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  1. #1
    CC Grandmaster antichrist's Avatar
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    Chesschat Book Club

    I was listening to Radio National this morning around 10am when they interviewed the author of this book The Race Hate by Maxine Beneba Clarke. She told a few funny tales and seemed an interesting person, then on researching I found that she is an up and coming famous Australian author.

    https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/...-the-hate-race



    A review
    Sep 25, 2016 Claire rated it it was amazing review of another edition
    Shelves: book-club, best-of-2016
    This is a really important book, and although it's situated in Australia, and delivers a particular critique of race relations there, we all have something to learn from it. This memoir is equally heartbreaking and powerful, as it details the impact of repeated moments of casual racism, inflicted on one child in Australia in the '80s and '90s. I was most disturbed by the behaviour of adults, in positions of power, protection and acting as role models, who dismissed the racism of children as teasing and thus were complicit in its perpetuation over generations. The parallels between my '90s childhood and Clarke's made me uncomfortably aware of my own privilege and that's the real power and significance of this memoir.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    I went to a Catholic school where the nuns handled racism pretty well - six cuts of the best. But unfortunately for Maxine her experience was entirely different.

    As I don't have the book yet I can't really comment.
    Zionism is racism as defined by the UN, Israel by every dirty means available steals land and water, kill Palestinian freedom fighters and civilians, and operates an apartheid system to drive more Palestinians off their land

  2. #2
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    Gosh casual racism...making uncomfortable about own privilege....sorry... I would rather read works of Kafka or Bulgakov...
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  3. #3
    CC Grandmaster antichrist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    Gosh casual racism...making uncomfortable about own privilege....sorry... I would rather read works of Kafka or Bulgakov...
    Thanks for the reference of Bulgakov, an interesting guy as was protected by Stalin, was usually was the opposite opinion of Stalin in Australia.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_Bulgakov

    I love the beginning of this novel:
    The Master and Margarita
    The novel begins with Satan visiting Moscow in the 1930s, joining a conversation between a critic and a poet debating the existence of Jesus Christ and the Devil. It develops into an all-embracing indictment of the corruption, greed, narrow-mindedness, and widespread paranoia of Soviet Russia. The novel was completely published more than 25 years after Bulgakov's death.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    Mikhail Bakunin's God and State along with Gulag Archipelago are the only Russian novels I have read.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_and_the_State

    God and the State (called by its author The Historical Sophisms of the Doctrinaire School of Communism) is an unfinished manuscript by the Russian anarchist philosopher Mikhail Bakunin, published posthumously in 1882. The work criticises Christianity and the then-burgeoning technocracy movement from a materialist, anarchist and individualist perspective.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_Bakunin
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Russia has an interesting and shocking history that one must study to understand the country. The modern Putin strategy seems to me to be a repeat of a few hundred years ago of Church and Monarchy.
    Zionism is racism as defined by the UN, Israel by every dirty means available steals land and water, kill Palestinian freedom fighters and civilians, and operates an apartheid system to drive more Palestinians off their land

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    Gosh casual racism...making uncomfortable about own privilege....sorry... I would rather read works of Kafka or Bulgakov...
    You would rather read, or actually have read Kafka? Because one of the themes of the Metamorphosis is arguably racism. Or more accurately anti-Semitism, as Kafka was a Jew living in Austria-Hungary in the earliest twentieth century.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by antichrist View Post
    Thanks for the reference of Bulgakov, an interesting guy as was protected by Stalin, was usually was the opposite opinion of Stalin in Australia.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_Bulgakov

    I love the beginning of this novel:
    The Master and Margarita
    The novel begins with Satan visiting Moscow in the 1930s, joining a conversation between a critic and a poet debating the existence of Jesus Christ and the Devil. It develops into an all-embracing indictment of the corruption, greed, narrow-mindedness, and widespread paranoia of Soviet Russia. The novel was completely published more than 25 years after Bulgakov's death.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    Mikhail Bakunin's God and State along with Gulag Archipelago are the only Russian novels I have read.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_and_the_State

    God and the State (called by its author The Historical Sophisms of the Doctrinaire School of Communism) is an unfinished manuscript by the Russian anarchist philosopher Mikhail Bakunin, published posthumously in 1882. The work criticises Christianity and the then-burgeoning technocracy movement from a materialist, anarchist and individualist perspective.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_Bakunin
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Russia has an interesting and shocking history that one must study to understand the country. The modern Putin strategy seems to me to be a repeat of a few hundred years ago of Church and Monarchy.
    Master and Margarita is one of my favourite books!
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    You would rather read, or actually have read Kafka? Because one of the themes of the Metamorphosis is arguably racism. Or more accurately anti-Semitism, as Kafka was a Jew living in Austria-Hungary in the earliest twentieth century.
    I would rather read a Great writer even if I do not share his views rather than some primitive story that talks about ''injustices of the world''. In fact, look what's happening with the high school students - who are being brainwashed by the means of having to read the ''Malala story'' while doing Y12. So many great books by great authors to learn from...and yet this is what they are reading. I obviously disagree with political views of George Orwell and Gianni Rodari but there is a lot to learn from such writers! Likewise, Dostoevsky was a well known anti-Semite but it does not mean that his works are insignificant or uninteresting to read~! We should learn to learn from intellectuals irrespectively of whether we share their views or not!
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  7. #7
    CC Grandmaster antichrist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    I would rather read a Great writer even if I do not share his views rather than some primitive story that talks about ''injustices of the world''. In fact, look what's happening with the high school students - who are being brainwashed by the means of having to read the ''Malala story'' while doing Y12. So many great books by great authors to learn from...and yet this is what they are reading. I obviously disagree with political views of George Orwell and Gianni Rodari but there is a lot to learn from such writers! Likewise, Dostoevsky was a well known anti-Semite but it does not mean that his works are insignificant or uninteresting to read~! We should learn to learn from intellectuals irrespectively of whether we share their views or not!
    But not all students (as in society) are the intellectual type. I expect that students have a choice of books and that intellectual students would avoid Malala Story and to be advised as such by their teachers. But Malala Story would be most suitable for the lower student who could not handle the more serious and classy works but need something they can relate to as far as age, era and even ethnicity/culture. As well as Shakespeare I did The Chant of Jimmy Blacksmith and My Brother Jack - the last one pretty useless but okay. The last two being Australian was probably a result of Gough Whitlam's influence (I completed my higher education late).
    Zionism is racism as defined by the UN, Israel by every dirty means available steals land and water, kill Palestinian freedom fighters and civilians, and operates an apartheid system to drive more Palestinians off their land

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    Quote Originally Posted by antichrist View Post
    But not all students (as in society) are the intellectual type. I expect that students have a choice of books and that intellectual students would avoid Malala Story and to be advised as such by their teachers. But Malala Story would be most suitable for the lower student who could not handle the more serious and classy works but need something they can relate to as far as age, era and even ethnicity/culture. As well as Shakespeare I did The Chant of Jimmy Blacksmith and My Brother Jack - the last one pretty useless but okay. The last two being Australian was probably a result of Gough Whitlam's influence (I completed my higher education late).
    So should society/school system attempt to make them more intellectual or encourage lack of intellectuality?
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    I would rather read a Great writer even if I do not share his views rather than some primitive story that talks about ''injustices of the world''. In fact, look what's happening with the high school students - who are being brainwashed by the means of having to read the ''Malala story'' while doing Y12. So many great books by great authors to learn from...and yet this is what they are reading. I obviously disagree with political views of George Orwell and Gianni Rodari but there is a lot to learn from such writers! Likewise, Dostoevsky was a well known anti-Semite but it does not mean that his works are insignificant or uninteresting to read~! We should learn to learn from intellectuals irrespectively of whether we share their views or not!
    "I am Malala" doesn't appear on the list of VCE texts for 2018, so why do you believe that students are forced to study it? The list does include many great books by great authors. And Malala is the youngest Nobel Laureate, so young people reading about her life seems like a good idea to me - the work is a biography, not a novel.

  10. #10
    CC Grandmaster antichrist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    So should society/school system attempt to make them more intellectual or encourage lack of intellectuality?
    Horses for courses. I doubt the less talented could appreciate the classical language, figures of speech and irony etc. nor be aware of the historical settings of novels. I believe teachers despise having compulsory school student attendance to year 12 as many are just not made for it - it is a waste of time for students and teachers. I don't like saying but there is a big intellectual difference between tradesmen and professionals. And when tradesmen attempt to be above their station it is glaringly obvious.
    Zionism is racism as defined by the UN, Israel by every dirty means available steals land and water, kill Palestinian freedom fighters and civilians, and operates an apartheid system to drive more Palestinians off their land

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    "I am Malala" doesn't appear on the list of VCE texts for 2018, so why do you believe that students are forced to study it? The list does include many great books by great authors. And Malala is the youngest Nobel Laureate, so young people reading about her life seems like a good idea to me - the work is a biography, not a novel.
    https://www.vcestudyguides.com/blog/...genham-prompts
    Could be ESL...but it is on the reading list...my friends' young sister had to study it this year...and she was sickened ...
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    https://www.vcestudyguides.com/blog/...genham-prompts
    Could be ESL...but it is on the reading list...my friends' young sister had to study it this year...and she was sickened ...
    On what grounds may she have been sickened?
    Zionism is racism as defined by the UN, Israel by every dirty means available steals land and water, kill Palestinian freedom fighters and civilians, and operates an apartheid system to drive more Palestinians off their land

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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    https://www.vcestudyguides.com/blog/...genham-prompts
    Could be ESL...but it is on the reading list...my friends' young sister had to study it this year...and she was sickened ...
    So it is used for ESL/EAL students, who are probably not ready to tackle Dostoevsky yet

    And you haven't actually read it, but are basing your opinion on someone who was "sickened" by it. Malala's treatment is pretty sickening, but it's also what actually happened to her, and is still happening to girls in Afghanistan.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    So it is used for ESL/EAL students, who are probably not ready to tackle Dostoevsky yet

    And you haven't actually read it, but are basing your opinion on someone who was "sickened" by it. Malala's treatment is pretty sickening, but it's also what actually happened to her, and is still happening to girls in Afghanistan.
    I won't allow myself to get dragged into discussion about whether she is ''significant enough to get noble prize for this'' and whether her own family is also to blame for this or not (and I've heard a lot of feedback from my students and friends from Pakistant who are quite familiar with the scene) but the important part is....this is just politically motivated selection of literature ...or another book that is on the same book list ''Rabbit-Proof Fence''.

    ESL Kids can read Mark Twain, Decent Poetry (they get full semester to analyze/understand it) etc....
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