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Space_Dude
03-06-2009, 08:36 PM
I decided to take up computer language as my 3rd language and as my hobby. I downloaded Python the programming software, which im sure Rincewind will know all about, and i was wondering if anyone can teach me on CC, through pm and stuff... so, anyone?? plz reply quick.

Rincewind
03-06-2009, 10:25 PM
I decided to take up computer language as my 3rd language and as my hobby. I downloaded Python the programming software, which im sure Rincewind will know all about, and i was wondering if anyone can teach me on CC, through pm and stuff... so, anyone?? plz reply quick.

I know lots of computer languages but have since discovered that computers are poor conversationalists.

But seriously, Python is not one that I've had all that much to do with. The easiest way to learn a computer language is to find some good web doco/tutorials and work your way through them. A good book in a tutorial style would work as well for the same reason: you learn by doing.

Space_Dude
04-06-2009, 08:09 PM
Thanks for the reply Barry, some sites recommended me c++ language,,, are they right? is it for begginers and total newb like me?

Sinister
04-06-2009, 08:20 PM
Thanks for the reply Barry, some sites recommended me c++ language,,, are they right? is it for begginers and total newb like me?
give it up...you are wasting your time trying to learn what your computer has to say because all it will tell you is "screw you, I will un-freeze myself later"

Space_Dude
04-06-2009, 08:42 PM
give it up...you are wasting your time trying to learn what your computer has to say because all it will tell you is "screw you, I will un-freeze myself later"
have some respect of other peoples thoughts, i mean if you dont think thats a good idea fine! but dont rub it in to peoples faces, and you think people that knocks on the door and asking to join there religion is bad... youre as bad as them since you 'ask' people to give up what they enjoy and do things you're way...

Rincewind
04-06-2009, 08:53 PM
Thanks for the reply Barry, some sites recommended me c++ language,,, are they right? is it for begginers and total newb like me?

Let me preface my response by saying I don't teach programming in general and I haven't work in IT for a few years now. So views are almost certainly not current educational theory and certainly somewhat out of date and misguided. However, since you asked here are my views.

I would not recommend C++ as the language for an absolute beginner to programming. C++ is certainly widely used and very powerful, but partly for this reason it can be a difficult language to program with *well*. Personally, I think an programming environment which insulates the user to a greater extent from all sorts of system constraints and protects them to some extent from themselves, provides a better starting point.

Personally I started learning BASIC as it was the language of almost all home computers in the 1970s. I also tinkered with machine language but by and large I cut my teeth in BASIC. At university I was introduced to Pascal, C, FORTRAN (mainly) and in my first job I used mainly COBOL, PL/I and some reporting packages like SAS and the like.

So from my point of view I think BASIC (or something like it) and/or Pascal (or something like that) are good starting points and I would recommend those above C++ for a beginner. C++ is more likely to be taken on successfully after you have had some experience in programming in general. I think C++ is a worthwhile skill and no doubt more marketable than Pascal or BASIC. However the more important skill to learn is how to program which in independent of the specifics of the language or platform and that skill is advanced more effectively and efficiently by not launching directly into C.

Desmond
05-06-2009, 08:44 AM
I found Java to be pretty easy to learn, certainly much easier than C/C++.

Rincewind
05-06-2009, 09:37 AM
I found Java to be pretty easy to learn, certainly much easier than C/C++.

I agree, Java is pretty nice. However the object oriented side would make it more difficult for a beginner than either (procedural) BASIC or Pascal. I think the primary skills one needs is to be able to write procedural code and before one looks at more complicated data structures and and object orientated programs. My view may be based on the historical development of OO programming, but it makes sense to me.

Desmond
05-06-2009, 10:43 AM
I agree, Java is pretty nice. However the object oriented side would make it more difficult for a beginner than either (procedural) BASIC or Pascal. I think the primary skills one needs is to be able to write procedural code and before one looks at more complicated data structures and and object orientated programs. My view may be based on the historical development of OO programming, but it makes sense to me.Yeah you're probably right. I found Java easier to learn that Pacal, but that is probably because I knew more by then.

Miranda
05-06-2009, 10:55 AM
I've taught myself a bit of basic Java. Just to learn how to make the 'Hello World' program, http://showmedo.com/videotutorials/video?name=IntroductionToEclipseWithJava1_JohnM&fromSeriesID=6 has a good guide.

Alexrules01
05-06-2009, 04:58 PM
Ive been learning BASIC at school, get Liberty Basic, its free software and pretty easy to understand. :)

Rincewind
05-06-2009, 05:12 PM
Ive been learning BASIC at school, get Liberty Basic, its free software and pretty easy to understand. :)

Liberty BASIC is not free. There is a free trial but the software actually does cost. From their FAQ

Q: How much does it cost to purchase Liberty BASIC?
A: Liberty BASIC costs $59.95 for the GOLD version, and we also have a special Value Edition which includes some extras for $79.95.

I've never tried Liberty flavour so it might be worth the money. I have paid for BASICs in the past but presently I've been using FreeBASIC http://www.freebasic.net/ which is, as the name suggests, free.

If you decide to go with FreeBASIC you would also be advised to get a development interface. I've tried both FBEdit and FBIDE and prefer FBEdit. Both are written in FreeBASIC and also free.

AzureBlue
05-06-2009, 05:23 PM
I don't really know much about computer language, but once I start, I reckon I'll use C++, it's the only one I've heard of LOL

Spiny Norman
06-06-2009, 07:19 AM
I agree with Barry that C++ would not be an appropriate place to start. C++ is very heavy duty compared to the alternatives. If you're looking for programming skills that readily translate into the workplace, my top two candidates would probably be:

Java
.NET Framework (probably the Visual Basic language would be easiest, although you can add C# and others later)

There is high demand for good .NET programmers and will continue to be for some time i think. When I learned programming, I went through the following progression:

-- COBOL
-- PICK (actually it was Prime Information, a Pick variant)
-- Microsoft Visual FoxPro (a dBase variant)
-- Perl (self taught, really just tinkered with it)

I've also written some code in VBscript, Javascript and so on, but again, self-taught and really just tinkering with it. Most of my skills in programming are now a dead end, although I am VERY lucky in that my current employer has a large investment in standard PICK (running on IBM/AIX) and I think it was my knowledge of programming in that kind of environment that secured me the position.

ElevatorEscapee
07-06-2009, 07:54 PM
He he... I still remember one of my first C (percursor to C+ & C++) programs not working because in my first line I had typed <studio> instead of <stdio> :doh:

Everything else seemed to be typed perfectly, but I still couldn't get it to work! (Well, it looked like "studio" to my mind when I read it! - No one had ever actually bothered to explain to me that it stood for "standard In Out", and should be "stdio". :D )

I also remember programming in COBOL at TAFE, which meant doing a huge print out of the old style connected continuous computer paper, rolling it out in a long hallway and getting down on your hands and knees and going over it with a pencil to find the mistakes! :lol:

Anyway, I agree with the comments of the others above, a simple BASIC, or Pascal language will help you learn the types of logic you require for the higher generation programming languages.

Such as the "For, Next" loops & the "If, Then" statements, etc. :)

Desmond
07-06-2009, 08:42 PM
He he... I still remember one of my first C (percursor to C+ & C++) I don't think there is such a thing as C+. The ++ being an in-joke becauase ++ is the increment operator on C/C++.

Bill Gletsos
07-06-2009, 10:27 PM
I don't think there is such a thing as C+. The ++ being an in-joke becauase ++ is the increment operator on C/C++.He probably was thinking of C# and C++.

Igor_Goldenberg
09-06-2009, 03:29 PM
For beginners I'd recommend Visual Basic.
If you want to take it seriously, learn Java next.
If you want to excel in programming and learn broader concepts of software development, go to C++ (after Java).

Other languages (including scripts!) can be picked up on the way as needed.

PS. I would not recommend studying C as a precursor to C++ (worst then waste of time).

MichaelBaron
10-06-2009, 11:27 AM
Majority of the Universities appear to be teaching C++ first. Whether it is the easiest/most useful language to learn could be another story though...

Desmond
10-06-2009, 12:32 PM
Majority of the Universities appear to be teaching C++ first. Whether it is the easiest/most useful language to learn could be another story though...Majority of uni students learning programming are not learning their first language.

Garrett
10-06-2009, 01:05 PM
As long as you learn the basics, different types of variables (int, string, global, local), different branching constructs (for loops, if-then-else, do while), sub procedures/functions and can *get* the concept of object oriented programming then I don't think it matters what language you use now.

Also try to get your head around some database stuff, I have found it is easy to use all the fancy commands in the world but takes more skill to get the relationships correct in any database you might be accessing / modifying.

cheers
Garrett.

ElevatorEscapee
11-06-2009, 08:18 PM
Whatever you do, don't bother learning to program in binary: there are only 10 kinds of people who understand binary, those who do and those who don't. ;)



PS. I would not recommend studying C as a precursor to C++ (worst then waste of time).
That is something I can personally attest to!! :D

ElmirGuseinov
13-06-2009, 03:18 AM
the best languages for a beginner imho are Ruby,Python and maybe C(without ++)
The first two have an easy to read source code,relatively simple syntax and constructions (like you can write a web server just in 5-6 lines)