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  1. #2371
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    Leading Creationist Endorses Vaccine: COVID Is '1,000 Times More Dangerous' Than the Vaccine
    Michael Foust | ChristianHeadlines.com Contributor | Wednesday, 21 July 2021

    A well-known scientist and creationist is endorsing the COVID-19 vaccine, saying it is part of God's "divine blessing" and is far safer than the virus.

    Jonathan Sarfati, a Ph.D. in chemistry and a research scientist with Creation Ministries International, says in a new blog and a new podcast that he encourages Christians to take the vaccine. He is the author or co-author of several books, including The Creation Answer Book, and has co-authored books with Ken Ham.

    "The virus is at least 1,000 times more dangerous than the vaccine," he said in an episode of Just the Truth with Jenna Ellis. ... [from 16 Mar 2021]. The virus invades a cell. And it forces the cell's machinery to churn out 1,000 more copies of that virus, which then bursts out of the cell. [It then repeats] the process. Next cycle, 1,000 more cells are infected—then a million more viruses are going to be produced.

    "So the virus is far more fearful than the vaccine could possibly be," he added. "Otherwise, we're living in a magic universe if somehow a vaccine is more dangerous than a fast-multiplying virus."

    Sarfati this month updated a blog he had written about vaccines in general so that it addresses the COVID-19 vaccines and answers objections from critics.

    Pushing back on suggestions that the vaccine is dangerous, Sarfati wrote, "3.57 billion people have been vaccinated" against COVID-19 around the world.

    "So we have an enormous sample size," he wrote.

    When individuals are fully vaccinated, he wrote, "people are 94% less likely" to have COVID-19.

    "And the death toll for fully vaccinated people is only one in a million, compared to ~20,000 deaths per million C19 cases," he wrote.
    Last edited by Capablanca-Fan; 30-07-2021 at 11:57 PM.
    “The history of the 20th century is full of examples of countries that set out to redistribute wealth and ended up redistributing poverty.”
    “There’s no point blaming the tragedies of socialism on the flaws or corruption of particular leaders. Any system which allows some people to exercise unbridled power over others is an open invitation to abuse, whether that system is called slavery or socialism or something else.”—Thomas Sowell

  2. #2372
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    I read about it today. I would not wait for 70% but my concern is ...when and how it will be reached and furthermore, we have to bear in mind, we've got ''states'' and got national election coming up and if Labor wins and their leaders is as ignorant as Andrews...it is not clear whether there won't be another change of plans.
    So what level would you recommend, and what modelling or medical advice are you basing your percentage on?

  3. #2373
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    So what level would you recommend, and what modelling or medical advice are you basing your percentage on?
    I advise looking at the cost of mitigation for keeping the economy closed and set the timeline for return to covid normal. With this timeline, several industries that are in diastrates will be able to plan. Also, do some studies on what happens if some people do get COVID...what impact is it going to have, what are the potential risks, It is already clear that our healthcare system will not be run over.
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  4. #2374
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    I advise looking at the cost of mitigation for keeping the economy closed and set the timeline for return to covid normal. With this timeline, several industries that are in diastrates will be able to plan. Also, do some studies on what happens if some people do get COVID...what impact is it going to have, what are the potential risks, It is already clear that our healthcare system will not be run over.
    What a load of rubbish.

    Sydney yesterday, even with the 'toughest lockdown ever', had 203 Covid cases in hospital, 53 in intensive care and 27 on ventilators. That is bad enough, but what would it be like if there were no lockdown? How can you say that the hospital system would not be overloaded?

    Both the Netherlands and Singapore tried opening up with rates around 50% adults fully vaccinated and 70% partially, and quickly closed down again. They could see the increase in infections and weren't prepared to risk the consequences. The US has rates of 60% and 70% but is still in a mess with daily infections rising again and hundreds of deaths per day. The UK has now opened up with a vaccination rate at around 70% fully and 80% partially which still has worried many epidemiologists. Let's see what happens.

    Read this to get some idea of the effects of Covid-19 on individuals. I hope, Mr Baron, that you never get it and go on to suffer the potentially serious consequences.

    The more people vaccinated the better for the individuals themselves, for the health system and for the economy. Please, check with your doctor if you need to, but get vaccinated if you are able to.

  5. #2375
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    Quote Originally Posted by Socrates View Post
    What a load of rubbish.

    Sydney yesterday, even with the 'toughest lockdown ever', had 203 Covid cases in hospital, 53 in intensive care and 27 on ventilators. That is bad enough, but what would it be like if there were no lockdown? How can you say that the hospital system would not be overloaded?

    Both the Netherlands and Singapore tried opening up with rates around 50% adults fully vaccinated and 70% partially, and quickly closed down again. They could see the increase in infections and weren't prepared to risk the consequences. The US has rates of 60% and 70% but is still in a mess with daily infections rising again and hundreds of deaths per day. The UK has now opened up with a vaccination rate at around 70% fully and 80% partially which still has worried many epidemiologists. Let's see what happens.

    Read this to get some idea of the effects of Covid-19 on individuals. I hope, Mr Baron, that you never get it and go on to suffer the potentially serious consequences.

    The more people vaccinated the better for the individuals themselves, for the health system and for the economy. Please, check with your doctor if you need to, but get vaccinated if you are able to.
    So why not consider cost of mitigation if you are so sure its a bad idea? There got to be a more balanced way of looking at things. Will be interesting to see btw, which economies will come out of the pandemics strongest and which industry sectors will recover first.
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  6. #2376
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    So why not consider cost of mitigation if you are so sure its a bad idea? There got to be a more balanced way of looking at things. Will be interesting to see btw, which economies will come out of the pandemics strongest and which industry sectors will recover first.
    I have neither the knowledge or the expertise to make such judgements. All I'm saying is that governments, with adult vaccination rates of around 50%, who are keen to open up, and presumably have some expertise in these things, are ditching programs to do so.
    The UK now has a vaccination rate of 70% of adults fully vaccinated and 80% partially. They also have had high rates of infection (about 10%) which presumably offers some protection against reinfection. So, even if the situation in the UK remains stable and they don't return to restrictions, then it is probably not a suitable model for Australia. It appears Australia will need something around 80% fully vaccinated (Peter Doherty Institute) to ensure that we can avoid further major lockdowns and avoid the deaths (130,000 in the UK). Of course, purpose built quarantine facilities and simple precautions such as mask wearing may still be required.
    I hope NSW can get the outbreak under control, but it isn't looking great at the moment. Please consider vaccination for your own health, for your family's health and for the good of the community. Get vaccinated or get Covid.
    Last edited by Socrates; 01-08-2021 at 10:19 AM.

  7. #2377
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    I advise looking at the cost of mitigation for keeping the economy closed and set the timeline for return to covid normal.
    The safer option is easing restrictions gradually based on science, not picking a nominal future date as the pandemic end, as UK has done

    "... one of 100 scientists who have written an open letter accusing Boris Johnson of conducting a "dangerous and unethical experiment" by relaxing all measures.

    "We have about 20 million young people, including children who are completely unvaccinated at this point in time, they have the highest rates of infections right now and they are increasing rapidly,” Doctor Gurdasani pointed out.

    "It is herd immunity by infection, not herd immunity by the safe and effective path of vaccines, when vaccines are available."

    She warns many will end up with chronic illness and long COVID."

    With this timeline, several industries that are in diastrates will be able to plan. Also, do some studies on what happens if some people do get COVID...what impact is it going to have, what are the potential risks, It is already clear that our healthcare system will not be run over.
    The largest study is not promising, with 5% of COVID cases from a year ago not yet recovered, with no indication when, or if, they will recover.

    Translate that to 5% of the affected workforce unable to work, and a declining population as the net immigration rate falls and a future declining consumer market, and the economic prospects are not rosy.

    Trying to rush the recovery is counter-productive.

  8. #2378
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    Quote Originally Posted by Socrates View Post
    I have neither the knowledge or the expertise to make such judgements. All I'm saying is that governments, with adult vaccination rates of around 50%, who are keen to open up, and presumably have some expertise in these things, are ditching programs to do so.
    The UK now has a vaccination rate of 70% of adults fully vaccinated and 80% partially. They also have had high rates of infection (about 10%) which presumably offers some protection against reinfection. So, even if the situation in the UK remains stable and they don't return to restrictions, then it is probably not a suitable model for Australia. It appears Australia will need something around 80% fully vaccinated (Peter Doherty Institute) to ensure that we can avoid further major lockdowns and avoid the deaths (130,000 in the UK). Of course, purpose built quarantine facilities and simple precautions such as mask wearing may still be required.
    I hope NSW can get the outbreak under control, but it isn't looking great at the moment. Please consider vaccination for your own health, for your family's health and for the good of the community. Get vaccinated or get Covid.
    Of course! I fully support vaccination and got vaccinated. Likewise, I support social distancing and being as careful as possible. I am just against measures that are either pointless or having low impact on Covid-containment as well as for mitigation against factors that are too damaging for the economy.
    Btw, here in Victoria - home visits are banned...but brothels are open .
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  9. #2379
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Murray View Post
    The safer option is easing restrictions gradually based on science, not picking a nominal future date as the pandemic end, as UK has done

    "... one of 100 scientists who have written an open letter accusing Boris Johnson of conducting a "dangerous and unethical experiment" by relaxing all measures.

    "We have about 20 million young people, including children who are completely unvaccinated at this point in time, they have the highest rates of infections right now and they are increasing rapidly,” Doctor Gurdasani pointed out.

    "It is herd immunity by infection, not herd immunity by the safe and effective path of vaccines, when vaccines are available."

    She warns many will end up with chronic illness and long COVID."



    The largest study is not promising, with 5% of COVID cases from a year ago not yet recovered, with no indication when, or if, they will recover.

    Translate that to 5% of the affected workforce unable to work, and a declining population as the net immigration rate falls and a future declining consumer market, and the economic prospects are not rosy.

    Trying to rush the recovery is counter-productive.
    Re recovery , I really believe we need to look into it sector by sector as well as ''at large'' some sectors of the economy are being damaged extremely severely.
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  10. #2380
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    Of course! I fully support vaccination and got vaccinated. Likewise, I support social distancing and being as careful as possible. I am just against measures that are either pointless or having low impact on Covid-containment as well as for mitigation against factors that are too damaging for the economy.
    Btw, here in Victoria - home visits are banned...but brothels are open .
    Maybe you're joking - not sure. But it's an indication that you don't really understand the principles of Covid-containment. There are millions of homes. The number of interactions that regularly occur in homes far outweigh the number of interactions that occur in brothels or any other non-essential business sector. When an infectious person visits a home for a social gathering they spend considerable time with the people in the home without masks and can pass on a large viral load. It is in homes that the majority of infections take place. No private gatherings in the home is a simple, clear message that prevents the majority of the riskiest interactions while contact tracers are trying to mop up any remaining community transmission.

  11. #2381
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    So why not consider cost of mitigation if you are so sure its a bad idea? There got to be a more balanced way of looking at things. Will be interesting to see btw, which economies will come out of the pandemics strongest and which industry sectors will recover first.
    There is a lengthy thread devoted to discussing the economics of the coronavirus, and the general conclusion is that lockdowns do not cause long-term damage to the economy:
    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    The NZ economy has bounced back dramatically in the September quarter, increasing by 14% (the largest increase on record) - a dramatic demonstration of its successful elimination strategy, with its economy returning to pre-Covid levels.
    On the other hand, not having lockdowns has consequences that can't be undone - people die, or suffer permanently from 'long covid'.

  12. #2382
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    Of course! I fully support vaccination and got vaccinated. Likewise, I support social distancing and being as careful as possible. I am just against measures that are either pointless or having low impact on Covid-containment as well as for mitigation against factors that are too damaging for the economy.
    Btw, here in Victoria - home visits are banned...but brothels are open .
    Lockdowns are not pointless and they have a large impact on Covid containment. Look at the SA lockdown that just happened. The outbreak was controlled completely by a lockdown. This was not a Labor government you hate so much, it was a Liberal government. The federal Coalition has also endorsed lockdowns for Phase A.

  13. #2383
    CC Grandmaster Ian Murray's Avatar
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    https://www.theguardian.com/australi...rus-melbourne:



    Ahh, Victoria - we’ve come so far since the days of 600+ cases! Today, we have relatively good news coming from the little state that could:

    Victoria recorded just four new Covid-19 cases, all of whom were linked back to current outbreaks and were in isolation for the duration of their infectious period.

    In saying that, about 20 residents of a Richmond apartment building in Melbourne have been told to isolate for 14 days after they were potentially exposed to a Covid-19 case.

    The state has passed a milestone with one million residents fully vaccinated. Woo!

    Speaking of vaccines, health authorities announced that, from Monday, they will be pushing back the wait time for a second Pfizer dose from three weeks to six weeks to enable more people to go and get their first jab.

  14. #2384
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  15. #2385
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    Yes this is troubling and might be harder than the SA outbreak to control. It certainly looks like the 3 day lockdown will not be enough. Hopefully not much longer though.

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