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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Murray View Post
    He goes way beyond being non-critical, penning puff pieces painting a false picture of the country (China a democracy??)
    To be fair to Michael, that piece (which made several ridiculous claims), was written ten years ago when he was only a PhD student. His more recent piece is much better, although still unwilling to draw even obvious negative conclusions. As far as I know, those are his only two pro-China publications.

    But it is hilarious that Michael is implicitly criticising us for non-existent 'political correctness', while he repeats Chinese Communist Party propaganda almost verbatim on this thread.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    To be fair to Michael, that piece (which made several ridiculous claims), was written ten years ago when he was only a PhD student. His more recent piece is much better, although still unwilling to draw even obvious negative conclusions. As far as I know, those are his only two pro-China publications.

    But it is hilarious that Michael is implicitly criticising us for non-existent 'political correctness', while he repeats Chinese Communist Party propaganda almost verbatim on this thread.
    The other hilarious thing about that Christmas post is that he is purportedly opposed to leftists, despite being 1) a communist sympathiser advocate, 2) pro increase in aged pension to encompass high income earners, 3) pro increased government spending on education, 4) pro socialised housing through negative gearing; I could go on. Things that would make many uncontested leftists blush.

    I believe Michael did study some Asian Studies subjects during his bachelor of arts, making some of the views he expresses here the more delicious.
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  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    To be fair to Michael, that piece (which made several ridiculous claims), was written ten years ago when he was only a PhD student. His more recent piece is much better, although still unwilling to draw even obvious negative conclusions. As far as I know, those are his only two pro-China publications.

    But it is hilarious that Michael is implicitly criticising us for non-existent 'political correctness', while he repeats Chinese Communist Party propaganda almost verbatim on this thread.
    The ''Communist Party Propaganda'' is shared by many Chinese friends/acquaintances and business associates of mine who happen to be Chinese...you are doing a great job explaining to Chinese People how they should feel about their country...
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by road runner View Post
    The other hilarious thing about that Christmas post is that he is purportedly opposed to leftists, despite being 1) a communist sympathiser advocate, 2) pro increase in aged pension to encompass high income earners, 3) pro increased government spending on education, 4) pro socialised housing through negative gearing; I could go on. Things that would make many uncontested leftists blush.

    I believe Michael did study some Asian Studies subjects during his bachelor of arts, making some of the views he expresses here the more delicious.
    I believe in recent years...Michael has been in touch with some China study specialists...who happen to be Chinese....may be if you have a message for them what is happening n China ..they can learn from you about their country
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  5. #20
    CC Grandmaster Ian Murray's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    I believe in recent years...Michael has been in touch with some China study specialists...who happen to be Chinese....may be if you have a message for them what is happening n China ..they can learn from you about their country
    Anything like those Sinhalese students who told you there was no Tamil genocide in Sri Lanka?

    To learn about China, you should look for expert tuition, like the ChinaX course run by Harvard which I took a few years ago. Then visit the country.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    The ''Communist Party Propaganda'' is shared by many Chinese friends/acquaintances and business associates of mine who happen to be Chinese...you are doing a great job explaining to Chinese People how they should feel about their country...
    Of course they're not going to criticise China - if they do, they (or their family) could be arrested, imprisoned and tortured! I don't care how the Chinese people feel about their country, but I do think they should be able to speak freely without being arrested.

    And freely practice their religion:
    Liang Zhang, 48, the pastor of a house church in Henan's Shangqiu city, said the state had been tightening its control over church operations. "In the beginning, they said that children would not be allowed to enter, and signs on the outside should be removed, including the cross and other signs of faith," Mr Zhang told the ABC. "And then they came into the church saying that things inside should be removed. "For example, the banner saying: 'For God, so love the world' and the scriptures were torn down, and all things related to the Bible and faith had to be cleared out."

    Do you think Chinese people should be able to peacefully practice their religion without brutal state interference?

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Murray View Post
    Anything like those Sinhalese students who told you there was no Tamil genocide in Sri Lanka?

    To learn about China, you should look for expert tuition, like the ChinaX course run by Harvard which I took a few years ago. Then visit the country.
    Yes, complete ignorance on his part regarding the Montagnards was another example. You have to wonder what he did learn in his bachelor of arts.
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  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    Of course they're not going to criticise China - if they do, they (or their family) could be arrested, imprisoned and tortured! I don't care how the Chinese people feel about their country, but I do think they should be able to speak freely without being arrested.

    And freely practice their religion:
    Liang Zhang, 48, the pastor of a house church in Henan's Shangqiu city, said the state had been tightening its control over church operations. "In the beginning, they said that children would not be allowed to enter, and signs on the outside should be removed, including the cross and other signs of faith," Mr Zhang told the ABC. "And then they came into the church saying that things inside should be removed. "For example, the banner saying: 'For God, so love the world' and the scriptures were torn down, and all things related to the Bible and faith had to be cleared out."

    Do you think Chinese people should be able to peacefully practice their religion without brutal state interference?
    Do you think we should tell Chinese people what to and what not to practice? And if we do...shall Chinese people tell us what we should do for us to listen?
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  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Murray View Post
    Anything like those Sinhalese students who told you there was no Tamil genocide in Sri Lanka?

    To learn about China, you should look for expert tuition, like the ChinaX course run by Harvard which I took a few years ago. Then visit the country.
    This is hilarious...so learning about China from Non Chinese is better than learning from Chinese? And what about Australian culture? Any recommendations? Is there a non Australian source to learn from?
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/587889317906964/ this was an interesting course that I enjoyed btw.
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  10. #25
    CC Grandmaster Ian Murray's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    This is hilarious...so learning about China from Non Chinese is better than learning from Chinese? And what about Australian culture? Any recommendations? Is there a non Australian source to learn from?
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/587889317906964/ this was an interesting course that I enjoyed btw.
    Strawman. Learning about China from Harvard professors who have spent their working lives on Chinese studies is clearly better than from immature Chinese students inculcated with the Party Line.

    Ask your Chinese students what they know about Tiananmen Square in 1989.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    This is hilarious...so learning about China from Non Chinese is better than learning from Chinese? And what about Australian culture? Any recommendations? Is there a non Australian source to learn from?
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/587889317906964/ this was an interesting course that I enjoyed btw.
    Perhaps you should ask your forum friend and komrade ally Capa fan what he thinks of your idea that communist china is as democratic as the USA? Or better yet, just have a look at his posts on the subject. #33 and #35 are interesting.
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  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    Do you think we should tell Chinese people what to and what not to practice? And if we do...shall Chinese people tell us what we should do for us to listen?
    Chinese people express opinions on Australia all the time. That's all I'm asking you to do. After all, you had no problem criticising North Korea.

    Let me put it another way. Do you think governments should allow people to peacefully practice their religion?

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    Chinese people express opinions on Australia all the time. That's all I'm asking you to do. After all, you had no problem criticising North Korea.

    Let me put it another way. Do you think governments should allow people to peacefully practice their religion?
    So how can so many of them have no problem with the Chinese government...despite deciding to live overseas?


    Every country has problems and every government has issues to deal with. But I am surprised how one-sided the Western approach is. for example, the so called ''social credit scores'' - lots of effort goes into explaining what people do not get and can not access if their social rating is poor...but little effort goes into discussing the benefits for those who have a high rating..

    Re control over'' facebook'' it is obvous that many people are accessing facebook in China...and government does not prosecute them...so FB restrictions come simply in order to improve commercial climate for the Chinese companies.
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  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    So how can so many of them have no problem with the Chinese government...despite deciding to live overseas?
    ...Maya Wang, a senior researcher from Human Rights Watch China, said patriotic young people who were supportive of the Government were part of a strong force that automatically self-censored themselves in a way just "as natural as breathing".

    "Most young people in China live behind the Great Firewall and their lives in that world are very much shaped by what is allowed within the Great Firewall," Ms Wang said.

    "Some of them are supported by families to go abroad and study, and they continued to be very nationalistic.

    "But there is also a proportion of young people who are thinkers and who are scared of the direction of where China is going."...
    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-...ebook/10479098

    And of course:

    Australia’s Chinese community 'key target of Chinese government influence operations'
    SBS
    15.12.17

    ...“One of the pieces that’s really important to understand about China's united front work is that this is in the Communist Party’s DNA. It’s not about ... good or bad relations, it’s about activity that is being undertaken on a day to day basis simply because this is what the Chinese Communist Party does....

    Re control over'' facebook'' it is obvous that many people are accessing facebook in China...and government does not prosecute them...so FB restrictions come simply in order to improve commercial climate for the Chinese companies.
    When you say many people in China are accessing Facebook, how many of the 1.3 billion Chinese nationals are able to bypass the Great Firewall of China?

    It is disingenuous to think the GFW is simply to improve the commercial climate. The Arab Spring uprising in Egypt was organised over Facebook - the CCP is ensuring that it can't happen in China by controlling communications.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    If you look at contemporary China,
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