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  1. #46
    CC Grandmaster Garvinator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Gletsos
    Unless of course Kellogs could be persuaded to sponsor the next zonal.
    Now there is an idea

  2. #47
    CC Grandmaster Alan Shore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Gletsos
    Unless of course Kellogs could be persuaded to sponsor the next zonal.
    Haha, awesome!
    "I can't go back to yesterday because I was a different person then."
    - White Queen, Alice through the Looking-Glass

  3. #48
    CC International Master Rhubarb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew Sweeney
    Didn't you beat a some GM 9.5/10 games or something. Help us remember.
    Leonid managed to beat Issay Kagan 9-1 in a friendly "match", thus hitting 2400 just as his time was running out (there were still deadlines on norms and ratings back then). Quite a fortuitous coincidence.

    Since I'm not mincing words now, my predecessor, International Arbiter Gary Bekker, somehow decided that this was OK, even though he freely admits to not being present while most of the "games" were being "played" in this "match". Gary also allowed this "match" to be rated by FIDE, although I believe the ACF Ratings Officer had the good sense to refuse this match for rating.

    FIDE has since refused to rate such friendly matches; not the only time that FIDE has amended its regulations in response to abuse of the system by Australians.

  4. #49
    CC Grandmaster Alan Shore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greg
    Leonid managed to beat Issay Kagan 9-1 in a friendly "match", thus hitting 2400 just as his time was running out (there were still deadlines on norms and ratings back then). Quite a fortuitous coincidence.

    Since I'm not mincing words now, my predecessor, International Arbiter Gary Bekker, somehow decided that this was OK, even though he freely admits to not being present while most of the "games" were being "played" in this "match". Gary also allowed this "match" to be rated by FIDE, although I believe the ACF Ratings Officer had the good sense to refuse this match for rating.
    Well... dodgy as! What's the story Leonid?

    FIDE has since refused to rate such friendly matches; not the only time that FIDE has amended its regulations in response to abuse of the system by Australians.
    The other well known instance is the Zonal where sub-2300's, including an 1800 players got FM titles but are there others?
    "I can't go back to yesterday because I was a different person then."
    - White Queen, Alice through the Looking-Glass

  5. #50
    Account Permanently Banned PHAT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greg
    Leonid managed to ...
    Thanks Greg. I guess Leonid had "forgotten" the circumstances and decided to let someone else remember for him.

    I wonder: Was there an appearence fee for Kagan? I think a few thousand dollars would be in order.

  6. #51
    . eclectic's Avatar
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    a similar idea had already occurred to me

    Quote Originally Posted by peter_parr
    FIDE master titles do not come out of cornflakes packets.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Gletsos
    Unless of course Kellogs could be persuaded to sponsor the next zonal.
    http://www.chesschat.org/showpost.ph...59&postcount=7

    guess my pun went over people's heads or was really, really bad



    .

  7. #52
    CC Grandmaster arosar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eclectic
    http://www.chesschat.org/showpost.ph...59&postcount=7

    guess my pun went over people's heads or was really, really bad



    You used too many words.

    AR

  8. #53
    CC International Master Rhubarb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew Sweeney
    Thanks Greg. I guess Leonid had "forgotten" the circumstances and decided to let someone else remember for him.

    I wonder: Was there an appearence fee for Kagan? I think a few thousand dollars would be in order.
    wtf? account sharing's illegal apparently.

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by eclectic
    guess my pun went over people's heads or was really, really bad
    I got it. It was good.

  10. #55
    . eclectic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by arosar
    You used too many words.

    AR
    i guess part of the queenstown bug and resultant verbal diahhorea which hit you must have rubbed off a little on me too ...
    .

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by pax
    Regarding the 1999 event, this seems to be somewhat of an exaggeration. eclectic has now posted the crosstable: which of these players do you regard as 'low-rated club players'. Maybe five of the 26 players were rated below 2000 ACF, of these two qualified for the FM title (one didn't apply for the title).

    This is a pretty misleading statement. You make it seem like there were a lot of players around this 1400 mark. Of the 26 players, one was unrated (the Fijian), and I can only see one other who might possibly have been rated below 1400 (I don't have old ACF lists, so don't know for sure).

    I can say for certain that none of the 26 players has an ACF rating today under 1700.
    hmm, are we going to see a retraction of the original post
    now we know most of the facts are wrong or misleading?!

    this is the problem with people making 'authorative sounding' posts
    when they didn't actually go to the event (or attend any tournaments or club for that matter). they get it all wrong.

    it's well documented the 1999 tournament didn't turn out as intended.
    however, future tournaments have given titles to players who had performance ratings of 2200-2300. this is not too bad.
    still, i think a minimun criteria (eg. attain 2300 FIDE) should be introduced.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by greg
    Leonid managed to beat Issay Kagan 9-1 in a friendly "match", thus hitting 2400 just as his time was running out (there were still deadlines on norms and ratings back then). Quite a fortuitous coincidence.

    Since I'm not mincing words now, my predecessor, International Arbiter Gary Bekker, somehow decided that this was OK, even though he freely admits to not being present while most of the "games" were being "played" in this "match". Gary also allowed this "match" to be rated by FIDE, although I believe the ACF Ratings Officer had the good sense to refuse this match for rating.

    FIDE has since refused to rate such friendly matches; not the only time that FIDE has amended its regulations in response to abuse of the system by Australians.
    wasn't there also some question mark over the indonesia tournament as well?
    in fairness, leonid is IM strength - maybe his path to the IM title is best left in history.

    however, herein lies the problem. the 'old fashioned' road to the title involved few opportunities hence the need to bend the rules. the oceania zonal (which previously required travel to vietnam/malaysia) now improves those opportunies (we just need to add the extra criteria rules for FM/IM to avoid problems from 1999)

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by auriga
    hmm, are we going to see a retraction of the original post
    now we know most of the facts are wrong or misleading?!

    this is the problem with people making 'authorative sounding' posts
    when they didn't actually go to the event (or attend any tournaments or club for that matter). they get it all wrong.

    it's well documented the 1999 tournament didn't turn out as intended.
    however, future tournaments have given titles to players who had performance ratings of 2200-2300. this is not too bad.
    still, i think a minimun criteria (eg. attain 2300 FIDE) should be introduced.
    23 of the 26 Australians rated above 1400 who competed in the Gold Coast were internationally titled just after the events in 1999.

    Pax and Auriga please note this statement made by me in regard to the Gold Coast sub zonal of 1999 is correct.

    One player from the World Championship Gold Coast Sub-Zonal 1999 Qualified for the next stage of the World Championship was awarded a FIDE International title average rating of opponents from the 10 games was 1459.

    All other players who scored 50% in the event were also awarded FIDE International titles.

    It is an established fact that only three of the 26 Australians rated above 1400 remained untitled after the Gold Coast sub zonal. Nine of the 26 Australians were already titled before the sub zonal and Australia received another 14 new FIDE

    International titles from the Gold Coast making 23 of the 26 Australians above 1400 titled.

    Later sub-zonals in Fiji and New Zealand created further similar titles.

    FIDE titles were given away in the Fiji sub zonal with 5 beginners (4 from Fiji, 1 from NZ) scoring 25 losses from 25 games (against rated players) giving every Australian 5 of 5 in a 9 round event. Every Australian was FIDE titled after this Fiji event all scored above 50%!!

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter_parr
    FIDE titles were given away in the Fiji sub zonal with 5 beginners (4 from Fiji, 1 from NZ) scoring 25 losses from 25 games (against rated players) giving every Australian 5 of 5 in a 9 round event. Every Australian was FIDE titled after this Fiji event all scored above 50%!!
    Bill Egan did not score 50%, and was not titled after the event.

    Only two Australians without titles scored 50% or more in this event. Those players shared the same surname - no prizes for guessing that name!

  15. #60
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    I also note that Stuart Fancy and Paul Spiller remain untitled despite 50% scores in the Fiji Zonal. Was this after the rule change to limit titles to 2 FM and 1 IM?

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