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  1. #91
    CC Grandmaster arosar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kerry Stead
    What are the 'St George mob' unhappy about?
    Oh you are such a gossiper!! Mate, you've been talking too much yourself. I know this!

    AR

  2. #92
    CC International Master Kerry Stead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemonruski
    P.S. I hope no-one posts anything in disagreement with anything I have said, it may "suggest" that I am a liar and could be considered defamatory.
    Not in this case ... but there have been times in the past ... probably ...


    Yes, the above comment was not entirely serious ... in case you didn't get it!

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by bergil
    What a storm in a tea cup, SAC should withdraw and go sulk in a corner and let the other play in peace.

    They huff and puff about withdrawing but are really stalling to hear the result of the game between STGeorge vs Canterbury, if Saints win they withdraw, if Canterbury wins they stay in.

    Just wait and see, SAC will either say they are poor victims or Winners over adversity. Go sell that crap to the fox network, we don't need it.
    Iíve now heard that St. G lost last night. And guess what, we are still withdrawn. bergil, do you feel like retracting that comment now?

  4. #94
    Illuminati Bill Gletsos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemonruski
    As the person who wrote the email that was removed I guess I should say something about it too.

    Bill Gletsos sent an email insisting that it be taken down as he claimed it was "defamatory". Apparently, anything that suggests his arguments are not entirely valid and based on facts is defamatory. His claim was that the email suggested he was a liar, when it did no such thing.
    Of course it did,
    You called my arguments untruthful.
    The Force can have a strong influence on the weak-minded.

  5. #95
    Account Permanently Banned PHAT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Bird
    A withdrawal from the competition would be an unauthorised withdrawal and may be subject to disciplinary action by the Council.
    A threat?

  6. #96
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    Bill, I have a suggestion. Now we have withdrawn, our match played against Canterbury should not be counted, and the finals now be treated as a three team round robin. We scored 2.5 against Canterbury, if that stood and we where counted as forfeiting 4-0 against the other teams, that would unfairly disadvantage Canterbury.

  7. #97
    Illuminati Bill Gletsos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Bird
    Bill, I have a suggestion. Now we have withdrawn, our match played against Canterbury should not be counted, and the finals now be treated as a three team round robin. We scored 2.5 against Canterbury, if that stood and we where counted as forfeiting 4-0 against the other teams, that would unfairly disadvantage Canterbury.
    I would agree. That decision however is ultimately up to the Council.
    The Force can have a strong influence on the weak-minded.

  8. #98
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    Wink

    Below is a copy of an email I sent to the NSWCA Council requesting a fair appeal. It has previously been removed by request of one of the Council members on the basis it was defamatory.

    Although I disagree with this entirely, in the spirit of co-operation I have deleted the supposedly defamatory comments. I am re-posting this email because even excluding the deleted sentence it contains a number of valid points in this argument that I honestly just don't have time to rewrite.


    Dear NSWCA Council Members,

    As you have no doubt heard, we are very unhappy with not only the outcome of our appeal in the grade matches, but also with the unfair appeals process.

    Our appeal was against the actions of those responsible for producing the draw for the final rounds of the grade matches, ie Bill Gletsos and Peter Cassettari. It is astounding to us that both of these parties were not only
    allowed to vote on this matter, but that Bill Gletsos was also allowed to influence all members of the council.

    After we put forward our protest, we were not given any further opportunity
    to argue our case. In ridiculous contrast, one of the people protested against
    was able to see our arguments, then argue his case directly to the other council members, and participate in the vote! All his correspondence with other council members is in secret, which means that there is no-one to check any of the facts, and this also gives us no opportunity to disprove any of his arguments. By his own admission this is completely unfair.

    To give you an idea of the power of his unfair influence, I would like you to consider this:
    -The members of both of the other teams in the final (besides St George and
    Sydney Academy) believe that the published draw in the grade match booklet was the draw for the final rounds - they took it as being published.
    -Every single other person invloved in the tournament that we have discussed this with (including captains from teams that did not make the finals) also agree that the draw was published at the beginning of the tournament.
    -The only (9?) people who seem to think that it "doesn't count" have all had lengthy emails from Bill Gletsos full of his opinion on the matter, supported by very convincing (although *******************************) arguments trying to counter everything said in the appeal.
    Don't pretend this is a coincidence when you know that you have put an undeserved amount of trust in Bill's opinion and did not feel the need to check the facts or come to your own independent decision.

    We would like to propose that a FAIR appeals committee be formed to hear this matter. The committee should be made of 3 INDEPENDENT parties, who are not members of any club participating in the tournament or members of he
    NSWCA council. It would be preferable for the committee to be made of 3 International Arbiters, because a knowledge of the rules is very important for a fair outcome.

    Both sides of the argument should also have a fair chance to state their case. We should be given a chance to respond to Bill's arguments and vice versa, we should not be treated unfairly just because we are not on the council.

    If the NSWCA is willing to do the right thing and allow a fair appeals process,
    we are willing to abide by the decision the committee makes and not withdraw from the competition.

    If the NSWCA refuses to allow a proper appeal, we will be forced to stand by our decision to withdraw because of changes to the rules during the tournament.

    I look forward to your response.

    Laura Moylan,
    on behalf of all teams members,
    Sydney Academy


    ***Please let me know if you have any other problems with the material in this post and I will be more than happy to delete that information

  9. #99
    Account Permanently Banned PHAT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Gletsos
    untruthful
    = porkies

  10. #100
    CC Grandmaster arosar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Gletsos
    I would agree. That decision however is ultimately up to the Council.
    But I'm sure you could ever so gently prod them, no?

    AR

  11. #101
    CC Grandmaster arosar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemonruski
    Below is a copy of an email I sent to the NSWCA Council requesting a fair appeal. It has previously been removed by request of one of the Council members on the basis it was defamatory.

    Although I disagree with this entirely, in the spirit of co-operation I have deleted the supposedly defamatory comments. I am re-posting this email because even excluding the deleted sentence it contains a number of valid points in this argument that I honestly just don't have time to rewrite.


    Dear NSWCA Council Members,

    As you have no doubt heard, we are very unhappy with not only the outcome of our appeal in the grade matches, but also with the unfair appeals process.

    Our appeal was against the actions of those responsible for producing the draw for the final rounds of the grade matches, ie Bill Gletsos and Peter Cassettari. It is astounding to us that both of these parties were not only
    allowed to vote on this matter, but that Bill Gletsos was also allowed to influence all members of the council.

    After we put forward our protest, we were not given any further opportunity
    to argue our case. In ridiculous contrast, one of the people protested against
    was able to see our arguments, then argue his case directly to the other council members, and participate in the vote! All his correspondence with other council members is in secret, which means that there is no-one to check any of the facts, and this also gives us no opportunity to disprove any of his arguments. By his own admission this is completely unfair.

    To give you an idea of the power of his unfair influence, I would like you to consider this:
    -The members of both of the other teams in the final (besides St George and
    Sydney Academy) believe that the published draw in the grade match booklet was the draw for the final rounds - they took it as being published.
    -Every single other person invloved in the tournament that we have discussed this with (including captains from teams that did not make the finals) also agree that the draw was published at the beginning of the tournament.
    -The only (9?) people who seem to think that it "doesn't count" have all had lengthy emails from Bill Gletsos full of his opinion on the matter, supported by very convincing (although *******************************) arguments trying to counter everything said in the appeal.
    Don't pretend this is a coincidence when you know that you have put an undeserved amount of trust in Bill's opinion and did not feel the need to check the facts or come to your own independent decision.

    We would like to propose that a FAIR appeals committee be formed to hear this matter. The committee should be made of 3 INDEPENDENT parties, who are not members of any club participating in the tournament or members of he
    NSWCA council. It would be preferable for the committee to be made of 3 International Arbiters, because a knowledge of the rules is very important for a fair outcome.

    Both sides of the argument should also have a fair chance to state their case. We should be given a chance to respond to Bill's arguments and vice versa, we should not be treated unfairly just because we are not on the council.

    If the NSWCA is willing to do the right thing and allow a fair appeals process,
    we are willing to abide by the decision the committee makes and not withdraw from the competition.

    If the NSWCA refuses to allow a proper appeal, we will be forced to stand by our decision to withdraw because of changes to the rules during the tournament.

    I look forward to your response.

    Laura Moylan,
    on behalf of all teams members,
    Sydney Academy


    ***Please let me know if you have any other problems with the material in this post and I will be more than happy to delete that information
    No fair. That part I removed from my site is still there. So that is it then. It's going back up.

    AR

  12. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Gletsos
    Of course it did,
    You called my arguments untruthful.
    I cannot argue my point without disagreeing with yours. I did not feel this was a personal attack on you as I referred to your arguments and not to you personally.

    That said, I have removed this remark and I apologise if it caused any offence. I do honestly wish to resolve this in a civilised way which is why I did what I thought was the right thing and appealed directly to the council in the first place.

  13. #103
    Illuminati Bill Gletsos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by arosar
    But I'm sure you could ever so gently prod them, no?
    You do the other Council members a disservice by suggesting they would blindly follow my lead.
    In fact if they did NSW wouldnt be rating non NSWCA events in which suspended players like Ilic can still play.
    The Force can have a strong influence on the weak-minded.

  14. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by arosar
    No fair. That part I removed from my site is still there. So that is it then. It's going back up.

    AR
    It's the *********** bit which is the problem.

  15. #105
    CC Grandmaster arosar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Bird
    It's the *********** bit which is the problem.
    But this was the only part that I quoted:

    "Our appeal was against the actions of those responsible for producing the draw for the final rounds of the grade matches, ie Bill Gletsos and Peter Cassettari. It is astounding to us that both of these parties were not only
    allowed to vote on this matter, but that Bill Gletsos was also allowed to influence all members of the council."

    That's it. I put it back as my blog is presently unbecoming of itself with that ugly red text.

    AR

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