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View Full Version : Draw Police - You're Nicked!



Kevin Bonham
26-01-2010, 07:54 PM
This is a little innovation I introduced into the Aus Junior bulletins and I would like to do it here as well as I'm sure we'll have many worthy examples.

During the Aus Junior I found so many of the players were agreeing draws in won positions (which they often should have been able to see were won) that I introduced the Draw Police. Where a draw was agreed in a clearly won position the Draw Police logo (a little cop hat with a "1/2" symbol above the word Police) would appear alongside the words "DRAW POLICE - YOU'RE NICKED!!!" It was stated in advance that this was intended lightheartedly. A few technically guilty suspects were let off, for instance if they would have had to win KBN vs K.

I don't propose to embarrass any of the many juniors involved by further outing their draws in completely won positions here (though perhaps I could whack some up with names removed), but perhaps this thread could be used for posting examples we experience or notice. (Garrett shared a nice one here the other day!) I probably have some bad ones in my own back catalogue somewhere.

Of course acute shortage of time should be taken into account ... unless of course there is a one minute increment in which case there is really no such thing. :lol:

michael.mcguirk
26-01-2010, 08:40 PM
Might just ask before I post, should this include games where you've smuggled a draw from a completely lost position? But the final position is actually drawn?

Basil
26-01-2010, 08:45 PM
(note to self: don't do late nights/drinking nights when playing chess tournaments).
Other note to self: don't belittle other players by calling, "sorry I was pissed/ tired/ partying". The inference is that were you not so affected, the other player wouldn't have had such a shot at the game. Not classy. Gunner advice: wear it. In silence.

Kevin Bonham
26-01-2010, 08:47 PM
Might just ask before I post, should this include games where you've smuggled a draw from a completely lost position? But the final position is actually drawn?

No; but some of those should go on the swindles thread.

The criterion for inclusion here is the agreement of a draw in a won position, particularly if it is offered by the opponent. If someone is winning up until the final move then makes a mistake and takes a draw immediately afterwards in what is now a drawn position, the Draw Police aren't interested. They only want to know about the actual position where the draw was agreed, and the reason for this is to highlight that when players agree draws they often overlook winning resources in their haste to whack out their paw for half a point.

michael.mcguirk
26-01-2010, 09:23 PM
Other note to self: don't belittle other players by calling, "sorry I was pissed/ tired/ partying". The inference is that were you not so affected, the other player wouldn't have had such a shot at the game. Not classy. Gunner advice: wear it. In silence.

Gunner, I think you read too much into this. In no way am I calling Bill a bad player, he played a rather good game, had a good gameplan the whole way, and miscalculated in a position where he felt he had the game won, and unfortunately basically chose the one continuation where it didn't work for him in the swapping off variation.

As for the inference you somehow got from what I said, the comment was merely meant as a reasoning for my bad judgemental skills on the game when it was played. If I hadn't been so affected, some of my judgements would have been better and the game could have been more even, due to the blaringly obvious errors I misjudged. Just the same as if I had been overly emotional or angry during my game.

If anything, I don't go into lower rated games feeling that I should be able to walk over them. I'm not that egotistical. I feel a little scared usually, knowing that I 'should' win, and that as on many occasions I have, screwed it up and lost a game myself even if I had a winning position. My draw in the previous round was a perfect example of that effect in my detriment though, versus Pesan Perera, where I was not confident enough in my own opening knowledge on the situation, played too passively, and as such got steamrolled. Only an unfortunately hard position for him to calculate in the end got me drawing chances, after I'd been pushing through my own bad play.

On a completely different matter, I'd like to apologise again for the comment on your correspondence game thread. It was purely meant in jest, after another time when I think Jesper made a comment after he believed the game was over or whatever, and there were some flames made in his direction. But it was designed as an outrageous over-the-top comment on a perfectly reasonable claim for some laughs. Obviously I wasn't over-the-top enough! Hmm seems to be a theme here, maybe I need to be more aggressive :)

michael.mcguirk
26-01-2010, 09:25 PM
No; but some of those should go on the swindles thread.

The criterion for inclusion here is the agreement of a draw in a won position, particularly if it is offered by the opponent. If someone is winning up until the final move then makes a mistake and takes a draw immediately afterwards in what is now a drawn position, the Draw Police aren't interested. They only want to know about the actual position where the draw was agreed, and the reason for this is to highlight that when players agree draws they often overlook winning resources in their haste to whack out their paw for half a point.

Fair enough then, I'll get it out of this thread then :)

Basil
26-01-2010, 09:30 PM
Gunner, I think you read too much into this.

I don't think so - I'm not reading much into it at all. I'm simply reading "I played poorly coz I was partying" and I say that takes away from your opponent's achievements, whatever they are deemed to be. I think that's bad form. We can agree to disagree.


On a completely different matter, I'd like to apologise again for the comment on your correspondence game thread.
Accpeted. No problem.


It was purely meant in jest, after another time when I think Jesper made a comment after he believed the game was over or whatever, and there were some flames made in his direction.
What Jesper did was wrong and AFAIK we've all moved on. Jesper is a fine addition to this board IMO.


But it was designed as an outrageous over-the-top comment on a perfectly reasonable claim for some laughs. Obviously I wasn't over-the-top enough! Hmm seems to be a theme here, maybe I need to be more aggressive :)
Fair enough. I didn't read as that - I read as stated at the time, namely comments entirely missing the points at play. I accept you intended as total jest, in in that context, I agree your comments were funny :D

Kevin Bonham
26-01-2010, 11:11 PM
Possibly my favourite example from the Junior though at c.1000 level this sort of thing is easily missed.

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 c5 3. d5 b5 4. cxb5 a6 5. e3 d6 6. Nc3 g6 7. bxa6 Bxa6 8. Bxa6 Nxa6 9. Qa4+ Nd7 10. Nf3 Bg7 11. O-O O-O 12. Qd1 Qb6 13. Nd2 Rfb8 14. Qa4 Ne5 15. Nc4 Nxc4 16. Qxc4 Nc7 17. a3 Qb3 18. Qxb3 Rxb3 19. e4 Nb5 20. Nxb5 Rxb5 21. Re1 Bxb2 22. Bxb2 Rxb2 23. g3 Rb3 24. Re3 c4 25. Rxb3 cxb3 26. Kg2 Kg7 27. f3 g5 28. a4 Ra5 29. Kh3 Kf6 30. Rb1 Rxa4 31. Rxb3 Ra2 32. Rb8 Rf2 33. Rh8 Rxf3 34. Rxh7 Ke5 35. Kg4 Kxe4 36. Rh5 f5+ 37. Kxg5 Kxd5 38. Kg6 Ke4 39. Rh4+ Ke3 40. Rf4 e5 41. Rxf5 Rxf5 42. Kxf5 Kf3 43. h4 e4 44. h5 e3 45. h6 e2 46. h7 e1=Q 47. h8=Q 1/2-1/2

What could be more drawish than queen and pawn vs queen and pawn, after all? :lol:

Igor_Goldenberg
27-01-2010, 08:52 AM
Possibly my favourite example from the Junior though at c.1000 level this sort of thing is easily missed.

What could be more drawish than queen and pawn vs queen and pawn, after all? :lol:

It's quite easy to miss at much higher level.

Basil
27-01-2010, 08:55 AM
The position reminds of that forced mate in 10 (or so) where the matee has only-moves (Fox and James, don't know who the original author is). Easy enough to construct I suppose.