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  1. #391
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Lots of Labor MPs in hot water over Section 44 disclosures. Especially perhaps David "the dog ate my renunciation" Feeney, though perhaps he will be able to obtain evidence from Britain and Ireland to clear him.

  2. #392
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Katy Gallagher is about to be referred. I would expect the four House of Reps MPs in similar circumstances - Keay, J Wilson, Lamb, Sharkie to also be referred.

  3. #393
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    ^^^ Wrong about that so far. Labor wouldn't agree to referring them unless more Coalition MPs were also referred. ALP motion to refer four Labor, for Coalition and Sharkie to the High Court tied 73-73 and therefore lost on casting vote. It was only lost because Barnaby Joyce won New England by so much that he was able to get declared elected and have the writ returned in time. Following this David Feeney agreed to be referred (the citizenship disclosure process shows that the dog ate his homework.)

  4. #394
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capablanca-Fan View Post
    The difference is that Turnbull really has been indistinguishable: increasing taxing, spending, regulation; being hostile to reforms of free speech laws; and passing the SSM bill that was just what Labor/Greens wanted. In what practical way, in terms of enacted policy, has he caved to the right?
    You mean indistinguishable from Abbott, I assume? Abbott increased taxes, spending, and regulation, opposed changes to 18C, and supported the SSM bill - just as Turnbull has. Turnbull also continued Abbott's opposition to an ETS, and Abbott's refugee policies.

  5. #395
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham View Post
    ^^^ Wrong about that so far. Labor wouldn't agree to referring them unless more Coalition MPs were also referred. ALP motion to refer four Labor, for Coalition and Sharkie to the High Court tied 73-73 and therefore lost on casting vote. It was only lost because Barnaby Joyce won New England by so much that he was able to get declared elected and have the writ returned in time. Following this David Feeney agreed to be referred (the citizenship disclosure process shows that the dog ate his homework.)
    So the Coalition members about whom doubts have been raised voted not to refer themselves? Hmm...

  6. #396
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    So the Coalition members about whom doubts have been raised voted not to refer themselves? Hmm...
    That's right. The government clearly doesn't want any more by-elections in its own seats as the risks are too high, whereas sending Labor to by-elections is embarrassing for Labor but unlikely to deliver seats to the government.

    A by-election in Batman though could well deliver a seat to the Greens; they nearly knocked off Feeney last time.

  7. #397
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Byrom View Post
    You mean indistinguishable from Abbott, I assume? Abbott increased taxes, spending, and regulation, opposed changes to 18C, and supported the SSM bill - just as Turnbull has. Turnbull also continued Abbott's opposition to an ETS, and Abbott's refugee policies.
    The latest anti-Turnbull article I posted, from a former Turnbull fan, said, and I quoted:

    I hate admitting when I’m wrong, but supporting Turnbull was a huge mistake. John Barilaro is right. Turnbull should go before Christmas as an early gift to all Australians. The only catch is that a return to Abbott is not the answer.
    “A society that puts equality before freedom will get neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both.”—Milton Friedman

    “If a private enterprise is a failure, it is closed down—unless it can get a government subsidy to keep it going; if a government enterprise is a failure, it is expanded. I challenge you to find exceptions.”—Milton Friedman

  8. #398
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capablanca-Fan View Post
    The latest anti-Turnbull article I posted, from a former Turnbull fan, said, and I quoted:
    I hate admitting when I’m wrong, but supporting Turnbull was a huge mistake. John Barilaro is right. Turnbull should go before Christmas as an early gift to all Australians. The only catch is that a return to Abbott is not the answer.
    Any replacement (from the Coalition, at least ) would continue the same policies.

  9. #399
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Turnbull abstained on Sukkar's apartheid-style two-definition same-sex marriage debate rubbish today. Either he is really not even remotely progressive and only made noises in that direction to suck in the left, or else he is indeed captive to and being intimidated by the right.

    I believe it's the latter, actually.

  10. #400
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    ↑↑ Evidently the right must be the ones who love increased taxation, spending, and regulation, and hate even the most minimal protection for freedom of speech and religion.
    “A society that puts equality before freedom will get neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both.”—Milton Friedman

    “If a private enterprise is a failure, it is closed down—unless it can get a government subsidy to keep it going; if a government enterprise is a failure, it is expanded. I challenge you to find exceptions.”—Milton Friedman

  11. #401
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capablanca-Fan View Post
    ↑↑ Evidently the right must be the ones who love increased taxation, spending, and regulation,
    No, that's just a cross-party consensus these days, except that the right makes more pretence of disapproval.

    and hate even the most minimal protection for freedom of speech and religion.
    Turnbull voted for three of the right-wing "protection" amendments (some of which were nothing of the sort) and abstained on the rest.

  12. #402
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham View Post
    No, that's just a cross-party consensus these days, except that the right makes more pretence of disapproval.
    You can say that, but people who want more taxation, spending, and regulation can vote for Labor, where Turnbull has always belonged. Yet Labor/Green will never vote for him despite enacting so many of their policies, and too many LNP voters will abandon them for other parties that have taken over the vacuum from the Turnbull/LNP's lurch leftwards.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham View Post
    Turnbull voted for three of the right-wing "protection" amendments (some of which were nothing of the sort) and abstained on the rest.
    Token, given that he did nothing to craft a bill acceptable to the majority of LNP MPs, reflecting the majority of LNP voters, before throwing it to the whole parliament. Some of his ilk said it would make a difference to religious protection if the SSM was passed by an LNP parliament, but they basically passed a Labor/Green bill.
    “A society that puts equality before freedom will get neither. A society that puts freedom before equality will get a high degree of both.”—Milton Friedman

    “If a private enterprise is a failure, it is closed down—unless it can get a government subsidy to keep it going; if a government enterprise is a failure, it is expanded. I challenge you to find exceptions.”—Milton Friedman

  13. #403
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capablanca-Fan View Post
    You can say that, but people who want more taxation, spending, and regulation can vote for Labor, where Turnbull has always belonged. Yet Labor/Green will never vote for him despite enacting so many of their policies, and too many LNP voters will abandon them for other parties that have taken over the vacuum from the Turnbull/LNP's lurch leftwards.
    People tend to say they are against taxation and spending and regulation until their own services are cut or they are ripped off by a bank or their area gets polluted. Then they complain. Hence the bipartisan big-spending consensus, which began at least from the second half of the Howard era. Those filling the vacuum so far are mostly not low-tax low-spend parties, they are right-wing populists of various kinds. Christensen who threatened to quit wants more regulation not less, both in banking and penalty rates.

  14. #404
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capablanca-Fan View Post
    Token, given that he did nothing to craft a bill acceptable to the majority of LNP MPs, ...
    Are you sure about that? Ten LNP members in the House abstained, but only three voted against. So the overwhelming majority voted in favour of the bill!

  15. #405
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    Quote Originally Posted by road runner View Post
    Aahh Sam Dastyari, how many times will he say he made a mistake this time.
    meep meep

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