was saying "welcome to the jungle" when he plays that as a first move. (Oh great, now I'll have that song going through my head for the whole game!)

I think I remember this opening. If Black plays the 'natural' moves 1... e5 2.Bb2 Nc6? (this looks like a good move as it 1) develops a piece, 2) defends Black's attacked pawn on e5 and 3) attacks White's own undefended pawn on b4. Black reasons that if a move that does two things at once is considered good, then a move that does three things at once must be even better!

Then he runs into the continuation 3.b5 (uh-oh, knight's attacked, better move it) 3... Nd4 (blocking the e5 pawn from capture by the bishop and attacking the undefended pawn on b5 ... again a move with multiple purpose, therefore it must be good!). 4.e3 (uh-oh, knight is attacked again and can't now take the pawn on b5 because the Bishop on f1 defends it.) Poor Black, if only he could find a move that defended both the knight and pawn at the same time he would be ok.

I think the moral of this variation is that moves that do two things at once are good, but beware of moves that do three things at once.

:hmm: I don't think I'll go into that line, as I have a sneaking suspicion that my opponent might be aware of it... :uhoh:

Better do something conservative instead:

My first move is: 1... c6

(I wonder if anything like that ever went through Bronstein's mind in one of his marathon thinks over his first move).

Spiny Norman
29-04-2005, 10:55 PM
Thanks for the inner monologue (did I say that out loud just now?). ;) Conservative eh? Mmmm, sounds plausible. I'll stick to the script:

2.Bb2

ElevatorEscapee
30-04-2005, 02:17 AM
2... a5

Weee! Here we go!

Spiny Norman
30-04-2005, 10:36 AM
Oh my wordy Lordy yes Janelle .... Mmmmmmm .... threatening to liquidate my beloved B-pawn. Does wickedness know no bounds??? OK, I'm up for some fun.

3.e4


Event: Correspondence Game
Site: Chess Chat Bulletin Board
Date: 27/04/2005
White: Frosty
Black: ElevatorEscapee
Result: TBA
ECO: A00
1.b4 c6 2.Bb2 a5! 3.e4?!

ElevatorEscapee
30-04-2005, 01:22 PM
Snatch!!!

3... axb4

Spiny Norman
30-04-2005, 01:34 PM
Don't worry about the pawn, don't worry about the pawn, don't worry about the pawn .... <deep breathing exercises> ... develop your pieces, control the centre, protect your king ...

4.Bc4

Spiny Norman
30-04-2005, 05:26 PM
Just got a PM from EE ... he has been getting "Error 404" messages trying to post his next move. No idea why he can't post that whereas he can send to me via PM alright. Anyway, EE wrote:

' "Attack at once! Attack everywhere! and if you fail, attack again!", Stalin's orders to his troops just before 40 divisions of Siberian soldiers were removed from the front against the Japanese and brought into the war against the Nazis.)

Attack!

4... d5 ;)

Spiny Norman
30-04-2005, 05:49 PM
Interesting ... now I'm getting errors trying to post ... maybe the server is undergoing a DoS attack again??? Anyway, mustn't lose my nerve now:

5.exd4

I'm on the road tomorrow, driving to Canberra, then again on Monday up to Sydney, so I'll probably not be on the board much over that timeframe.

ElevatorEscapee
30-04-2005, 09:43 PM
Erm,

J'adoube

*picks up Frotsy's pawn from e4 and instead of placing it on d4, places it on d5 and removes his own pawn on that square.

5... cxd5

ElevatorEscapee
03-05-2005, 10:58 PM
Whilst Frosty takes his time thinking over his next move, EE starts singing softly to himself... just loud enough for Frosty to hear, but no one else...

"Don't tell my heart, my achy breaky heart, I just don't think he'd understand... and if you tell my heart, my achy breaky heart, he might blow up and kill this man!".

EE chuckles to himself, "Heh heh heh, he will have that horrible song repeating through his brain for the rest of the game! Beware my weapons of Music Distraction!"

Spiny Norman
08-05-2005, 05:24 PM
I'm back @ home. Sorry for the long delay, but Sydney was a LOT busier than I expected and I had no time at all to look in on the board. The move I was trying to post before I left was:

6.Bb5+

but unfortunately my ADSL link was down-and-out last Sunday morning. Anyway, there it is ...

ElevatorEscapee
12-05-2005, 06:45 PM
6... Nc6

Spiny Norman
13-05-2005, 07:33 AM
Sorry ... I'm stuck with a huge work commitment ... we've had a break-in and some of our computer equipment has been "sabotaged". I'll reply at the weekend ...

ElevatorEscapee
13-05-2005, 08:22 PM
Okies... no pressure.

Congratulations by the way on avoiding the "book trap" in this line. ;-)

Spiny Norman
13-05-2005, 08:35 PM
Okies... no pressure.
Congratulations by the way on avoiding the "book trap" in this line. ;-)

Mate, I didn't know there was one! :eek: You can show me at the end of the game mebbe. Hmm, I'd better make a move .... thinking .... thinking .... okay, lets try:

7.Nf3

ElevatorEscapee
13-05-2005, 08:56 PM
Yeah, thought ya might play that one... (mainly because it was the one I would have played myself !;))

In any case my answer is:

7. ... Nf6

Spiny Norman
14-05-2005, 01:07 PM
8. 0-0

ElevatorEscapee
15-05-2005, 11:16 AM
8... g6

Spiny Norman
15-05-2005, 05:53 PM
9.Re1

ElevatorEscapee
15-05-2005, 08:30 PM
9... Bg7

Spiny Norman
16-05-2005, 07:44 PM
9... Bg7

This is starting to get interesting. I've spent a while tonight looking at the following:

a3 ... targeting your annoying pawn on b4
a4 ... perhaps the possibility of a passed pawn if I swap off the knight on c6
c3 ... trying to develop the knight on c3 and liquidating the pawn
c4 ... mixing things up in the centre (not convinced about this one at all)
Qe2 ... more pressure through the centre

Nothing else looks particularly interesting. I've finally settled on: 10.a3

Putting the question to you ... are you going to let me have my pawn back now, or are you going to hang on to it for a while (perhaps forever)?


1.b4 c6 2.Bb2 a5!? 3.e4?! axb4 4.Bc4 d5 5.exd5 cxd5
6.Bb5+ Nc6 7.Nf3 Nf6 8.O-O g6 9.Re1 Bg7 10.a3

ElevatorEscapee
17-05-2005, 08:26 PM
Yes, a very interesting choice, I had only considered Qe2 and c3 as your alternatives. Obviously if I capture on a3, and you recapture with your bishop, it will place more pressure on my e7 pawn.

Please bear with me if I take a couple of days to respond. [Sorry, I have a club championship game tomorrow night :)].

Spiny Norman
22-05-2005, 08:20 AM
Yes, a very interesting choice, I had only considered Qe2 and c3 as your alternatives. Obviously if I capture on a3, and you recapture with your bishop, it will place more pressure on my e7 pawn.

Please bear with me if I take a couple of days to respond. [Sorry, I have a club championship game tomorrow night :)].

Not a problem. I had to play on Thursday myself. Lost badly. Very badly. I need to do more preparation obviously!

ElevatorEscapee
22-05-2005, 01:06 PM
Sad to hear that Frosty, I won my game (my opponent actually showed up 57 minutes late, narrowly avoiding forfeiting by 3 minutes, then proceeded to set up a decent position. However, he struggled under time pressure later in the game.)

Now back to our game, my next move is:

10... 0-0

Spiny Norman
23-05-2005, 07:43 AM
11.Bxc6

ElevatorEscapee
23-05-2005, 10:53 AM
You were up early this morning. :)

11... bxc6

Spiny Norman
23-05-2005, 06:12 PM
You were up early this morning. :)

I'm often up at 6am ... I do "out of hours" consulting work for Unwired Australia (the portable/wireless broadband provider based in Sydney) ... anywhere from 6am to 8am is my fav. time for catching up with the issue on their bulletin board, researching problems, posting responses, etc.

It also gives me a chance to look at any Chess Chat stuff posted overnight and then I can ponder it during the day @ work.

So ... after having pondered only a little ... and knowing that you're going to call me "chicken":

12.axb4

I simply can't resist the opportunity to grab back that pawn. Now the question becomes "Have I really grabbed it back, or am I kidding myself". Looking back on the start of the game it seems that 'lending' it to you until now was a complete waste of time. I don't think I'd do that again.

ElevatorEscapee
23-05-2005, 08:57 PM
I slept in until 10:00 this morning :) (it was my day off), normally I am up at 7:00am each weekday but have little time to post here until after work.

12... Rxa1

[Yes, I know what your next move is likely to be, but I don't want to offer a conditional as I haven't made up my mind as to my next move after that yet. ;) ]

Spiny Norman
24-05-2005, 07:21 AM
13.Bxa1

That was the easiest decision I've had to make all game I think ... the next move looks interesting. White's queen side is under-developed and the means by which it might be developed is not immediately apparent (few "natural moves" available). The bishop looks a bit out of sorts there on A1.


1.b4 c6 2.Bb2 a5!? 3.e4?! axb4 4.Bc4 d5 5.exd5 cxd5
6.Bb5+ Nc6 7.Nf3 Nf6 8.O-O g6 9.Re1 Bg7 10.a3 0-0
11.Bxc6 bxc6 12.axb4 Rxa1 13.Bxa1

ElevatorEscapee
24-05-2005, 06:05 PM
13... Qb6

I can honestly say I have never experienced a position quite like this in all the games I have played! :)

Spiny Norman
24-05-2005, 07:21 PM
I can honestly say I have never experienced a position quite like this in all the games I have played! :)

Neither have I. Fun, isn't it? :uhoh:

I think I'd better think about things here for a bit. That active queen looks nasty ...

Spiny Norman
24-05-2005, 07:32 PM
I think I'd better think about things here for a bit.

Well, that didn't take long. Bxc3 doesn't look at all natural. Bd4 just gets me into strife I think. c3 is awful ... so ...

14.Rxe7

ElevatorEscapee
24-05-2005, 07:33 PM
Hey, you shouldn't judge women just by their looks! She's as gentle as a lamb, honest! ;) :lol:

[Edit] Ooops! You moved while I was replying!

Here goes:
14... Ne4

Weeee! :lol:

Spiny Norman
24-05-2005, 07:53 PM
Blimey. :doh: I thought you were going to pawn grab on b4! I can't afford to lose a bishop, so:

15.Bxg7

ElevatorEscapee
24-05-2005, 08:38 PM
15... Qxf2+

Conditional: if 16.Kh1 (well it is the only legal move ;)) then 16... Kxg7

Spiny Norman
25-05-2005, 08:46 PM
I'll see your:

15. ... Qxf2+
16. Kh1 Kxg7 (conditionals)

and raise you:

17.Qe1

1.b4 c6 2.Bb2 a5!? 3.e4?! axb4 4.Bc4 d5 5.exd5 cxd5
6.Bb5+ Nc6 7.Nf3 Nf6 8.O-O g6 9.Re1 Bg7 10.a3 0-0
11.Bxc6 bxc6 12.axb4 Rxa1 13.Bxa1 Qb6 14.Rxe7 Ne4 15.Bxg7 Qxf2+
16.Kh1 Kxg7 17.Qe1

ElevatorEscapee
25-05-2005, 10:57 PM
17... Qb6

Have you noticed on the tv Poker that players can "check" as well? ;)

Spiny Norman
27-05-2005, 07:46 PM
"Don't panic Mr Mainwaring, don't panic Mr Mainwaring!"

Hmmm. Can't chase the knight away or I get smashed in the corner. Is it better to be safe than sorry? I'll try:

18.c3

and try to ignore the fact that you can check me to death in the corner with the knight.

ElevatorEscapee
27-05-2005, 08:53 PM
Well, "checking you to death" is hardly an option, as you can escape even a "Purple Check" quite easily from this posi...

I shall have to focus on other means to gain an advantage...

Ok, time to either turn the screws or display that I have a screw loose ;-)

18... Kf6

Psycopathic King!

Spiny Norman
28-05-2005, 08:16 AM
Thought you might play that. :( I've been wondering for a few moves whether that rook might've over-extended itself (thought you might've dropped in Be6 at some stage). Not much choice on offer for me now. Force a grin and sacrifice the exchange.

19.Rxe4

Time for me to offer a conditional I guess.
If 19. ... dxe4 then 20.Qxe4

ElevatorEscapee
28-05-2005, 03:16 PM
Hmmm, I had expected 19.Re5 when 19... Bg4 was quite interesting.

No choice now but:

19... dxe4
20.Qxe4 (threatening 21.Qe5 mate!)

20... Kg7 (my psycopathic king goes yelping back to it's corner...)

Spiny Norman
28-05-2005, 04:54 PM
21.d4

1.b4 c6 2.Bb2 a5!? 3.e4?! axb4 4.Bc4 d5 5.exd5 cxd5
6.Bb5+ Nc6 7.Nf3 Nf6 8.O-O g6 9.Re1 Bg7 10.a3 0-0
11.Bxc6 bxc6 12.axb4 Rxa1 13.Bxa1 Qb6 14.Rxe7 Ne4 15.Bxg7 Qxf2+
16.Kh1 Kxg7 17.Qe1 Qb6 18.c3 Kf6 19.Rxe4?! dxe4 20.Qxe4 Kg7
21.d4

ElevatorEscapee
29-05-2005, 01:12 AM
21... Bf5 (time to move this piece that has thus far been sitting on it's bum all game).

Spiny Norman
29-05-2005, 07:33 AM
22.Qe1 (not much choice about that move methinks)

ElevatorEscapee
29-05-2005, 08:32 PM
22... Ra8

Spiny Norman
30-05-2005, 07:15 AM
Can't afford to let my knight get pinned.

23.Nbd2

Edit: Interesting avatar ... is that the caped crusader?

ElevatorEscapee
30-05-2005, 05:43 PM
23... Qc7

[Yes, it is the Caped Crusader. The graphic was taken from a Commodore 64 game from the late 1980s called "Batman, Caped Crusader". This predated the more modern "movie" Batman of a year or two later. Maybe I should have had him walking the other way... it looks like he is trying to run away from my comments, only to have his escape thwarted by the edge of the screen.]

Spiny Norman
30-05-2005, 07:31 PM
24.Ne5

ElevatorEscapee
30-05-2005, 10:08 PM
24... Ra2

Spiny Norman
31-05-2005, 07:52 AM
Ouch.

25.Kg1

1.b4 c6 2.Bb2 a5!? 3.e4?! axb4 4.Bc4 d5 5.exd5 cxd5
6.Bb5+ Nc6 7.Nf3 Nf6 8.O-O g6 9.Re1 Bg7 10.a3 0-0
11.Bxc6 bxc6 12.axb4 Rxa1 13.Bxa1 Qb6 14.Rxe7 Ne4 15.Bxg7 Qxf2+
16.Kh1 Kxg7 17.Qe1 Qb6 18.c3 Kf6 19.Rxe4?! dxe4 20.Qxe4 Kg7
21.d4 Bf5 22.Qe1 Ra8 23.Nbd2 Qc7 24.Ne5 Ra2 25.Kg1

ElevatorEscapee
31-05-2005, 07:44 PM
25... f6

Spiny Norman
01-06-2005, 07:45 AM
26.Nef3

I imagine that knight's now saying "Well, what'd you send me out for in the first place?" ... the answer to that, unfortunately, is "I have no idea!". But at least your king's position is a little more open now ...

ElevatorEscapee
02-06-2005, 06:40 PM
Exposed! There's that word again...

26... Kf7

(My king exposes himself further... He was psycopathic a few moves ago, now he's just a perv! :lol: )

Spiny Norman
03-06-2005, 09:23 AM
Am at work now (shhhh!) ... will have a look tomorrow at your perverted monarch. In the meantime, despite the tragedy of losing to my kid a few weeks ago, I think the correspondence game practice here & reading of "old books" at home is genuinely paying off. I had my first ever serious win over a 1500+ player last night, using a Queen's Indian style formation as Black (does anyone play that any more?). The games here make me sit down with a board and work through lots of variations. When I get time (not often) I use the "Purdy technique" of writing down all possible moves and examining them at least briefly to see if there's anything in them. I never seem to get time for that OTB, but it certainly helps one's analysis skills I think.

Spiny Norman
03-06-2005, 09:25 AM
Oh, before I forget ... the missus is organising some holiday time to synchronise with the next school holidays. Fair chance I'll be coming up to Toolleen/Bendigo (>50%) at some stage, so I'll be sure to bring you a bottle of the "Dead Horse Hill" regardless of this game's outcome. What night does Bendigo Chess Club meet? Is there a website?

ElevatorEscapee
03-06-2005, 08:00 PM
The Bendigo Chess Club meets on Wednesday nights.

Yes there is a website, but it hasn't been updated for nearly 12 months, as Chris hasn't had the time. However, if you look into it deeply enough you can find directions, a map, and possibly even some scary photos!

Don't trust the old link that Google gives you, latrobe moved servers, try instead: Bendigo Chess Club (http://www.latrobe.edu.au/bendigochess/bcchome.html)

Let me know approximately what dates you might like to show up. (I might be able to get a day off on a Friday depending on the particular week).

In the meantime, my king is lurking behind the pawn on f6, wearing a trench coat and snickering to himself... :eek:

Spiny Norman
03-06-2005, 08:16 PM
Wednesday sounds do-able. I'll check with the social secretary at my end. In the meantime:

27.Nb3 (grimly hanging on ...eyeing an outpost on c5 perhaps, also blocking the rook out of a1)

ElevatorEscapee
04-06-2005, 01:19 PM
27... Rb2

Spiny Norman
05-06-2005, 04:10 PM
28.Nfd2

ElevatorEscapee
06-06-2005, 08:41 AM
28... Rc2

(Slowly the rook creeps across the 7th rank...)

Spiny Norman
06-06-2005, 07:07 PM
(Slowly the rook creeps across the 7th rank...)

... as my knights continue their endless (aimless?) manouvres in the middle of the board ...

29.Nc4

1.b4 c6 2.Bb2 a5!? 3.e4?! axb4 4.Bc4 d5 5.exd5 cxd5
6.Bb5+ Nc6 7.Nf3 Nf6 8.O-O g6 9.Re1 Bg7 10.a3 0-0
11.Bxc6 bxc6 12.axb4 Rxa1 13.Bxa1 Qb6 14.Rxe7 Ne4 15.Bxg7 Qxf2+
16.Kh1 Kxg7 17.Qe1 Qb6 18.c3 Kf6 19.Rxe4?! dxe4 20.Qxe4 Kg7
21.d4 Bf5 22.Qe1 Ra8 23.Nbd2 Qc7 24.Ne5 Ra2 25.Kg1 f6
26.Nef3 Kf7 27.Nb3 Rb2 28.Nfd2 Rc2 29.Nc4

ElevatorEscapee
06-06-2005, 08:15 PM
29... Be6

Spiny Norman
06-06-2005, 09:30 PM
30.Nca5

Spiny Norman
07-06-2005, 06:16 PM
Am tentatively organised for a 1st week of July holiday break ... means I would be in your neck of the woods on Wednesday, 6th July. Will the club be open then perchance? I'll be around @ Toolleen for that whole week, so could catch up another day if preferred ... a coffee, or something stronger, and a couple of rapid games?

ElevatorEscapee
07-06-2005, 06:57 PM
Yes, the club will be open on July 6th, according to the calendar a special event is planned for that night, the like of which is held nowhere else in the world! :lol: (Or at least as far as can be ascertained. ;) )

There are also some plans in early stages of sending a car load of players to a social type chess event on Sunday the 3rd at a winebar in Rushworth, and I have half a day off on Friday the 1st.

Now back to our game.

30... Bd5

Spiny Norman
07-06-2005, 08:04 PM
I'm getting into a bit of a pickle now ...

31.Nd2

ElevatorEscapee
08-06-2005, 05:28 PM
31... Qf4

Spiny Norman
10-06-2005, 06:56 PM
I just came back in here looking for your next move ... and ... couldn't find my last move which I was SURE I had posted (but obviously hadn't!). Anyway, here it is, such as it is:

32.Nab3

I think I am getting rather overloaded looking after all my weak points!

ElevatorEscapee
10-06-2005, 07:15 PM
32... Rxc3

Spiny Norman
10-06-2005, 07:27 PM
That's torn it. The house of cards crumbles. I resign ... well played. :clap:

White: Frosty
Black: ElevatorEscapee
Result: 0-1
ECO: A00
1.b4 c6 2.Bb2 a5!? 3.e4?! axb4 4.Bc4 d5 5.exd5 cxd5
6.Bb5+ Nc6 7.Nf3 Nf6 8.O-O g6 9.Re1 Bg7 10.a3 0-0
11.Bxc6 bxc6 12.axb4 Rxa1 13.Bxa1 Qb6 14.Rxe7 Ne4 15.Bxg7 Qxf2+
16.Kh1 Kxg7 17.Qe1 Qb6 18.c3 Kf6 19.Rxe4?! dxe4 20.Qxe4 Kg7
21.d4 Bf5 22.Qe1 Ra8 23.Nbd2 Qc7 24.Ne5 Ra2 25.Kg1 f6
26.Nef3 Kf7 27.Nb3 Rb2 28.Nfd2 Rc2 29.Nc4 Be6 30.Nca5 Bd5
31.Nd2 Qf4 32.Nab3 Rxc3 0-1

ElevatorEscapee
11-06-2005, 02:35 PM
Dang! I knew I should have put in the conditional move: "if 33. Resigns, then 33... Thanks for the game. "

However that may have been a little too presumptuous. ;)

Thank you also for the game, I have a bottle or two of alcoholic home brew Ginger Beer set aside for your visit.

I first started playing correspondence chess back in 1992, and I too found it beneficial for my overall "over the board" chess game, as it allowed me to focus more deeply on each individual move (and thereby improve my general understanding of the game).

As promised earlier on, the "Book Trap" in the Orangutan* (*there are various different, legitimate English spellings of this word) goes:

1.b4 c6 2.Bb2 a5 3.a3 axb4 4.axb4 Rxa1 5.Bxa1 Qb6 6.Bc3

(White doesn't want to block the long diagonal with a pawn)

6... Na6

(now Black has two pieces bearing down on the b pawn, however White has a trick up his sleeve...)

7.Qc1 Nxb4 8.Qb2

This move serves three purposes:

i) Pinning the knight against the Queen,

ii) doubly attacking the knight

iii) and also doubly attacking Black's g pawn!

A move that does three things at once! It must be good!

However, as we have already learnt in this opening a move that does three things at once only leads to disaster! (Remember my earlier post mentioning this at around move one? ;) ).

8... e6!

Protecting the knight with the unmoved dark squared Bishop... and now if:

9.Bxg7 Bxg7 10.Qxg7 Nxc2+ 11.Kd1 Qxb1 checkmate.

So after eight moves, White's best option is to forgoe the pawn. Which only serves to prove the maxim that one should be wary of moves that do three things at once in the Orangutan. :)

Spiny Norman
11-06-2005, 06:43 PM
Thanks, that's a pretty little trap! I've never felt 100% comfortable with the a3 move in these openings, which is why I went looking for alternatives when you played a5. I have subsequently looked around for some theory on the e4 move, but couldn't find any. Does anyone have a database with games starting with:

1.b4 c6 2.Bb2 a5 3.e4

Anyway, I've also set aside a Dead Horse Hill for you and will come visit in a couple of weeks.

Cheers,

Frosty

Glenno
15-06-2005, 12:53 PM
Does anyone have a database with games starting with 1.b4 c6 2.Bb2 a5 3.e4?

On the website www.chesslab.com there was only one game with the opening moves given.

[Date "1994.??.??"] [White "Grant"] [Black "Gates"] [Result "0-1"] [ECO "A00"] 1. b4 c6 2. Bb2 a5 3. e4 e6 4. b5 d5 5. Nc3 Nd7 6. bxc6 bxc6 7. Qe2 Qb6 8. Rb1 Ba6 9. d3 Bb4 10. exd5 Bxc3+ 11. Bxc3 Qxb1+ 12. Kd2 cxd5 13. Nf3 Rc8 14. Ng5 Rxc3 0-1

Spiny Norman
15-06-2005, 04:39 PM
Good grief ... that's a shocker isn't it! At least I lasted longer than 14 moves. :)

ElevatorEscapee
28-06-2005, 03:25 AM
Yes, Mr Gates can certainly play chess! :cool:

Spiny Norman
05-07-2005, 11:51 AM
Thank you also for the game, I have a bottle or two of alcoholic home brew Ginger Beer set aside for your visit.

I've sourced a bottle of Dead Horse Hill Shiraz 2002 and will bring it with me on Wednesday for you.

ElevatorEscapee
05-07-2005, 07:11 PM
Cool,

I shall endeavour to bring along some bikkies, cheese, dip, etc as well as a bottle of red (and softer drinks for the younger members/visitors). :D