View Poll Results: Who will win? (This poll asks who will win, not who do you want to win)

Voters
11. You may not vote on this poll
  • Clinton (350+ EC votes)

    2 18.18%
  • Clinton (300-349 EC votes)

    5 45.45%
  • Clinton (270-299 EC votes)

    2 18.18%
  • Trump (270-299 EC votes)

    0 0%
  • Trump (300-349 EC votes) - CORRECT

    1 9.09%
  • Trump (350+ EC votes)

    1 9.09%
  • No electoral college majority

    0 0%
  • Someone else

    0 0%
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  1. #5101
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    John McCain diagnosed with brain cancer. The prognosis for this sort of brain cancer (glioblastoma) is particularly poor. One of my scientific colleagues died from this and was gone in a bit more than a year, which seems to be around the average.

  2. #5102
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    I am saying that the police (and other authorised people) are the only people who should be able to shoot to kill. And the Second Amendment is irrelevant in this situation - unless you're claiming that the US government is a tyranny under Trump
    I'm explaining the main rationale by the Founders for the Second Amendment. And since hundreds of millions of people were murdered in the 20th century by their own government, their rationale is prescient. Of course, they had also just revolted against what they claimed was a tyrannical government.

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    Of course the shooting bothers me. But this type of shooting is very rare in Australia, because police know that most suspects are not armed. If people follow your advice, then far more innocent people will be shot by police.
    Not at all. I've given you the real reason: the militarization of the police, and the general mentality that violence is justified to stop people putting substances in their own bodies.
    “The best part of adopting conservatism after years of leftism, by the way, is how much easier life becomes. If you’re a conservative, facts are generally all you need to establish a case or mount an argument. If you’re a leftist, however, you always have to find a way around the facts, which is why combative lefties always sound like lawyers knowingly representing a guilty client.”—Tim Blair

  3. #5103
    Batoutahelius road runner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capablanca-Fan View Post
    I'm explaining the main rationale by the Founders for the Second Amendment. And since hundreds of millions of people were murdered in the 20th century by their own government, their rationale is prescient. Of course, they had also just revolted against what they claimed was a tyrannical government.


    Not at all. I've given you the real reason: the militarization of the police, and the general mentality that violence is justified to stop people putting substances in their own bodies.
    So to you the scenario goes something like this:

    A woman is awoken by the sounds of what she thinks is a rape. She calls the police and waits inside for them to arrive. She then approaches the police car and pulls out her gun. A dog barks, so she shoots the officers through the window in the backs of their heads. You know, better safe than sorry.

    The world Jono wants to live in.
    meep meep

  4. #5104
    CC Grandmaster
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capablanca-Fan View Post
    I'm explaining the main rationale ... in their own bodies.
    Very interesting, but let's get back to the main issue. You still haven't answered my question:
    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    You didn't answer my question about whether it's okay to shoot a policeman who comes to your house and draws a gun. If you wait until he is pointing it at you, it's too late, so the only way that a person can follow your advice successfully is to shoot them first - correct?

  5. #5105
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by road runner View Post
    The world Jono wants to live in.
    More nonsense, when you're the one who brings up a police shooting of an innocent woman, but argues that police are the only ones who should have guns. But Americans revolted against what they claimed was a tyrannical government, so have the Second Amendment that makes sure that the people will not be disarmed against government again.
    “The best part of adopting conservatism after years of leftism, by the way, is how much easier life becomes. If you’re a conservative, facts are generally all you need to establish a case or mount an argument. If you’re a leftist, however, you always have to find a way around the facts, which is why combative lefties always sound like lawyers knowingly representing a guilty client.”—Tim Blair

  6. #5106
    Batoutahelius road runner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capablanca-Fan View Post
    More nonsense, when you're the one who brings up a police shooting of an innocent woman, but argues that police are the only ones who should have guns.
    You're the one who has claimed that packing heat would have saved her, and not outlined any series of events where that could have occurred.
    meep meep

  7. #5107
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by road runner View Post
    You're the one who has claimed that packing heat would have saved her, and not outlined any series of events where that could have occurred.
    You're the one who claimed that although it was the police that shot an unarmed woman, disarming law abiding citizens and leaving police with guns is a good idea.
    “The best part of adopting conservatism after years of leftism, by the way, is how much easier life becomes. If you’re a conservative, facts are generally all you need to establish a case or mount an argument. If you’re a leftist, however, you always have to find a way around the facts, which is why combative lefties always sound like lawyers knowingly representing a guilty client.”—Tim Blair

  8. #5108
    Batoutahelius road runner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capablanca-Fan View Post
    You're the one who claimed that although it was the police that shot an unarmed woman, disarming law abiding citizens and leaving police with guns is a good idea.
    Actually my own view is that it would have made no difference if she was carrying a gun or not.

    In contrast, with this exchange:
    rr: So what exactly are you advocating anyway, that this poor woman should have been carrying so she could have shot the police before they shot her?
    CF: Of course.
    you are saying that she could have changed the outcome. The question is, how? Perhaps you can outline at what point you think she should have shot the police, that would help me to understand why you think that.
    meep meep

  9. #5109
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Trump critics failing their own ethics tests
    Jonathan Turley, Shapiro Professor of Public Interest Law at George Washington University
    USA Today, 21 July 2017

    When it comes to ethics, the attorney general has handled himself much better than other officials have recently.

    Jeff Sessions: Pass

    The next major government ethics challenge was faced by Sessions — the decision that led to Trump’s statement that he would not have appointed Sessions had he known that he would recuse himself. Ironically, this was the only passing grade of any figure in Washington in one of the recent scandals. Sessions yielded to the obvious ethical concerns over heading an investigation into alleged campaign wrongdoing, given his critical role in that campaign. Ethical rules require not simply the avoidance of conflicts but even the appearance of conflicts. Sessions did that and, in this group, he proved the curve breaker by taking the difficult but ethical course.

    James Comey: Fail

    Former FBI director James Comey has been lionized for leaking memos damaging to Trump and his obvious violation of professional and ethical standards. Comey insisted that he had the right to give the memos to a friend to leak to the news media because the memos were his personal property. The memos were clearly government documents and presumably classified at the confidential or higher levels. Media experts rushed to his side and claimed that the memos were like his personal diary, and one CNN legal analyst (and former FBI agent) Asha Rangappa insisted that the memos constitute merely “personal recollections.” The FBI has since confirmed the obvious that the memos are indeed FBI material, and Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein this week stated that the memos were confidential and should not have been released. Other reports have confirmed that at least some of the memos were classified. In removing these FBI documents, Comey (who was tasked by Trump to find leakers in his administration) became a leaker himself when it served his interests.

    Robert Mueller: Incomplete

    One would think that the man who was appointed special counsel to investigate this mess would be clear of even the slightest ethical or professional concerns. From the outset, Robert Mueller was a curious choice. Mueller has a long and deep history with Comey and, according to CNN, interviewed for Comey’s job after Comey was fired by Trump. It seems highly unlikely that Trump did not discuss the termination of Comey with Mueller, as well as what he expected from a replacement during that interview. This makes him a potential witness. At the very least, Mueller should have addressed this conflict publicly and stated how he has taken steps to address it. Trump claimed this week that Mueller has "many other conflicts" that he may reveal later. In any case, the public remains in the dark because neither he nor Mueller have fully disclosed their past dealings. Since Mueller could still make such a record, he can at best eke out an incomplete.
    “The best part of adopting conservatism after years of leftism, by the way, is how much easier life becomes. If you’re a conservative, facts are generally all you need to establish a case or mount an argument. If you’re a leftist, however, you always have to find a way around the facts, which is why combative lefties always sound like lawyers knowingly representing a guilty client.”—Tim Blair

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