PDA

View Full Version : Was Jesus born with Original Sin?



Gnostic Bishop
19-01-2020, 08:59 AM
Was Jesus born with Original Sin?

If so, then he could not be the perfect sacrifice.

If not, then he had no human side and was pure god, and god cannot die which, makes the sacrifice a lie.

Could these facts be why the Jews have no Original Sin concept in their religion?

Is that also why Jews rejected Jesus as their messiah, or did they just recognize the immorality of anyone using a scapegoat and the abdication of one’s responsibility for their actions, which is against all moral legal systems?

Why have Christians embraced such an immoral and illegal concept?

Regards
DL

antichrist
19-01-2020, 04:06 PM
But isn't the sin of Adam and Eve munching apples that caused all the later shenanigans such as Original Sin in the Old Testament and therefore Hebrewic/Jewish?

Gnostic Bishop
20-01-2020, 05:23 AM
But isn't the sin of Adam and Eve munching apples that caused all the later shenanigans such as Original Sin in the Old Testament and therefore Hebrewic/Jewish?

The apple represents the knowledge of good and evil, which is the knowledge of everything.
I know of nothing that is not subject to the adjectives good or evil.

As to the Jews, the do not have an Original sin concept and see Eden as where both god and man start off the right way with Original Virtue as opposed to Original Sin.

Regards
DL

antichrist
20-01-2020, 05:54 AM
The apple represents the knowledge of good and evil, which is the knowledge of everything.
I know of nothing that is not subject to the adjectives good or evil.

As to the Jews, the do not have an Original sin concept and see Eden as where both god and man start off the right way with Original Virtue as opposed to Original Sin.

Regards
DL

How can NAZISM and the Holocaust can described as good? Any genocide? Unless the culling of the population for environmental reasons is beneficial. How is banning you from a website good?

antichrist
20-01-2020, 06:00 AM
How can the extinction of snails be described as good? Be careful with your reply.

Gnostic Bishop
20-01-2020, 06:10 AM
How can NAZISM and the Holocaust can described as good?

Any genocide?


They cannot. Who tried to justify them?




Unless the culling of the population for environmental reasons is beneficial. How is banning you from a website good?

Culling is for the greater good of the many. Genocide is for the lesser good for the many.

As to your last. Who banned me.

I have been banned, sure, but only by places that could not take the truth.

Regards
DL

Gnostic Bishop
20-01-2020, 06:14 AM
How can the extinction of snails be described as good? Be careful with your reply.

I do not believe that any DNA line should be destroyed completely, even if it is harmful to us.

C D C even keep ebola samples around for experiments and on the more positive side, there may be a DNA sequence out there in someone or something that would be highly beneficial to mankind in the long run.

Perhaps the fountain of youth is a DNA sequence that has yet to be identified, or who knows what else we might have to offer humanity.

Regards
DL

antichrist
20-01-2020, 06:20 AM
Culling is for the greater good of the many. Genocide is for the lesser good for the many.

As to your last. Who banned me.

I have been banned, sure, but only by places that could not take the truth.

Regards
DL

How do Jewish websites handle you? Are you a heretic?

Gnostic Bishop
20-01-2020, 06:35 AM
How do Jewish websites handle you? Are you a heretic?

I do not frequent such a site.

Jews tend to be intelligent when compared to Christians and Muslims and they would mostly agree with my take on things, if the Jews I chat with are any indication.

I see Christians and Muslims as the religions who do most of the damage to society at large. Both of those ban me as they do not like the truth.

Regards
DL

antichrist
20-01-2020, 06:43 AM
I do not frequent such a site.

Jews tend to be intelligent when compared to Christians and Muslims and they would mostly agree with my take on things, if the Jews I chat with are any indication.

I see Christians and Muslims as the religions who do most of the damage to society at large. Both of those ban me as they do not like the truth.

Regards
DL

Well good luck I am sure that Capa Fan and Adamski will agree with you whole heartedly. Visit a few Palestinians websites as well tell them AC sent you.

antichrist
20-01-2020, 06:46 AM
Is an atomic particle existing good or bad?

Gnostic Bishop
20-01-2020, 07:32 AM
Well good luck I am sure that Capa Fan and Adamski will agree with you whole heartedly. Visit a few Palestinians websites as well tell them AC sent you.

I would not know how to find them. I will take links though if you know of an interesting site.

Regards
DL

Gnostic Bishop
20-01-2020, 07:34 AM
Is an atomic particle existing good or bad?

Without them, there would be no us.

Careful buddy. Some might see what you are posting as dementia, if you go too far afield.

Regards
DL

antichrist
20-01-2020, 07:45 AM
Without them, there would be no us.

Careful buddy. Some might see what you are posting as dementia, if you go too far afield.

Regards
DL

If there would be no us then there would be no concept of good and evil and therefore no original sin and so I have stayed on topic and answered the thread's title question. So you can now close the thread.

So I have proven you wrong - not everything has a good or bad quality

Gnostic Bishop
20-01-2020, 07:55 AM
If there would be no us then there would be no concept of good and evil and therefore no original sin and so I have stayed on topic and answered the thread's title question. So you can now close the thread.

So I have proven you wrong - not everything has a good or bad quality

Is that what that was. I just thought you were being a tad strange.

Let me add to my reply then.

I showed the positive above. The negative would be if too many happened to hit you in the same general area or the wrong area of your DNA and you got cancer.

We live in a dualistic universe and all things are subject to good and or evil that I know of.

Regards
DL

antichrist
20-01-2020, 08:41 AM
Is that what that was. I just thought you were being a tad strange.

Let me add to my reply then.

I showed the positive above. The negative would be if too many happened to hit you in the same general area or the wrong area of your DNA and you got cancer.

We live in a dualistic universe and all things are subject to good and or evil that I know of.

Regards
DL

But that is only humans exist. If humans don't exist then everything has neutral value as they would have been before humans evolved. How can the same entity have changing values depending on the existence of an entity that has no relationship to it?

Gnostic Bishop
20-01-2020, 08:59 AM
But that is only humans exist. If humans don't exist then everything has neutral value as they would have been before humans evolved. How can the same entity have changing values depending on the existence of an entity that has no relationship to it?

I can deal with nothing if humans do not exist.

I could not respond to anything.

Anything else I would put would be speculative nonsense.
It would be like me talking of the supernatural, which is also just speculative nonsense.

Regards
DL

antichrist
20-01-2020, 09:46 AM
I can deal with nothing if humans do not exist.

I could not respond to anything.

Anything else I would put would be speculative nonsense.
It would be like me talking of the supernatural, which is also just speculative nonsense.

Regards
DL

There appears to be an inconsistency as to whether an article has a good or evil value or even a neutral value. And it is all the fault of the Christian's and Muslims - do you preferred to be crucified or stoned to death - it is only a relative question?

Gnostic Bishop
20-01-2020, 11:56 PM
There appears to be an inconsistency as to whether an article has a good or evil value or even a neutral value. And it is all the fault of the Christian's and Muslims - do you preferred to be crucified or stoned to death - it is only a relative question?

In duality, and an evolving world, neutral is allowed but likely only temporarily as the issue may be in flux.

Regardless. We live in a dualistic universe and things are either more black or more white and some issues may just be a mix of grey. So many things are subjective and that is where dialog gives abetter view of the color.

Regards
DL

antichrist
21-01-2020, 06:16 AM
In duality, and an evolving world, neutral is allowed but likely only temporarily as the issue may be in flux.

Regardless. We live in a dualistic universe and things are either more black or more white and some issues may just be a mix of grey. So many things are subjective and that is where dialog gives abetter view of the color.

Regards
DL

I don't know about dialogue helping, the missus and I can't agree whether something is blue or green. I thought Jesus did not become god until he was twelve years old, that's if he ever existed of course

Gnostic Bishop
21-01-2020, 07:08 AM
I don't know about dialogue helping, the missus and I can't agree whether something is blue or green. I thought Jesus did not become god until he was twelve years old, that's if he ever existed of course

Here is my, official Gnostic Christian view.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02ciandvg&feature=BFa&list=PLCBF574D

Regards
DL

antichrist
21-01-2020, 07:32 AM
Why is it necessary to have a Christian view of any variety? Get over it. Get out and enjoy yourself you only live once. Chess players have an excuse for our hang ups

Gnostic Bishop
21-01-2020, 07:46 AM
Why is it necessary to have a Christian view of any variety? Get over it. Get out and enjoy yourself you only live once. Chess players have an excuse for our hang ups

So do I. Harm reduction.

Both Christianity and Islam, slave holding ideologies, have basically developed into intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religions. Both religions have grown themselves by the sword instead of good deeds and continue with their immoral ways in spite of secular law showing them the moral ways.

Jesus said we would know his people by their works and deeds. That means Jesus would not recognize Christians and Muslims as his people, and neither do I. Jesus would call Christianity and Islam abominations.

Gnostic Christians did in the past, and I am proudly continuing that tradition and honest irrefutable evaluation based on morality.

https://topdocumentaryfilms.com/theft-values/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxoxPapPxXk

Humanity centered religions, good? Yes. Esoteric ecumenist Gnostic Christianity being the best of these.

Supernaturally based religions, evil? Yes. Islam and Christianity being the worst of these.

Regards
DL

antichrist
21-01-2020, 08:48 AM
But you are talking to someone who doesn't even believe that Jesus existed try changing Capa Fan and Adamski but they are snubbing you. You have to sound less arrogant

Gnostic Bishop
22-01-2020, 01:00 AM
But you are talking to someone who doesn't even believe that Jesus existed try changing Capa Fan and Adamski but they are snubbing you. You have to sound less arrogant

I am snubbed by all those who idol worship a genocidal god that they can somehow see as good and who like to promote a homophobic and misogynous religion.

Their snubbing moral minds is why Christianity is dying.

I will continue to driver their lies and immoral views to invisibility and death all I can.

Regards
DL

Capablanca-Fan
22-01-2020, 01:32 AM
I am snubbed by all those who idol worship a genocidal god that they can somehow see as good and who like to promote a homophobic and misogynous religion.
Christianity doesn't fear the same, and historically has elevated the status of women. In the first few centuries of the church, you could tell where Christianity was influential precisely because girl babies were no longer left to die, and men stuck to one sexual partner.


Their snubbing moral minds is why Christianity is dying.
Not in Africa and Asia. It's no accident that régimes that share your atheopathy, such as Communist China, must use persecution not persuasion to try to stifle Christianity. Even in the west, the dying churches are the theologically liberal ones who deny biblical authority and push much of the same PC nonsense you do. The theologically conservative churches are thriving.

Gnostic Bishop
22-01-2020, 02:32 AM
Christianity doesn't fear the same, and historically has elevated the status of women. In the first few centuries of the church, you could tell where Christianity was influential precisely because girl babies were no longer left to die, and men stuck to one sexual partner.

History belies you, thanks to Christian men denying women the vote till just recently, historically speaking.

Christianity has always been a homophobic and misogynous religion.

4054


Not in Africa and Asia. It's no accident that régimes that share your atheopathy, such as Communist China, must use persecution not persuasion to try to stifle Christianity. Even in the west, the dying churches are the theologically liberal ones who deny biblical authority and push much of the same PC nonsense you do. The theologically conservative churches are thriving.

Thanks to Islam.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYV7KWQ-fY4

Why would you cheer the fact that the more literalist Christians are growing while knowing that the literal reading of myths is the most stupid way to read them?

Regards
DL

Capablanca-Fan
22-01-2020, 04:30 AM
History belies you, thanks to Christian men denying women the vote till just recently, historically speaking.
Everyone denied women the vote. But in the classical pre-Christian Roman and Greek world, fathers had absolute rights over their family (paterfamilias), and infanticide of girl babies was rife, and women's bodies were considered property. Where Christianity gained influence, these evils diminished. In fact, a good indicator of the influence of Christianity in an area was disappearance of sexual slavery. And this goes back to the creation account, where God calls the whole creation "very good" after He had created both man and woman in His image and likeness (Genesis 1:26–31).

Now most churches and Christian conferences have more women than men. Your nonsense reminds me of the self-contradictory christophobes of G.K. Chesterton's day (https://creation.com/anti-creationism-illogic-editorial):


“Or, again, certain phrases in the Epistles or the marriage service, were said by the anti-Christians to show contempt for woman’s intellect. But I found that the anti-Christians themselves had a contempt for woman’s intellect; for it was their great sneer at the Church on the Continent that ‘only women’ went to it.”


Why would you cheer the fact that the more literalist Christians are growing while knowing that the literal reading of myths is the most stupid way to read them?
Not that someone who invariably argues in such a stupid manner is the best person to judge stupidity.

Gnostic Bishop
22-01-2020, 04:45 AM
Everyone denied women the vote. But in the classical pre-Christian Roman and Greek world, fathers had absolute rights over their family (paterfamilias), and infanticide of girl babies was rife, and women's bodies were considered property. Where Christianity gained influence, these evils diminished. In fact, a good indicator of the influence of Christianity in an area was disappearance of sexual slavery. And this goes back to the creation account, where God calls the whole creation "very good" after He had created both man and woman in His image and likeness (Genesis 1:26–31).

Now most churches and Christian conferences have more women than men. Your nonsense reminds me of the self-contradictory christophobes of G.K. Chesterton's day (https://creation.com/anti-creationism-illogic-editorial):


“Or, again, certain phrases in the Epistles or the marriage service, were said by the anti-Christians to show contempt for woman’s intellect. But I found that the anti-Christians themselves had a contempt for woman’s intellect; for it was their great sneer at the Church on the Continent that ‘only women’ went to it.”


Not that someone who invariably argues in such a stupid manner is the best person to judge stupidity.

Faith closes the mind. It is pure idol worship.

Faith is a way to quit using, "God given" power of Reason and Logic, and cause the faithful to embrace doctrines that moral people reject.

The God of the OT says, “Come now, and let us reason together,” [Isaiah 1:18]

How can literalists reason on God when they must ignore reason and logic and discard them when turning into literalist?

Those who are literalists can only reply somewhat in the fashion that Martin Luther did.
“Faith must trample under foot all reason, sense, and understanding.”
“Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has.”

This attitude effectively kills all worthy communication that non-theists can have with theist. Faith closes the believers mind as it is pure idol worship.

Literalism is an evil practice that hides the true messages of myths. We cannot show our faith based friends that they are wrong through their faith colored glasses. Their faith also plugs their ears.

Regards
DL

antichrist
22-01-2020, 05:53 AM
Ha Capa Fan , those two GB's quote are knock-out, I am enjoying this. But i think both of you are still steady on your feet. Do i award points for aggression? Would you be okay with Adamski and Desmond as judges? GB could become a crowd favourite by appealing to reason.

Capablanca-Fan
22-01-2020, 06:31 AM
GB could become a crowd favourite by appealing to reason.

Oh, when does he intend to start?

Capablanca-Fan
22-01-2020, 06:41 AM
Faith closes the mind.
“Merely having an open mind is nothing. The object of opening the mind, as of opening the mouth, is to shut it again on something solid.”—G.K. Chesterton


Faith is a way to quit using, "God given" power of Reason and Logic, and cause the faithful to embrace doctrines that moral people reject.
What is your basis for assuming that you are one of the moral people? I see no evidence so far. Plenty of outraged ranting, but no moral reasoning.


The God of the OT says, “Come now, and let us reason together,” [Isaiah 1:18]
Yes, exactly, so biblical faith, as opposed to your moronic caricature, includes reason and logic. Jesus endorsed Isaiah, and Jesus is called the Logos, the word from which we derive "logic". Deal with Loving God with all your mind: logic and creation (https://creation.com/loving-god-with-all-your-mind-logic-and-creation) instead of wasting our time knocking down straw men.


How can literalists reason on God when they must ignore reason and logic and discard them when turning into literalist?
I don't know who these "literalists" are, unless you mean the same as Augustine and Tyndale (https://creation.com/augustine-myths-debunked), where the "literal" meaning is the meaning it would have had to its original readers. So it would correspond to "originalism" in legal theory. This is the most logical understanding.


Those who are literalists can only reply somewhat in the fashion that Martin Luther did.
“Faith must trample under foot all reason, sense, and understanding.”
“Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has.”
Prove these quotes exist, and provide context. Luther was very well educated in logic, and this shines through in his books. He did denounce "reason" in a way that modern writers would signify with scare quotes, i.e. relying on false premises or false logic, but used real reason frequently.

Capablanca-Fan
22-01-2020, 06:52 AM
So do I. Harm reduction.
You support the persecutions of Christians in atheopathic communist countries then?


Both Christianity and Islam, slave holding ideologies,
What would you prefer? The slave-holding ideologies of Classical Greece and Rome? In reality, slavery was ubiquitous, and questioned only in the Christian west by the likes of William Wilberforce and his colleague (https://creation.com/anti-slavery-activist-william-wilberforce-christian-hero)s, who would be called "the religious right" if they were alive today,


have basically developed into intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religions.
I don't know what "homophobic" is supposed to mean, because the etymology suggests "fear of the same". But what cultures do you think had equal rights for women and gays?


Jesus would call Christianity and Islam abominations.
What would you know or even care?


Gnostic Christians did in the past, and I am proudly continuing that tradition and honest irrefutable evaluation based on morality.
You really are clueless aren't you? The most famous gnostic ‘christian’ writing is the so-called Gospel of Thomas, and its Saying 114 is:


Simon Peter said to them, "Mary should leave us, for females are not worthy of life." Jesus said, "See, I am going to attract her to make her male so that she too might become a living spirit that resembles you males. For every female (element) that makes itself male will enter the kingdom of heaven."

This doesn't sound anything like the pro-woman Jesus recorded in the real Gospels.


Supernaturally based religions, evil? Yes. Islam and Christianity being the worst of these.
Jesus frequently appealed to the supernatural. What is your basis for denying this?

antichrist
23-01-2020, 07:19 AM
So Capa Fan, did females get a front row seat in Heaven if they transgendered? Jesus was really a groovy guy for his day

Gnostic Bishop
23-01-2020, 08:02 AM
Hi C F.

What a vile personality. I will enjoy denutting you.

I will have to be careful with my language or you might get me banned for being honest with you.
Do try to be civil and a good loser.

You are demonstrably a piece of moral garbage but might have the ability to repent for your thinking.

"You really are clueless aren't you? The most famous gnostic ‘christian’ writing is the so-called Gospel of Thomas, and its Saying 114 is:

Simon Peter said to them, "Mary should leave us, for females are not worthy of life." Jesus said, "See, I am going to attract her to make her male so that she too might become a living spirit that resembles you males. For every female (element) that makes itself male will enter the kingdom of heaven."

This doesn't sound anything like the pro-woman Jesus recorded in the real Gospels."

In the real doctored gospels, Jesus is for the full inclusion of women. He said the could preach, heal and prophesy.

Gnostic Jesus agrees fully and ads a caveat. Because of our mammalian tendencies, men should always put women and children ahead of ourselves. The law of the sea thinking.

Jesus saw Yahweh as androgynous. He followed the Jewish esoteric and aural traditions. This is clear. He could not write but Mary likely did.

Jesus is also known for liking Mary the most and if you read love into this text, it is almost pornographic in depicting a spiritual kiss and near melding between Jesus and Mary.

"See, I am going to attract her to make her male"

Jesus, to me, was showing how to kiss Mary. Who knows what the scribes of our myths were trying to show.

Do not read myths too literally. You might foolishly start believing in the supernatural.

Regards
DL

Gnostic Bishop
23-01-2020, 08:13 AM
Hi C.F.

"What is your basis for assuming that you are one of the moral people?"

I claim so on the basis of the number of Christian people that lose when trying to best me.

I am like a plague to your ilk as I force you with, your own WORD, to repent by giving arguments from scriptures that show you wrong.

You have left skid marks yourself on touchy issues like a god who kills when he can cure.

My god cures. Your god does not. Your god is morally inferior.

And what about that infanticide thing even before sin was invented?

You give points for that totally unjust B.S.?

Say it isn't so.

----------------

"Logos, the word from which we derive "logic"."

Indeed.

Why this information while you are coming from a place of mythos.

Do you wish to talk reality or what you have been doing?

Do you believe in talking serpents and donkeys or not?

Regards
DL

Gnostic Bishop
23-01-2020, 08:18 AM
Jesus frequently appealed to the supernatural. What is your basis for denying this?

Eh. Chapter and verse please.

He said we could do all he did and more and no one does anything supernatural. No one.

Regards
DL

Capablanca-Fan
23-01-2020, 08:40 AM
You really are clueless aren't you? The most famous gnostic ‘christian’ writing is the so-called Gospel of Thomas, and its Saying 114 is:


Simon Peter said to them, "Mary should leave us, for females are not worthy of life." Jesus said, "See, I am going to attract her to make her male so that she too might become a living spirit that resembles you males. For every female (element) that makes itself male will enter the kingdom of heaven."

This doesn't sound anything like the pro-woman Jesus recorded in the real Gospels.

In the real doctored gospels, Jesus is for the full inclusion of women. He said the could preach, heal and prophesy.
The real Gospels of the New Testament say that. If you want to claim that they are doctored, then show us earlier undoctored manuscripts.


Gnostic Jesus agrees fully and ads a caveat. Because of our mammalian tendencies, men should always put women and children ahead of ourselves. The law of the sea thinking.
Wow, you can't even see that your own fake gnostic gospel claims that women are unworthy of life, and must become male.


Do not read myths too literally. You might foolishly start believing in the supernatural.
Another ipse dixit. Your bluff and bluster doesn't work on us.

Note that one of your heroes, Clinton R. Dawkins, admits in his latest book Outgrowing God (https://books.google.com/books?id=q1qBDwAAQBAJ&pg=PA99&lpg=PA99&dq=%E2%80%9CWhether+irrational+or+not,+it+does,+un fortunately,+seem+plausible+that,+if+somebody+sinc erely+believes+God+is+watching+his+every+move,+he+ might+be+more+likely+to+be+good,%E2%80%9D+Dawkins&source=bl&ots=3BiXbbXXTq&sig=ACfU3U1hmy9AW19Kbc36Hy4ZMeydkZKIiA&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwid5qm4n5jnAhWLVN8KHR27DmIQ6AEwBXoECAoQA Q#v=onepage&q=%E2%80%9CWhether%20irrational%20or%20not%2C%20it %20does%2C%20unfortunately%2C%20seem%20plausible%2 0that%2C%20if%20somebody%20sincerely%20believes%20 God%20is%20watching%20his%20every%20move%2C%20he%2 0might%20be%20more%20likely%20to%20be%20good%2C%E2 %80%9D%20Dawkins&f=false):


Whether irrational or not, it does, unfortunately, seem plausible that, if somebody sincerely believes God is watching his every move, he might be more likely to be good. I must say that I hate that idea. I want to believe that humans are better than that. I’d like to believe I’m honest whether anyone is watching or not.

According to The Times: (https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/ending-religion-is-a-bad-idea-says-richard-dawkins-sqqdbmcpq)


Richard Dawkins said he feared that if religion were abolished it would “give people a licence to do really bad things”. He said that security camera surveillance of customers in shops did appear to deter shoplifting, adding that people might feel free to do wrong without a “divine spy camera in the sky reading their every thought”.

“People may feel free to do bad things because they feel God is no longer watching them,” he told The Times and The Sunday Times Cheltenham Literature Festival. He recalled an experiment by one of his former pupils, Melissa Bateson at the University of Newcastle, who introduced a coffee honesty box for her…

Capablanca-Fan
23-01-2020, 08:41 AM
So Capa Fan, did females get a front row seat in Heaven if they transgendered? Jesus was really a groovy guy for his day

It was only the false Jesus of the Gnostic Gospels that GB loves that demand that all females should be trangendered.

antichrist
23-01-2020, 09:16 AM
It was only the false Jesus of the Gnostic Gospels that GB loves that demand that all females should be trangendered.
I couldn't handle Sarah H Sanders and Kellyanne Conway as they are now I would run a hundred miles if they t/g. But my other t/g friends okay. Could you handle those two 24/7?

antichrist
23-01-2020, 09:23 AM
I couldn't handle Sarah H Sanders and Kellyanne Conway as they are now I would run a hundred miles if they t/g. But my other t/g friends okay. Could you handle those two 24/7?

Sarah would join Hells Angels and Kellyanne push Hannity out of a job

Gnostic Bishop
23-01-2020, 11:00 AM
It was only the false Jesus of the Gnostic Gospels that GB loves that demand that all females should be trangendered.

Souls, like Yahweh and most other gods we have made up, goof, are androgynous.

Souls means life force.

Regards
DL

Gnostic Bishop
23-01-2020, 11:04 AM
The real Gospels of the New Testament say that. If you want to claim that they are doctored, then show us earlier undoctored manuscripts.


Wow, you can't even see that your own fake gnostic gospel claims that women are unworthy of life, and must become male.


Another ipse dixit. Your bluff and bluster doesn't work on us.

Note that one of your heroes, Clinton R. Dawkins, admits in his latest book Outgrowing God (https://books.google.com/books?id=q1qBDwAAQBAJ&pg=PA99&lpg=PA99&dq=%E2%80%9CWhether+irrational+or+not,+it+does,+un fortunately,+seem+plausible+that,+if+somebody+sinc erely+believes+God+is+watching+his+every+move,+he+ might+be+more+likely+to+be+good,%E2%80%9D+Dawkins&source=bl&ots=3BiXbbXXTq&sig=ACfU3U1hmy9AW19Kbc36Hy4ZMeydkZKIiA&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwid5qm4n5jnAhWLVN8KHR27DmIQ6AEwBXoECAoQA Q#v=onepage&q=%E2%80%9CWhether%20irrational%20or%20not%2C%20it %20does%2C%20unfortunately%2C%20seem%20plausible%2 0that%2C%20if%20somebody%20sincerely%20believes%20 God%20is%20watching%20his%20every%20move%2C%20he%2 0might%20be%20more%20likely%20to%20be%20good%2C%E2 %80%9D%20Dawkins&f=false):


Whether irrational or not, it does, unfortunately, seem plausible that, if somebody sincerely believes God is watching his every move, he might be more likely to be good. I must say that I hate that idea. I want to believe that humans are better than that. I’d like to believe I’m honest whether anyone is watching or not.

According to The Times: (https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/ending-religion-is-a-bad-idea-says-richard-dawkins-sqqdbmcpq)


Richard Dawkins said he feared that if religion were abolished it would “give people a licence to do really bad things”. He said that security camera surveillance of customers in shops did appear to deter shoplifting, adding that people might feel free to do wrong without a “divine spy camera in the sky reading their every thought”.

“People may feel free to do bad things because they feel God is no longer watching them,” he told The Times and The Sunday Times Cheltenham Literature Festival. He recalled an experiment by one of his former pupils, Melissa Bateson at the University of Newcastle, who introduced a coffee honesty box for her…

So you would join the Captain Coward Club.

Good to know.

Cowards can never be moral.

Oy mate. You are quite the ****ed up bloke.

Regards
DL

antichrist
23-01-2020, 11:12 AM
DL I make allowances for top chess folk because I don't expect them to be brilliant without having strong weak points as well. There will be exceptions of course. I recommend don't insult top players. They can't help how they are.

Gnostic Bishop
23-01-2020, 11:18 AM
DL I make allowances for top chess folk because I don't expect them to be brilliant without having strong weak points as well. There will be exceptions of course. I recommend don't insult top players. They can't help how they are.

I hear you.

Our friend quoted Dawkins but did not quote where he said that our friend's ilk where a disgrace to the human race.

I see them as more of a menace.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYV7KWQ-fY4

Regards
DL

Capablanca-Fan
24-01-2020, 08:09 AM
DL I make allowances for top chess folk because I don't expect them to be brilliant without having strong weak points as well. There will be exceptions of course. I recommend don't insult top players. They can't help how they are.

But insults are all GB has left, now that his favorite sources such as the gnostic forgery called The Gospel of Thomas were exposed for their extreme misogyny.

Gnostic Bishop
25-01-2020, 03:02 AM
But insults are all GB has left, now that his favorite sources such as the gnostic forgery called The Gospel of Thomas were exposed for their extreme misogyny.

Is Yin misogynous to Yang?

No. Yin and Yang compliment each other and are not at all in opposition.

I thought you wanted to discuss the immorality of your genocidal god and your use of mythos against logos.

I must have been mistaken as your pathetic rendering shows.

So much for your apologetics.

Regards
DL

antichrist
25-01-2020, 05:58 AM
I thought someone quoted or I read some where how sins of the father or son are not the responsibility of the other. So why are all the children punished because of a few apples of the parents? Misogyny is due to it was Eve tempting poor Adam - she probably promised him "fries" with that

Gnostic Bishop
26-01-2020, 02:43 AM
I thought someone quoted or I read some where how sins of the father or son are not the responsibility of the other. So why are all the children punished because of a few apples of the parents? Misogyny is due to it was Eve tempting poor Adam - she probably promised him "fries" with that

These are the most pertinent. Jesus would have taught those while Christians preach the opposite.

Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

Deuteronomy 24:16 (ESV) "Fathers shall not be put to death because of their children, nor shall children be put to death because of their fathers. Each one shall be put to death for his own sin.

Psa 49;7 None of them can by any means redeem his brother, nor give to God a ransom for him:

Regards
DL

antichrist
26-01-2020, 06:41 AM
These are the most pertinent. Jesus would have taught those while Christians preach the opposite.

Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

Deuteronomy 24:16 (ESV) "Fathers shall not be put to death because of their children, nor shall children be put to death because of their fathers. Each one shall be put to death for his own sin.

Psa 49;7 None of them can by any means redeem his brother, nor give to God a ransom for him:

Regards
DL

But this is not compatible with the crucifixion "let his blood be upon us and upon our children ". Now I understand why Jesus had to die to clean up his father's mess by creating faulty and sinful humans. But because we have had Holocaust since then I think the father needs to send his daughter in law next time with a young prince to make sure. Not a sinner daughter in law like Sarah or Dianna or Merkel.

Gnostic Bishop
27-01-2020, 05:56 AM
But this is not compatible with the crucifixion "let his blood be upon us and upon our children ". Now I understand why Jesus had to die to clean up his father's mess by creating faulty and sinful humans. But because we have had Holocaust since then I think the father needs to send his daughter in law next time with a young prince to make sure. Not a sinner daughter in law like Sarah or Dianna or Merkel.

I agree.

But how to bring the prophesy Jesus put, and elect ourselves a new Goddess?

Look into the fires you suffer at present down under, and stopping global decimation becomes easier than to bring the world to sanity.

If you cannot elect a God Down Under then no one will elect one anywhere.

Kriky, Eh?

Regards
DL

Gnostic Bishop
27-01-2020, 06:04 AM
But this is not compatible with the crucifixion "let his blood be upon us and upon our children ".

Jesus was to be a flipping Jewish sacrifice. Where else would you have Jesus' blood put upon?

A Jew would be insulted if Jesus did not return for them and were willing to let Jesus and his suicide test their old myth.

I understand the situation and fail to see your problem.

Regards
DL

P.S
The Jews were singing this back then.


https://www.bing.com/search?q=keep+your+hands+off+my+baby&qs=n&form=QBRE&sp=-1&ghc=1&pq=keep+your+hands+off+my+baby&sc=2-27&sk=&cvid=2268241F5FC04C2D9E906DE079ED23D1

antichrist
27-01-2020, 06:16 AM
I agree.

But how to bring the prophesy Jesus put, and elect ourselves a new Goddess?

Look into the fires you suffer at present down under, and stopping global decimation becomes easier than to bring the world to sanity.

If you cannot elect a God Down Under then no one will elect one anywhere.

Kriky, Eh?

Regards
DL

We did have a genuine god many years ago, his name was Edward Gough Whitlam and there film of him walking on water. He was known as a disbeliever as he would not take an oath on the Bible. One of his memorable quotes came when queried as to what would he do when he died and found out there was a god? With full seriousness and majesty he replied that he would treat God as an equal! Not like silly Jesus when queried on trial whether he was the saviour meekly farted "that is who they say I am". Jesus' last words were "I am going to tell my big daddy on you!"

Gnostic Bishop
27-01-2020, 06:27 AM
We did have a genuine god many years ago, his name was Edward Gough Whitlam and there film of him walking on water. He was known as a disbeliever as he would not take an oath on the Bible. One of his memorable quotes came when queried as to what would he do when he died and found out there was a god? With full seriousness and majesty he replied that he would treat God as an equal! Not like silly Jesus when queried on trial whether he was the saviour meekly farted "that is who they say I am". Jesus' last words were "I am going to tell my big daddy on you!"

Edward Gough Whitlam sounds like an inferior thinker as compared to a Gnostic Christian.

If a god cannot show his ideology as superior to ours, we, like we did with Yahweh, brand it a piss poor god.

If you cannot be better than a genocidal piece of garbage god, -----

Man was made to stand tall. Not grovel.

Regards
DL

antichrist
27-01-2020, 07:24 AM
Edward Gough Whitlam sounds like an inferior thinker as compared to a Gnostic Christian.

If a god cannot show his ideology as superior to ours, we, like we did with Yahweh, brand it a piss poor god.

If you cannot be better than a genocidal piece of garbage god, -----

Man was made to stand tall. Not grovel.

Regards
DL

But Gough Whitlam did not grovel. Shortly after his death there appeared to be a big battle I the heavens - thunder and lightning for hours and stars used as nuke weapons then there was an eerie silence

Gnostic Bishop
27-01-2020, 07:44 AM
But Gough Whitlam did not grovel. Shortly after his death there appeared to be a big battle I the heavens - thunder and lightning for hours and stars used as nuke weapons then there was an eerie silence

WOOOOOOO

No talking serpents or donkeys?

Regards
DL

antichrist
27-01-2020, 03:34 PM
WOOOOOOO

No talking serpents or donkeys?

Regards
DL

Adamski wouldn't dispute talking donkeys - original sin should be redefined as lack of critical and sceptical reasoning facilities.

Desmond
27-01-2020, 04:32 PM
If you cannot elect a God Down Under then no one will elect one anywhere.
Paul Hogan? Shane Warne?

Adamski
27-01-2020, 05:55 PM
Adamski wouldn't dispute talking donkeysIndeed he wouldn't. The miracle is recorded in the Bible's book of Numbers.

antichrist
27-01-2020, 06:11 PM
Indeed he wouldn't. The miracle is recorded in the Bible's book of Numbers.

And when you were under 5 years old and the teacher told you that stars were holes in the floor of heaven you would believe as well?

Adamski
27-01-2020, 06:15 PM
And when you were under 5 years old and the teacher told you that stars were holes in the floor of heaven you would believe as well?Nope. No teacher ever told me that.

antichrist
27-01-2020, 07:17 PM
Nope. No teacher ever told me that.

Well if it was written in the Bible then you would believe it?

Adamski
27-01-2020, 09:24 PM
Well if it was written in the Bible then you would believe it?Yes. As long as it was not something in the OT that was expressly revoked by Jesus Christ.

antichrist
27-01-2020, 09:45 PM
Yes. As long as it was not something in the OT that was expressly revoked by Jesus Christ.

And you accept that Jesus rose to Heaven?

Adamski
27-01-2020, 09:46 PM
Yes. His ascension is basic Christian doctrine. Also believed by many Catholics.

antichrist
27-01-2020, 09:56 PM
Yes. His ascension is basic Christian doctrine. Also believed by many Catholics.

And he ascended to heaven that we would imagine to be not very far up as no jets going up 30,000 feet in those days? Correct?

Adamski
27-01-2020, 09:59 PM
And he ascended to heaven that we would imagine to be not very far up as no jets going up 30,000 feet in those days? Correct?why couldn't it be further up? We are not told how far "up" heaven is. More important is that heaven is being with God forever.

antichrist
27-01-2020, 11:36 PM
why couldn't it be further up? We are not told how far "up" heaven is. More important is that heaven is being with God forever.

So what criteria would you reccommend now in establishing the location of heaven? Beyond the Milky way?

Gnostic Bishop
28-01-2020, 06:07 AM
Adamski wouldn't dispute talking donkeys - original sin should be redefined as lack of critical and sceptical reasoning facilities.

That too.

The basic moral to the story is that men should do as women bid. Adam showed the good sense and instincts we all have to shut the hell up and eat of what woman had tested.

As their "masters", the first duty of men is to put women and children above us.

The wise and moral know this and will shut up and happily eat of it. As the Christian Exultet hymn says, to enforce the Jewish view, calls Adam' sin a happy fault and necessary to god's plan.

This is a truth that the wise know.

Regards
DL

Gnostic Bishop
28-01-2020, 06:12 AM
Paul Hogan? Shane Warne?


https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=puny+gods&view=detail&mid=EA66D9C3071603B5856BEA66D9C3071603B5856B&FORM=VIRE

Regards
DL

Gnostic Bishop
28-01-2020, 06:19 AM
And when you were under 5 years old and the teacher told you that stars were holes in the floor of heaven you would believe as well?

Questions where Christians can hide behind their supernatural shield/blinders, never get resolved.

That is why I focus on the immorality of the genocidal god. With morals, when Christians do no9t run away, can have an actual end game.

You would think that WWII would have put a bad taste in peoples mouths for Fascist religions and their genocidal gods.

Oh well. Long live Hitler et all.

Regards
DL

antichrist
28-01-2020, 08:06 AM
Questions where Christians can hide behind their supernatural shield/blinders, never get resolved.

That is why I focus on the immorality of the genocidal god. With morals, when Christians do no9t run away, can have an actual end game.

You would think that WWII would have put a bad taste in peoples mouths for Fascist religions and their genocidal gods.

Oh well. Long live Hitler et all.

Regards
DL

You are a bit optimistic there. If the wars of religion a few hundred years ago didn't do the trick then nothing will. The famous quote from the then general "kill them all (Catholics and prodos) God will sort them out". Or maybe "will know his own".

Gnostic Bishop
28-01-2020, 08:23 AM
So what criteria would you reccommend now in establishing the location of heaven? Beyond the Milky way?

Where did Jesus say heaven was?

Here and now, if you know the scriptures.

Jesus said that many scoffers you would not see it.

Gnostic Christians do.

Regards
DL

Gnostic Bishop
28-01-2020, 08:30 AM
You are a bit optimistic there. If the wars of religion a few hundred years ago didn't do the trick then nothing will. The famous quote from the then general "kill them all (Catholics and prodos) God will sort them out". Or maybe "will know his own".

Your last.

Perhaps that is why the less religion you have in a country, the more peaceful and law abiding it is.

There aught to be an anti religion law to promote peace.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejorQVy3m8E

Regards
DL

antichrist
28-01-2020, 08:54 AM
Where did Jesus say heaven was?

Here and now, if you know the scriptures.

Jesus said that many scoffers you would not see it.

Gnostic Christians do.

Regards
DL

But Adamski thinks it's up in the stars. If heaven was here and now where did he and Mary ascend to?

Adamski
28-01-2020, 05:25 PM
So what criteria would you reccommend now in establishing the location of heaven? Beyond the Milky way?I have no pressing need to know the location of heaven. Adapting the words of a pop song slightly(a capital Y), "Heaven is being with You".

antichrist
28-01-2020, 06:32 PM
I have no pressing need to know the location of heaven. Adapting the words of a pop song slightly(a capital Y), "Heaven is being with You".

You have pawned your whole life, integrity and creditably on there being a heaven but you are not the slightest bit interested in where it may be located to prove its existence?? We presume it's located off the northern hemisphere. Some Christians believe that they will be united with their bodies there so it must be an enormous place. If you don't care you are not a real believer.

antichrist
28-01-2020, 06:36 PM
Adamski, Capa Fan has capitulated in a lost position so you may as well bow out and hope nobody notices.

Adamski
28-01-2020, 07:24 PM
Adamski, Capa Fan has capitulated in a lost position so you may as well bow out and hope nobody notices.More important than where heaven is, is living a life of "short accounts" to ensure one will get there - genuine repentance (as we do sin) to ensure God's forgiveness and our ultimate destination of heaven.

antichrist
28-01-2020, 07:35 PM
More important than where heaven is, is living a life of "short accounts" to ensure one will get there - genuine repentance (as we do sin) to ensure God's forgiveness and our ultimate destination of heaven.

It is not God who has to forgive you but your victim- doesn't that sound more sensible? God knew a million years before you were born that you and Hitler would be naughty boys but he never pushed the pause button so approved it all.

Gnostic Bishop
29-01-2020, 05:51 AM
But Adamski thinks it's up in the stars. If heaven was here and now where did he and Mary ascend to?

Exactly. To Jesus, they just went invisible and into heaven, which he saw as here and now.

He would see all going into Shoal/the grave, after death.

The grave, to await resurrection. The last unknown to Jesus.

Regards
DL

Capablanca-Fan
31-01-2020, 06:08 AM
Adamski, Capa Fan has capitulated in a lost position so you may as well bow out and hope nobody notices.

In your dreams. Your hero, the follower of the demonstrably misogynistic pseudo-philosophy of gnosticism, relies on ipse dixits and arguments from outrage, not logical arguments.

Capablanca-Fan
31-01-2020, 06:10 AM
No talking serpents or donkeys?
Only one of each, so they were clearly special cases.

Kevin Bonham
31-01-2020, 10:28 AM
Post deleted and thread locked

Same reason as the other Gnostic Bishop thread where I did this.