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View Full Version : Mary MacKillop sainthood "imminent"



Rincewind
15-12-2009, 12:09 PM
Nod for MacKillop sainthood this week

http://www.smh.com.au/national/nod-for-mackillop-sainthood-this-week-20091215-kshn.html

I thought I'd post this before arosar beats me to it. :)

All this talk about miracles makes one wonder about the scientific credulity of the Vatican in assessing these things. I mean just because someone is supposedly riddled with cancer and inexplicably gets better is no reason to think that the intercession of Mary had anything to do with it. What about the thousands of unanswered prayers? It is nothing more than the ultimate form of cherry-picking report bias.

antichrist
15-12-2009, 01:20 PM
Dont get too excited on your high horse. I reakon that Rudd only went there the other day coz he is trying to out-muscle Abbot for the Catholic vote. And if she does become a saint (bend your knee to her) then Rudd was already on the winning side.

I recently found out that my school was founded by her and later handed over to another mob.

Solo
16-12-2009, 11:28 PM
I read a book about Mary MacKillop about 15 years ago, and thouroughly enjoyed it. She and all the saints have lived a life of the utmost humility and surrendered their lives to the Lord. I reckon she would have interceded in tens of thousands of prayers since her death and many of them the recipient doesn't tell anyone, which they don't have to:) . So she would really be a saint many times over.

There are billions of people in the world and billions of prayers answered every day. It is true that there are many not answered as well.

Capablanca-Fan
17-12-2009, 07:34 PM
There are billions of people in the world and billions of prayers answered every day. It is true that there are many not answered as well.
Except that "no" is a possble answer, cf. 2 Cor. 12:7–9 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2%20Cor.%2012:7-9&version=NIV).

Solo
17-12-2009, 09:02 PM
Now I know why Adelaide won the 1997 premiership:wall: :wall: If you know the answer is No, that is a prayer answered still.

Seriously, when sportspersons pray they should just pray for strength of body or clarity of mind, not pray to win because that is of course unfair and God would ignore it IMHO. Such a prayer is not a millionth as important as a cure of cancer or other miracles.

... though I was just thinking of some of my endgames ...:hand:

Capablanca-Fan
18-12-2009, 12:47 AM
Seriously, when sportspersons pray they should just pray for strength of body or clarity of mind, not pray to win because that is of course unfair and God would ignore it IMHO. Such a prayer is not a millionth as important as a cure of cancer or other miracles.
I agree totally.


... though I was just thinking of some of my endgames ...:hand:
that would explain some of them :P;)

antichrist
21-07-2010, 10:30 PM
Now I know why Adelaide won the 1997 premiership:wall: :wall: If you know the answer is No, that is a prayer answered still.

Seriously, when sportspersons pray they should just pray for strength of body or clarity of mind, not pray to win because that is of course unfair and God would ignore it IMHO. Such a prayer is not a millionth as important as a cure of cancer or other miracles.

... though I was just thinking of some of my endgames ...:hand:

God has on many previous occasions being unfair, the Bible is full of it. Chosen People for beginners.

antichrist
17-10-2010, 06:32 PM
How ironic, that the current Pope, who is charged by Geoff Robertson with protecting paedofiles, is cannonising Mary McKillop who may be been excommunicated for exposing paedofile priests.


She would be turning in her grave if she is still in it.

morebeer
17-10-2010, 07:30 PM
Apart from the marketing value of keeping converted punters enthused about the product, I find the whole concept of miracle then sainthood mind-numbingly infantile.

I fear for our species.

ER
17-10-2010, 07:36 PM
Apart from the marketing value of keeping converted punters enthused about the product, I find the whole concept of miracle then sainthood mind-numbingly infantileMay I add ridiculous and laughable to that pls?

Ian Murray
17-10-2010, 09:05 PM
I read somewhere this week that 35% of Australians believe in miracles, as opposed to 80% of Americans

Of course most, if not all, primitive cultures practise some sort of spirit worship

pappubahry
17-10-2010, 09:12 PM
I read somewhere this week that 35% of Australians believe in miracles
It is 63% according to the survey described here (http://www.theage.com.au/national/faith-what-australians-believe-in-20091218-l5qy.html).

Garvinator
17-10-2010, 09:32 PM
For me to really believe in miracles as claimed by the Catholic Church, I want to see a priest be able to pray and deliver a fully functioning normal arm or leg for someone who has lost theirs, or for a priest to pray and deliver a repaired spinal cord for someone who has had theirs severed.

Those would be real miracles, rather than claims of curing cancer.

Rincewind
17-10-2010, 09:43 PM
It is 63% according to the survey described here (http://www.theage.com.au/national/faith-what-australians-believe-in-20091218-l5qy.html).

One wonders if the timing of the poll with the media circus surrounding the canonisation had much of an effect on the results.

antichrist
17-10-2010, 09:55 PM
In one of the supposed miracles the operaton scars still show - God's medical training must go back to pre-plastsic surgery days and has not updated. Hold on but he had artificial insemination worked out 2,000 years ago - God knows?

antichrist
17-10-2010, 10:02 PM
I have a first cousin, aged 50 years and who has never been touched, over there for the canonisation plus a few others who are totally damaged (mentally and physically). He gives Bible lessons but also believes in evolution and sees no contradiction but I haven't had a chance to sort him out yet.

He gives tonnes of money to the Church but if I asked him for a loan I would be knocked back - though his old man would have obliged.

antichrist
17-10-2010, 10:05 PM
I restrained myself in the shoutbox - we could change our sporting emblem to a boxing crucifix, that's how you could make a fortune if you get in first.

Kevin Bonham
17-10-2010, 10:16 PM
MacKillomania went into overdrive in our Sunday paper today with news of a plane crash on Flinders Island, from which all seven on board impressively escaped despite the plane landing in the sort of dense forest I would rather like to look for snails in. One of the survivors happened to be the hubby of a local Labor state aspirant/tryhard (and still trying hard despite an abysmal result in our state poll this year) who reported that she purchased a MacKillop trinket in Salamanca.

My guess would be that there would have been so many such trinkets purchased that it would have been surprising if no-one with an indirect connection to the flight had purchased one.

antichrist
17-10-2010, 10:44 PM
In Philippines I lived near major highway and made a point of checking out every traffic crash - and every car had a saint Christopher medal with safe journey request

Rincewind
18-10-2010, 08:32 AM
In Philippines I lived near major highway and made a point of checking out every traffic crash - and every car had a saint Christopher medal with safe journey request

The more I think about religion the more it seems to be a mechanism to give the impression of control to the believer. St Chrissy medals for example. No one wants to die in a car crash and many people do and in crashes which are entirely out of their control. For example a truck losing its brakes and hitting other motorists as happened here last week. The St Christopher medal gives the believer a sense of control over their lives where before they had none. Regardless of whether there is real control or not is beside the point.

antichrist
18-10-2010, 08:39 AM
That is why I consider religion a community w..k (sorry about the language)

Over there mate they are virtually scrapping their shoe on the ground to stop, you can even see white canvas in the tyres coming through. But they don't seem to know yet that St Christoper was deemed by the Church not to exist - but keep a secret..

antichrist
18-10-2010, 08:40 AM
the bloody SMH has a 4 page liftout today, but last week they had a major article by David Marr criticising concept of miracles but too busy to read yet

antichrist
18-10-2010, 08:49 AM
I read how M McKillop had very bad menstration pains - poor thing, they can really suffer and maybe not much drugs in those days. And boy can they get daggers out as well.

Desmond
18-10-2010, 08:52 AM
The more I think about religion the more it seems to be a mechanism to give the impression of control to the believer. St Chrissy medals for example. No one wants to die in a car crash and many people do and in crashes which are entirely out of their control. For example a truck losing its brakes and hitting other motorists as happened here last week. The St Christopher medal gives the believer a sense of control over their lives where before they had none. Regardless of whether there is real control or not is beside the point.
May as well wear a rabbit's foot.

Incidentally did Mary have children? On Today they said that some of her descendants attended, but maybe they were just distant relatives.

antichrist
19-10-2010, 04:01 PM
May as well wear a rabbit's foot.

Incidentally did Mary have children? On Today they said that some of her descendants attended, but maybe they were just distant relatives.

Well nuns are supposed to be Brides of Christ but I would not stretch another virgin birth out of that, but if so it would be Christ's first - only took him 2000 years.

Metro
19-10-2010, 04:32 PM
Incidentally did Mary have children? On Today they said that some of her descendants attended, but maybe they were just distant relatives.
A relative Michael Connolly http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303496104575560292825977622.html
I think it's curious that people are joyful and celebrate the sainthood when the saint suffers terribly.

arosar
20-10-2010, 12:00 PM
I think it's curious that people are joyful and celebrate the sainthood when the saint suffers terribly.

Well, that's kind of the whole point. They suffer on behalf of believers. And in the case of Jesus, the man died for their sins.

AR

Rincewind
20-10-2010, 12:10 PM
Well, that's kind of the whole point. They suffer on behalf of believers. And in the case of Jesus, the man died for their sins.

You have to love the concept of substitutionary atonement. Now if only I could get St Mary MacKillop (or Jesus, if she is strapped for cash) to pay for my parking fines. :)

antichrist
20-10-2010, 12:24 PM
Well, that's kind of the whole point. They suffer on behalf of believers. And in the case of Jesus, the man died for their sins.

AR

But he only died as a man - so could not have atoned for all sins - if died as a god maybe.

Anyway as I tell fervent Christians, if they crucified me and I was God I would be having 10,000 org..ms at same time and laughing at the silly humans. They don't like it. Well that is what you would also be doing wouldn't you?