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  1. #121
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    I'm pretty sure Michael's argument is the other way round: That Communism is a religion, and therefore hostile to other religions.
    Which also doesn't work because not all religions are hostile to other religions.

  2. #122
    Reader in Slood Dynamics Rincewind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    I'm pretty sure Michael's argument is the other way round: That Communism is a religion, and therefore hostile to other religions.
    It's couched in that form but the thrust of Michael's post is to conclude that Communism is a "religion" and the hostility towards "other religions" seems more like evidence for this conclusion than the other way around.
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  3. #123
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Or else: Communism is a particularly murderous political and economic philosophy that stems from the religion of dogmatic atheism, although not all or necessarily even most dogmatic atheists are Communists.
    “The destructive capacity of the individual, however vicious, is small; of the state, however well-intentioned, almost limitless. Expand the state and that destructive capacity necessarily expands, too, pari passu.”—Paul Johnson, Modern Times, 1983.

  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    Communism is definitely an ideology. But it has many features of a religion. Jim McClelland make that point here much more charmingly than I ever could. Vladimir Putin isn't quite so charming, but he agrees here.

    I'm pretty sure Michael's argument is the other way round: That Communism is a religion, and therefore hostile to other religions.
    If we look at Communist Russia or China for instance: The respective religions were fought aggressively. Reason being - those who believe in God can not believe in Communism same time so how to convince someone to believe in Communism if the person is Christian, Buddhist etc.

    One of defining features of a religion (along with with believing in super powers - and even this has been claimed in some countries such as North Korea) is ''a particular system of faith and worship.'' in communist countries - this is exactly what the State wanted people to believe in.
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  5. #125
    CC Grandmaster road runner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capablanca-Fan View Post
    Or else: Communism is a particularly murderous political and economic philosophy that stems from the religion of dogmatic atheism, although not all or necessarily even most dogmatic atheists are Communists.
    Atheism is a religion is the same way that not collecting stamps is a hobby.
    meep meep

  6. #126
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capablanca-Fan View Post
    Or else: Communism is a particularly murderous political and economic philosophy that stems from the religion of dogmatic atheism, although not all or necessarily even most dogmatic atheists are Communists.
    Except it doesn't. There is nothing in atheism, dogmatic or otherwise, that supports a communist approach to political economy as opposed to a capitalist or socialist or mixed or protectionist one or anything else. Ayn Rand was a dogmatic atheist and she certainly wasn't a communist!

    The causality is the other way around - practical communism employs dogmatic atheism because it is not very compatible with theism and requires on illiberal repression to survive.

  7. #127
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham View Post
    Except it doesn't. There is nothing in atheism, dogmatic or otherwise, that supports a communist approach to political economy as opposed to a capitalist or socialist or mixed or protectionist one or anything else. Ayn Rand was a dogmatic atheist and she certainly wasn't a communist!
    Hence my statement, "although not all or necessarily even most dogmatic atheists are Communists."

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham View Post
    The causality is the other way around — practical communism employs dogmatic atheism because it is not very compatible with theism and requires on illiberal repression to survive.
    That could well be right.
    “The destructive capacity of the individual, however vicious, is small; of the state, however well-intentioned, almost limitless. Expand the state and that destructive capacity necessarily expands, too, pari passu.”—Paul Johnson, Modern Times, 1983.

  8. #128
    CC Grandmaster antichrist's Avatar
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    this poor guy never got a word in edgeways

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    Zionism is racism as defined by the UN, Israel by every dirty means available steals land and water, kill Palestinian freedom fighters and civilians, and operates an apartheid system to drive more Palestinians off their land

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