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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by road runner View Post
    Weren't you just lamenting (or at least agreeing with Brian Jones) that we should have players on standby. Presumably by we you mean either the community at large funded by government or chess community funded by for example the ACF. And we all know how much you love giving money to the ACF...
    I agree that it would be nice to have players on stand-by. However, many players would be unavailable due to the fact that they have a ''life'' rather than simply play chess all the time. Whats ACF got to do with it? Certainly would not give any money to ACF
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  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Super Nintendo Chalmers View Post
    I am also puzzled.

    To encourage chess professionals may well promote the number of centrelink recipients. And that is not welcomed.

    I wonder which angle is most favoured.

    I didnt think it was congruent for the opening post to encourage players to be on standby for important tournament, but question any of these players status as "professional".

    Maybe I am missing something............
    I was simply wondering if its possible to have professional players in Australia or not...and I do not think it is.
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  3. #18
    CC Grandmaster Redmond Barry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    I was simply wondering if its possible to have professional players in Australia or not...and I do not think it is.
    Yes, but if you question the "professional" aspirations of any player who has decided on dedicating a significant portion of their time to Australian chess, it is hardly a ringing endorsement for these individuals who might at short notice provide representation for their country.

    I honestly don't think you can claim support for team representation, whilst detailing opposition towards the aspirational player who is planning or presently conducting a professional career in chess.

    I don't disagree that deriving an income from playing chess is a difficult venture, but if you want strong players making themselves available more frequently, it is better for the strength of Australian chess if there are those available who are not significantly lumbered by an additional vocation.

    Encouraging players to avoid a professional career lessens the probability of player availability for the very events you wish us to have representation in.

    By the way, are there any players currently who have declared a professional inclination towards their chess ?
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  4. #19
    CC Grandmaster road runner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    I agree that it would be nice to have players on stand-by. However, many players would be unavailable due to the fact that they have a ''life'' rather than simply play chess all the time. Whats ACF got to do with it? Certainly would not give any money to ACF
    "It would be nice to have" is a bit different from what said before "we should have". The latter implies we should do something Eg fund such players to be on stand by. My question is simply who do you suggest funds this, or have you retreated to the "it would be nice" lala land.
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  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by road runner View Post
    "It would be nice to have" is a bit different from what said before "we should have". The latter implies we should do something Eg fund such players to be on stand by. My question is simply who do you suggest funds this, or have you retreated to the "it would be nice" lala land.
    First of all, I was not suggesting anything just pointing out that its a bit unrealistic. Secondly, Certainly not ACF. There is something called ''sponsorship''. In countries wheer intellectual activities are being valued (India,China, Armenia etc.) there are both private and government sponsors to support the Chess-players. What ACF can try to do though is to run more events with decent prize money (but this too requires sponsorship). Furthermore, if ACF is to support professional players (the way national federations do in Italy, Germany etc.) - this money too should come from sponsorship secured by federation rather than all of the active chess players contributing $5 each for someone to travel overseas to play or to have breakfast in the morning.
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  6. #21
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    What ACF can try to do though is to run more events with decent prize money (but this too requires sponsorship).
    And it seems you want volunteers to chase up this sponsorship for you and don't even want them to be adequately resourced.

    This idea that people who are good at chasing sponsorship magically appear and devote their time to voluntary organisations is a fascinating one but in practice people with such skills are not that easy for voluntary organisations to find.

  7. #22
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    Talking

    I have a solution. Encourage strong chess players to play poker. The skills in chess should easily translate into being a good poker player and anyone who's good at chess should be able to make a living playing poker without too much difficulty.

    Then they'd always be available at short notice and have an income that's more reliable than a chess career.
    One day I'll put something clever here, but for now this will just have to do.

  8. #23
    CC Grandmaster Adamski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by James Watson View Post
    I have a solution. Encourage strong chess players to play poker. The skills in chess should easily translate into being a good poker player and anyone who's good at chess should be able to make a living playing poker without too much difficulty.

    Then they'd always be available at short notice and have an income that's more reliable than a chess career.
    I imagine that the likes of Kerry Stead and Michael Addamo would agree!
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  9. #24
    CC Grandmaster road runner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelBaron View Post
    this money too should come from sponsorship secured by federation
    let's suppose for a moment that the ACF is able to secure a $50k per annum sponsorship - would you like to see this money used to support 4 chess players to sit around and wait for some free accommodation offers to come along? Guess we can lock in the "lala land" option at this point.
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  10. #25
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    I think this conversation is getting a bit ridiculous. Most participants in most sports in Australia, including athletes in reasonably high-profile Olympic events, have real-world jobs into which they integrate their sporting careers, and which finance their sport. That is, given the way that some footballers and swimmers cope when let out of the goldfish bowl, probably a good thing.

    At best it would be feasible to raise a small travel fund. It wouldn't have any impact on professionalism.

    The particular event under discussion is a one-off. Most events, including those which are better development opportunities, don't just appear out of the ether, and even this one was allegedly known about some time ago.

    In any case sponsors typically don't just hand over large pots of free money. They give a modest amount for a specific purpose where there is a clear publicity pay-off, for instance tournament naming rights.

    In terms of what is a "professional", I'd suggest that it depends on the context. For instance a grandmaster probably wouldn't consider coaching in primary schools as professional chess, but an economist measuring job opportunities could reasonably do so.

    PS: I'm not saying it's a bad thing to have a ridiculous conversation, just pointing it out.

  11. #26
    CC Grandmaster road runner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Rout View Post
    PS: I'm not saying it's a bad thing to have a ridiculous conversation, just pointing it out.
    Excellent!

    I also wanted to suggest the break glass in case of fire chess team - or in case of falling cabin pressure, an emergency chess team will drop down and help you fit your oxygen mask.

    We should have this!
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  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Rout View Post
    For instance a grandmaster probably wouldn't consider coaching in primary schools as professional chess, but an economist measuring job opportunities could reasonably do so.

    .
    Plenty of Grandmasters are coaching across primary schools (including an Australian one).
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  13. #28
    CC Grandmaster Adamski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Super Nintendo Chalmers View Post
    By the way, are there any players currently who have declared a professional inclination towards their chess ?
    IM Max Illingworth, for one, comes to mind.
    God exists. Short and to the point.

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  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adamski View Post
    IM Max Illingworth, for one, comes to mind.
    I can declare myself a chess professional too as I won $7 of someone playing dollar a game some weeks ago. The question is, can the so called professionals support themseves through chess?. Incidently, I can recall a couple of under 2300 Australian players who regard themseves as chess professionals.
    Both of them are recepients of unemployment benefits...
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  15. #30
    CC Grandmaster Adamski's Avatar
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    I certainly hope that Max will make enough money through chess (playing and coaching) to not require help from Centrelink.
    God exists. Short and to the point.

    Secretary of, and regularly arbiter at, Rooty Hill RSL Chess Club. See www.rootyhillchessclub.org.

    Psephological insight. "Controversial will only lose you votes. Courageous will lose you the election." Sir Humphrey Appleby on Yes Minister.

    Favorite movie line: Girl friend Cathy to Jack Ryan in "Sum of all Fears". "What kind of emergency does an historian have?".

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