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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter_parr
    FIDE titles were given away in the Fiji sub zonal with 5 beginners (4 from Fiji, 1 from NZ) scoring 25 losses from 25 games (against rated players) giving every Australian 5 of 5 in a 9 round event. Every Australian was FIDE titled after this Fiji event – all scored above 50%!!
    Let's clarify what you're talking about here. You are actually referring to the Women's zonal, not the Open zonal. Is that correct?

  2. #62
    CC Grandmaster arosar's Avatar
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    I think Peter will only be made happy if some of the blokes followed Cathy Forbes' example. She'd apparently had some sort of feminist "eureka" moment and returned her WIM title to FIDE.

    AR

  3. #63
    Account Permanently Banned PHAT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by arosar
    Cathy Forbes' example.
    More info please.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter_parr
    FIDE titles were given away in the Fiji sub zonal with 5 beginners (4 from Fiji, 1 from NZ) scoring 25 losses from 25 games (against rated players) giving every Australian 5 of 5 in a 9 round event. Every Australian was FIDE titled after this Fiji event – all scored above 50%!!
    Quote Originally Posted by pax
    Let's clarify what you're talking about here. You are actually referring to the Women's zonal, not the Open zonal. Is that correct?
    Correct – Women’s sub-zonal.
    50% or 67% was extremely easy for all Australians with five Australians scoring 25-0 against unrated locals (each 5 out of 5 in the 9 round event).

    All the world championship sub-zonals Gold Coast, Fiji, New Zealand are held with open sub-zonals and women’s sub-zonals.

    Titles awarded in each and every event are IM, FM, WIM, WFM.

    14 new FIDE titles awarded to Australians players alone in Gold Coast Zonal – 6 new FIDE titles awarded in Fiji and another 6 in New Zealand.

    Brian Jones is right about the “snowball” effect.

    New Zealand and Fiji had already numerous titled players from Gold Coast Zonal and the next in line picked up more titles in Fiji and NZ.

    Finally in the Gold Coast Open Sub Zonal players scored 2 out of 2 against under 1400 rated players and 2.5/7 against players over 1400 drawing with each other on their way to FIDE titles.

    All FIDE titles are de-valued if we continue with this way with this “snowball” supported by Brian Jones who wants more and more titles this way – absurd.

  5. #65
    CC International Master Brian_Jones's Avatar
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    I saw an enjoyable series on TV recently. It was called "Grumpy Old Men".
    Have I got the wrong thread?

  6. #66
    CC Grandmaster Alan Shore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian_Jones
    I saw an enjoyable series on TV recently. It was called "Grumpy Old Men".
    Have I got the wrong thread?
    Yep, this is the right thread.

    It's amusing seeing these little Parr vs. Jones jibes, hehe.
    "I can't go back to yesterday because I was a different person then."
    - White Queen, Alice through the Looking-Glass

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian_Jones
    I saw an enjoyable series on TV recently. It was called "Grumpy Old Men".
    Have I got the wrong thread?
    Yesterday in my chess shop in the Sydney CBD a regular customer (ELO rating over 300 higher than yours) has no FIDE title and does not want one.

    He is a real Master having won literally dozens of games against Grandmasters and numerous draws against leading grandmasters (including Spassky) in high level tournaments. Ten minutes analysis with the real Master shows his very high standard even in 2006.

    He sees FIDE give away Master titles to players ranked outside the World's top 25,000 rated players.

    I had many conversations in a bygone era with my old friend Dr Max Euwe, FIDE President, World Champion and he would have never have allowed FIDE Titles to be awarded to club players regardless of strength.

    Australia has a responsibility to FIDE, all nations and all genuine title-holders to ensure that titles are awarded only to players who have performed at the level required for their title.

    I object in the strongest terms as do all genuine chess enthusiasts that the idea of creating as many titles as possible regardless of strength as suggested by Brian undermines the entire credibility of Master Titles and FIDE.

    I am not surprised you thoroughly enjoyed the TV Series "Grumpy Old Men" no doubt consuming more cornflakes hoping for more titles to pop out of the packet.

    Next Sunday I will be out and about again at the 2006 City of Sydney - having played thousands of games since my first visit to a tournament in 1946.

    Why not play in the City of Sydney(see you at the bookstall) and try and qualify for the NSW Championship - a title of prestige won only by champions.

    Perhaps, sadly you are too set in your ways, and prefer to watch the television.

  8. #68
    CC Grandmaster Spiny Norman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter_parr
    I object in the strongest terms as do all genuine chess enthusiasts that the idea of creating as many titles as possible regardless of strength as suggested by Brian undermines the entire credibility of Master Titles and FIDE.
    Peter, I must be having a particularly crabby day ... but I object to people making arbitrary pronouncements about what "all genuine chess enthusiasts" find objectionable. Have you made an exhaustive survey?
    “As you perhaps know, I haven't always been a Christian. I didn't go to religion to make me happy. I always knew a bottle of port would do that. If you want a religion to make you feel really comfortable, I certainly don't recommend Christianity.” -- C.S.Lewis

  9. #69
    CC International Master Watto's Avatar
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    Has there been a chesschat poll on soft titles? I think the cons outweigh any possible pros there might be.

  10. #70
    CC Grandmaster Spiny Norman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Watto
    Has there been a chesschat poll on soft titles? I think the cons outweigh any possible pros there might be.
    I wonder what the Yanks think ... don't they have nationally-awarded "titles", or perhaps more accurately, "players classes" of sorts that lower-ranked players can achieve (i.e. "National Master", based on the USA ratings though, not on FIDE ratings?). I kind of like the idea of an ACF-rating-based title such as that.
    “As you perhaps know, I haven't always been a Christian. I didn't go to religion to make me happy. I always knew a bottle of port would do that. If you want a religion to make you feel really comfortable, I certainly don't recommend Christianity.” -- C.S.Lewis

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frosty
    I kind of like the idea of an ACF-rating-based title such as that.
    They did exist, you used to be able access the list of what they were on the NSWCA wed site, but they don't seem to be there any more.
    Dyslexics of the world untie

  12. #72
    CC FIDE Master bobby1972's Avatar
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    who cares,i mean whats it worth free entry in to a turny whats that man say 200 a year on average.

  13. #73
    CC International Master Brian_Jones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian_Jones
    This is why, when Australia was offered all those "undeserved" zonal titles some years ago in the Gold Coast, we should have kept quiet and just grabbed as many tiles as possible. The more active titled players the better - it helps future title aspirants and has a snowball effect that has not yet been seen in Australia or New Zealand!
    I think we may have lost our way in the subsequent discussion. I started by referring to supposedly "undeserved" titles. I did not say the titles were undeserving. FIDE awards the titles (in accordance with the rules at the time) and they do so for life.

    FIDE recognise that a person achieved a certain standard at some point in time in their life. This person may not be able to maintain the standard for ever but can help others obtain titles by playing in events where a certain number of nationalities and titled players are required. In Australia we need everyone deserving of FIDE titles to apply for them and help others deserving to obtain titles.

    I have not accused anyone of gaining soft titles (I leave that to others). In the main, everyone in Australia has gained their title fairly. I am personally happy to gain an FM title in the modern Oceania Zonals to reward me for obtaining a BCF rating of 2300+ some twenty years ago.

    Perhaps others want to make this a personal issue and they should question their own motives!

  14. #74
    CC FIDE Master Phil Bourke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian_Jones
    I am personally happy to gain an FM title in the modern Oceania Zonals to reward me for obtaining a BCF rating of 2300+ some twenty years ago.
    Does this make your title posthumous?
    Get into chess, its a lifetime of enjoyment!
    Blayney Chess Club is online
    http://blayneychessclub.com

  15. #75
    Account Permanently Banned PHAT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Bourke
    Does this make your title posthumous?
    Or is it merely rank tittleation?

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