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Thread: Homeschooling

  1. #1
    CC International Master TheJoker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jono
    Are you aware of any studies that follow-up on the workforce sucess of home schooled children. I have often wondered whether the socialisation process is better or worse for transition into the workplace, where there often more emphasis on group dynamics and team performance.

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    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheJoker
    Are you aware of any studies that follow-up on the workforce sucess of home schooled children.
    There are lots of them referenced. It makes sense: educrats are screaming for reduced class sizes so kids can get individual attention: homeschooling is the logical extension of this. And parents can avoid all the silly fads like look and guess and new maths. It's also no wonder that homeschooled kids often win spelling bees and science fair competitions.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheJoker
    I have often wondered whether the socialisation process is better or worse for transition into the workplace, where there often more emphasis on group dynamics and team performance.
    Actually, the usual experience is that school is a totally artificial form of socialization, with its age-segregated herds, peer pressure, and bullying, that has no relevance to adult life. The nearest thing in adulthood is prisons.
    “The history of the 20th century is full of examples of countries that set out to redistribute wealth and ended up redistributing poverty.”
    “There’s no point blaming the tragedies of socialism on the flaws or corruption of particular leaders. Any system which allows some people to exercise unbridled power over others is an open invitation to abuse, whether that system is called slavery or socialism or something else.”—Thomas Sowell

  3. #3
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheJoker
    Are you aware of any studies that follow-up on the workforce sucess of home schooled children. I have often wondered whether the socialisation process is better or worse for transition into the workplace, where there often more emphasis on group dynamics and team performance.
    I suspect that the intellectual and learning advantage that all but the least successful homeschoolings have over conventional education is so massive that it would drown out any disadvantages. I have not seen the studies either but I strongly suspect Jono's post above to be right.

  4. #4
    CC International Master TheJoker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham
    I suspect that the intellectual and learning advantage that all but the least successful homeschoolings have over conventional education is so massive that it would drown out any disadvantages. I have not seen the studies either but I strongly suspect Jono's post above to be right.
    I agree probably the teacher to student ratio of homeschooling gives a significant academic advantage. Even if there is a disadvantage in social skills (of which I haven't seen any evidence) they can probably be overcome quickly.

    Jono how does home-schooling compare in terms of economic efficiency? Obviously the economic cost per student of the teacher is much higher. However the a lot of capital infrastrucutre (buildings, computers etc) already exist in the home and are not utilised for a substaintial part of the day. Administration costs might be less I am not too sure.

  5. #5
    Reader in Slood Dynamics Rincewind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheJoker
    Jono how does home-schooling compare in terms of economic efficiency? Obviously the economic cost per student of the teacher is much higher. However the a lot of capital infrastrucutre (buildings, computers etc) already exist in the home and are not utilised for a substaintial part of the day. Administration costs might be less I am not too sure.
    I'd be more worried about the ability of the teachers to teach the more technical end of the spectrum. HSC Chemistry, Extension 2 mathematics, 3U languages, etc. And also the infrastructure required for some engineering, and science courses at that level. I assume the number of courses available to a home schooled child is more limited. At most high schools children have the option of at least 2 languages, various science strands, wood and metal work courses, engineering design, etc. If the options are limited what is the cost to the child and society of that reduced choice?
    So einfach wie möglich, aber nicht einfacher - Albert Einstein

  6. #6
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rincewind
    I'd be more worried about the ability of the teachers to teach the more technical end of the spectrum.
    But in many government schools, the teachers are not qualified in the areas they teach either. I've known maths teachers whose degrees were in English Lit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rincewind
    HSC Chemistry, Extension 2 mathematics, 3U languages, etc. And also the infrastructure required for some engineering, and science courses at that level. I assume the number of courses available to a home schooled child is more limited.
    Not at all. There are textbooks and teaching manuals for all sorts of subjects, from physics, chemistry and maths to Spanish and Japanese. Sometimes parents and children can learn together. Homeschoolers also have conferences and support groups, as well as access to trained people. For example, I took some through my Raman spectroscopy lab and demonstrated the laser and diffraction grating.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rincewind
    At most high schools children have the option of at least 2 languages, various science strands, wood and metal work courses, engineering design, etc. If the options are limited what is the cost to the child and society of that reduced choice?
    In practice, the government school curriculum has been dumbed down, so kids are hardly ever taught English grammar let along foreign, and waste time on PE and PC.
    “The history of the 20th century is full of examples of countries that set out to redistribute wealth and ended up redistributing poverty.”
    “There’s no point blaming the tragedies of socialism on the flaws or corruption of particular leaders. Any system which allows some people to exercise unbridled power over others is an open invitation to abuse, whether that system is called slavery or socialism or something else.”—Thomas Sowell

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    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheJoker
    I agree probably the teacher to student ratio of homeschooling gives a significant academic advantage. Even if there is a disadvantage in social skills (of which I haven't seen any evidence) they can probably be overcome quickly.
    Indeed. Indeed, the problem for most is adjusting from the artificial socialization of the schools to the adult world.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheJoker
    Jono how does home-schooling compare in terms of economic efficiency? Obviously the economic cost per student of the teacher is much higher.
    Not so obvious actually. There is such a thing as a diseconomy of scale. Much of the education budget is swallowed by the expanding bureaucracy.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheJoker
    However the a lot of capital infrastrucutre (buildings, computers etc) already exist in the home and are not utilised for a substaintial part of the day. Administration costs might be less I am not too sure.
    Most likely. If the government gave homeschooling parents a voucher that was even half the amount spent per government school pupil, more people would be able to afford it, and it would save the government a bundle. But the teachers unions wouldn't like it, although many of the teachers do NOT choose government schools for their OWN children.
    “The history of the 20th century is full of examples of countries that set out to redistribute wealth and ended up redistributing poverty.”
    “There’s no point blaming the tragedies of socialism on the flaws or corruption of particular leaders. Any system which allows some people to exercise unbridled power over others is an open invitation to abuse, whether that system is called slavery or socialism or something else.”—Thomas Sowell

  8. #8
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rincewind
    I'd be more worried about the ability of the teachers to teach the more technical end of the spectrum.
    I've certainly encountered some homeschooling fanatics online who were a real worry in this regard. There is one on my other main forum who is utterly scientophobic and extremely clueless about what science is.

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  10. #10
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    "Homeschooling is illegal in Germany under a law dating back to the Hitler era. Homeschooling families in the country have faced increasing persecution in recent years, with police in several cases physically transporting children to school and even removing one teenager from her parent's care."
    “The history of the 20th century is full of examples of countries that set out to redistribute wealth and ended up redistributing poverty.”
    “There’s no point blaming the tragedies of socialism on the flaws or corruption of particular leaders. Any system which allows some people to exercise unbridled power over others is an open invitation to abuse, whether that system is called slavery or socialism or something else.”—Thomas Sowell

  11. #11
    CC Grandmaster Adamski's Avatar
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    Plenty of resouces around for homeschooling

    As Jono said, there is no shortage of good resources avaialable for homeschooling. When my wife and I homeschooled our son there were plenty of books, CDs and videos (it was basically before DVDS) available to cover all the subjects we wanted to teach him. My wife had been a Teachers College student and knew lots of the recommended titles. Also, near us was (and still is - its in Brookvale, Northern Beaches NSW) a bookshop which specialised in educational materials and had the books that were part of several curricula. We mixed and matched "secular" books on Maths , English, History, Science e.g. and a U.S. Christian curriculum known as "Alpha and Omega".
    Last edited by Adamski; 23-12-2008 at 12:38 PM.
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  12. #12
    CC International Master Miranda's Avatar
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    I would hate to be homeschooled.

    I've known a few people who were homeschooled, and they all turned out.... a bit odd.
    It's time for man to enter the Solar System - Dan Quayle

  13. #13
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miranda
    I would hate to be homeschooled.
    I hated school, with the regression to the mean, and adulation of thugby and cricket and a correspondingly low regard for chess.

    Quote Originally Posted by Miranda
    I've known a few people who were homeschooled, and they all turned out.... a bit odd.
    I know a few homeschooled children, and they are not bratty and know how to talk to adults. I've known some government schooled kids who are rather odd because their socialization is entirely the artificially age-segregated herds.
    “The history of the 20th century is full of examples of countries that set out to redistribute wealth and ended up redistributing poverty.”
    “There’s no point blaming the tragedies of socialism on the flaws or corruption of particular leaders. Any system which allows some people to exercise unbridled power over others is an open invitation to abuse, whether that system is called slavery or socialism or something else.”—Thomas Sowell

  14. #14
    Reader in Slood Dynamics Rincewind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jono
    Sometimes parents and children can learn together.
    AKA the blind leading the blind.
    So einfach wie möglich, aber nicht einfacher - Albert Einstein

  15. #15
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rincewind
    AKA the blind leading the blind.
    Not if they have the right textbooks and teaching manuals.

    And there are plenty of government school teachers who don't know what they're talking about, since they are not qualified in the subjects they teach.
    “The history of the 20th century is full of examples of countries that set out to redistribute wealth and ended up redistributing poverty.”
    “There’s no point blaming the tragedies of socialism on the flaws or corruption of particular leaders. Any system which allows some people to exercise unbridled power over others is an open invitation to abuse, whether that system is called slavery or socialism or something else.”—Thomas Sowell

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