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  1. #16
    CC Grandmaster Desmond's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    could certainly make Fabi's job of holding harder.
    Holding? Magnus was defending for the entire game!
    So what's your excuse? To run like the devil's chasing you.

    See you in another life, brotha.

  2. #17
    CC Grandmaster Desmond's Avatar
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    Round 8
    Carlsen - Tari W 3-0
    Caruana - Firouzja DW 1.5 - 1
    Duda (black) - Aronian DW 1.5-1

    Aronian's Arma curse continues with the 4th loss from 4 tries.

    Standings after round 8
    1. Carlsen 16.5
    2. Firouzja 15.5
    3. Aronian 13
    4. Caruana 12.5
    5. Duda 8.5
    6. Tari 1.5

    The live ratings haven't changed much this year obviously. But this tournament current has Firouzja gaining 18.4 pts and 4 places to world #18, passing Naka, Topalov, Harikishna, and Wei Yi.
    So what's your excuse? To run like the devil's chasing you.

    See you in another life, brotha.

  3. #18
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    Magnus back in the lead. Not that it is surprising...
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  4. #19
    CC Grandmaster Desmond's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    Magnus back in the lead. Not that it is surprising...
    Yes, Alireza-Magnus tonight, that should more or less settle things. Though with the scoring system, it could come down to the last round.
    So what's your excuse? To run like the devil's chasing you.

    See you in another life, brotha.

  5. #20
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Desmond View Post
    Yes, Alireza-Magnus tonight, that should more or less settle things. Though with the scoring system, it could come down to the last round.
    Yes, Magnus gained the slightest edge in a very symmetrical position, and eventually won a P. This shouldn't have been enough to win, but Alireza inexplicably blundered on his last move and let Mag take opposition, which was enough to make Ali resign.
    “The history of the 20th century is full of examples of countries that set out to redistribute wealth and ended up redistributing poverty.”
    “There’s no point blaming the tragedies of socialism on the flaws or corruption of particular leaders. Any system which allows some people to exercise unbridled power over others is an open invitation to abuse, whether that system is called slavery or socialism or something else.”—Thomas Sowell

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capablanca-Fan View Post
    Yes, Magnus gained the slightest edge in a very symmetrical position, and eventually won a P. This shouldn't have been enough to win, but Alireza inexplicably blundered on his last move and let Mag take opposition, which was enough to make Ali resign.
    Magnus is very good at creating opportunities ''out of nothing''.
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  7. #22
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    Carlsen win the tournament. Finished with a loss to Levon Aronian with the white pieces. Firouzja fineshed on the second place.
    3. Aronian

  8. #23
    CC Grandmaster Desmond's Avatar
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    Yes the final standings were:

    1 Carlsen, Magnus 19½
    2 Firouzja, Alireza 18½
    3 Aronian, Levon 17½
    4 Caruana, Fabiano 15½
    5 Duda, Jan-Krzysztof 9½
    6 Tari, Aryan 3½

    If you used conventional scoring and didn't have arma, the standings would be quite different:

    1-3 Carlsen, Firouzja, Aronian 6.5/10
    4 Caruana 5.5/10
    5 Duda 3.5/10
    6 Tari 1.5/10

    Firouzja gained 20 rating points to move to world #17, passing Duda in addition to the 4 players I mentioned in #17. Aronian gained 14.4 and moves back up to #6.
    So what's your excuse? To run like the devil's chasing you.

    See you in another life, brotha.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Desmond View Post
    Yes the final standings were:

    1 Carlsen, Magnus 19½
    2 Firouzja, Alireza 18½
    3 Aronian, Levon 17½
    4 Caruana, Fabiano 15½
    5 Duda, Jan-Krzysztof 9½
    6 Tari, Aryan 3½

    If you used conventional scoring and didn't have arma, the standings would be quite different:

    1-3 Carlsen, Firouzja, Aronian 6.5/10
    4 Caruana 5.5/10
    5 Duda 3.5/10
    6 Tari 1.5/10
    This is similar to what could be expected, with the caveat that the results might have been different if the scoring was different. The effect of the scoring system is that a player who loses the Armageddon in a drawn game is scored as if the system was 3/1/0 and the winner as if it was normal scoring but scaled up to 3/1.5/0. Or viewed another way, the loser of the Armageddon drops one-sixth of a point relative to normal scoring.

    That means the Armageddons are principally a bizarre form of tie-break, where the tied players play off against different players, probably including players they didn't tie with and possibly not including the player they did tie with.

    Armageddons will only reverse the order of placings where two players were close on normal scoring but not tied and have a very different Armageddon record. That could have happened with Carlsen v Aronian in this instance and that's likely to be the closest it gets.

  10. #25
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    At least the current format appeared to be more fun for the public.
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  11. #26
    CC Grandmaster Desmond's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Rout View Post
    This is similar to what could be expected, with the caveat that the results might have been different if the scoring was different.
    Yes, I doubt Magnus would play so poorly in the last round if he hadn't already been assured of first.

    Armageddons will only reverse the order of placings where two players were close on normal scoring but not tied and have a very different Armageddon record. That could have happened with Carlsen v Aronian in this instance and that's likely to be the closest it gets.
    Aronian scored well in classical but only 1/5 in arma.
    So what's your excuse? To run like the devil's chasing you.

    See you in another life, brotha.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    At least the current format appeared to be more fun for the public.
    No doubt, but it's a shame to ruin what could be a perfectly good Armageddon tournament with all that slow chess.

    Another scoring system, which they may well use next year, is to dispense with Armageddons and instead count points from the cake-baking competition. In that system Aronian would have won.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Rout View Post
    No doubt, but it's a shame to ruin what could be a perfectly good Armageddon tournament with all that slow chess.

    Another scoring system, which they may well use next year, is to dispense with Armageddons and instead count points from the cake-baking competition. In that system Aronian would have won.
    I think the reality is - slow chess is less spectacular so the new time controls/scoring systems do help to build up the audience. At some point, too many games in the super tournaments have been ending in boring colorless draws.
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  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    I think the reality is - slow chess is less spectacular so the new time controls/scoring systems do help to build up the audience. At some point, too many games in the super tournaments have been ending in boring colorless draws.
    I suppose the issue becomes whether people can be convinced that it's worth sitting through several hours of a potentially colourless draw for the prospect of eventually seeing an Armageddon which goes too quickly to follow or for commentators to explain. If the novelty wears off then there needs to be a constant stream of new gimmicks.

    My recommendation would be a shot-glass tournament.

  15. #30
    CC Grandmaster Desmond's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Rout View Post
    I suppose the issue becomes whether people can be convinced that it's worth sitting through several hours of a potentially colourless draw for the prospect of eventually seeing an Armageddon which goes too quickly to follow or for commentators to explain. If the novelty wears off then there needs to be a constant stream of new gimmicks.

    My recommendation would be a shot-glass tournament.
    If anything doesn't the current system reward decisive classical games though, not draws hoping to win arma?
    Eg. if you play sharp classical and win 1 lose 1, you get 3 points. Play drawish classical have 2 draws and then win 1 lose 1 in arma, you get 2.5 points. I don't see how heading for arma is encouraged by the scoring system.
    So what's your excuse? To run like the devil's chasing you.

    See you in another life, brotha.

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