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  1. #1
    CC Grandmaster Basil's Avatar
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    Stuff the message - It depends on who is delivering it

    Message: Sorry can't afford that (yet, now, in full)
    If delivered by Coalition:
    Criticised as: Mean, tight, rich protecting evil.

    Same message delivered by Hawke/ Keating/ Rudd:
    Oh OK, if you think so daddy. We're glad that you're an economic conservative.

    Message: We must wipe out terror. It is the one of the biggest challenges of the of the 3rd millenium
    If delivered by Coalition:
    Self-serving fear mongering and Johnny was the cause of it anyway.

    Same message delivered by Hawke/ Keating/ Rudd:
    Oh OK, if you think so daddy. What should we do?

    Message: Sweeping statement such as record interest rates or no child etc..
    If delivered by Coalition:
    Lies. Bloody misleading evil lies.

    Same message delivered by Hawke/ Keating/ Rudd:
    Oh daddy, you missed. But you're an ace guy for trying, unlike those heartless Liberals.

    Message: Too much union power is bad for the country
    If delivered by Coalition:
    Yeah, that's right - you don't like the unions coz they fight for the rights of the working family.

    Same message delivered by Hawke/ Keating/ Rudd:
    OK Kevin. We trust you to get the balance right.

    Message: This union boss is a clown and he is an embarassment
    If delivered by Coalition:
    Keep your nose out of it you lying rodent.

    Same message delivered by Hawke/ Keating/ Rudd:
    Yeah, I guess. We don't want that sort of behaviour.

    Message: The (various) cases for funding of both private and public schools
    If delivered by Coalition:
    Same ol usual claptrap - I couldn't be bothered writing .

    Same message delivered by Hawke/ Keating/ Rudd:
    Yeah, I guess.

    I'll add more later.
    There is no cure for leftism. Its infestation of the host mostly diminishes with age except in the most rabid of specimens.

  2. #2
    CC Grandmaster Basil's Avatar
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    Message: It is important that all countries should be part of Kyoto for it to be workable
    If delivered by Coalition:
    Rubbish! Yank-loving old-school. Asleep at the wheel.

    Same message delivered by Hawke/ Keating/ Rudd:
    Rock on. You go Kevin and show some balls. *Please be quiet Peter Garrett, you're upsetting the mystique*
    There is no cure for leftism. Its infestation of the host mostly diminishes with age except in the most rabid of specimens.

  3. #3
    Account Permanently Banned Axiom's Avatar
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    Gunner(your last 2 posts)- great evidence that we are mass brainwashed and grossly ill-informed, as ive been banging on about here for the last 2 years !

  4. #4
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Gunner, the Libs get no sympathy at all from me on this one. Double standards may well abound but the Libs themselves have thrived off them throughout their terms in office (even having the cheek to pretend to be economically liberal while using excessive tax to raise excessive surpluses). If they are now being hoist on their own petard (and in so many ways I think they are), then they deserve it.

  5. #5
    CC Candidate Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham
    Gunner, the Libs get no sympathy at all from me on this one. Double standards may well abound but the Libs themselves have thrived off them throughout their terms in office (even having the cheek to pretend to be economically liberal while using excessive tax to raise excessive surpluses). If they are now being hoist on their own petard (and in so many ways I think they are), then they deserve it.
    Go a step further and agree that Gunner is correct.
    What the Gunner says of the majority of population views on his itmes listed is the perception that will lead to the reality of election defeat.

    Thus two future choices for the LNC .1 Spin harder. OR 2 Become less mean and more honest.
    How long will it take them to wake-up to trying 2?

  6. #6
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowyriverman
    Thus two future choices for the LNC .1 Spin harder. OR 2 Become less mean and more honest.
    How long will it take them to wake-up to trying 2?
    How long will it take you to avoid the very spin Gunner was talking about!! He has documented promises by Labor that are at least as rash, like "No child in poverty", as well as "The recession we had to have".
    “The history of the 20th century is full of examples of countries that set out to redistribute wealth and ended up redistributing poverty.”
    “There’s no point blaming the tragedies of socialism on the flaws or corruption of particular leaders. Any system which allows some people to exercise unbridled power over others is an open invitation to abuse, whether that system is called slavery or socialism or something else.”—Thomas Sowell

  7. #7
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham
    Double standards may well abound but the Libs themselves have thrived off them throughout their terms in office (even having the cheek to pretend to be economically liberal while using excessive tax to raise excessive surpluses).
    You think that taxes are too high?! I happen to agree, of course. But do you think that the other lot would have supported any attempt to lower them, or just used the usual envy-mongering leftist demagogery of "tax cuts for the rich".
    Last edited by Capablanca-Fan; 15-11-2007 at 10:34 PM.
    “The history of the 20th century is full of examples of countries that set out to redistribute wealth and ended up redistributing poverty.”
    “There’s no point blaming the tragedies of socialism on the flaws or corruption of particular leaders. Any system which allows some people to exercise unbridled power over others is an open invitation to abuse, whether that system is called slavery or socialism or something else.”—Thomas Sowell

  8. #8
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jono
    He has documented promises by Labor that are at least as rash, like "No child in poverty", as well as "The recession we had to have".
    The former was indeed a remarkably stupid promise which should have done a lot more electoral damage than it did, except that it was made at a safe point in the electoral cycle.

    As for the latter, what's the evidence - how avoidable was it? Or was it more that it was a true thing to say, but a stupid one?

  9. #9
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jono
    You think that taxes are too high?! I happen to agree, of course. But do you think that the other lot would have supported any attempt to lower them, or just used the usual eny-mongering leftist demagogery of "tax cuts for the rich".
    Well, the other lot certainly have supported some attempt to lower them, by matching nearly all the Coalition's tax cuts.

    And there is something worse about the Coalition overtaxing than Labor doing it, because the Coalition have historically made more noises about being against that sort of thing.

    And yes, I do think taxes are too high (not only for lowish income earners but probably for more or less everybody). This is not a difficult position for me to argue, since while I do support increased expenditure in some areas, on the whole I support reductions and in some cases abolitions. The tricky bit though is that in my case the reductions in some areas are conditional on the increases in others.

  10. #10
    CC Grandmaster Basil's Avatar
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    Message: I believe in budget surpluses
    If delivered by Coalition:
    You are over-taxing the people. Howard and Costello are out of touch and they don't get that WORKING FAMILIES need that money in their pockets.

    Same message delivered by Rudd (this month!!!!!!)
    Good 'ol Kevin. He's an economic conservative. He'll see us right and make sure there's always enough money in the tin.
    Last edited by Basil; 16-11-2007 at 12:47 AM.
    There is no cure for leftism. Its infestation of the host mostly diminishes with age except in the most rabid of specimens.

  11. #11
    CC Grandmaster Basil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham
    Gunner, the Libs get no sympathy at all from me on this one.
    Don't want sympathy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham
    Double standards may well abound but the Libs themselves have thrived off them throughout their terms in office
    You've missed the point. My post is not about the politicians. It's about the facile open-mouthed voters who (genuinely ) view a policy differently depending on whose gob it comes out of.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham
    pretend to be economically liberal while using excessive tax to raise excessive surpluses).
    Huh? I think we best leave that one alone. Perhaps allow yourself a little teensy peek at post 10 and then turn away quickly.
    Last edited by Basil; 16-11-2007 at 12:24 AM.
    There is no cure for leftism. Its infestation of the host mostly diminishes with age except in the most rabid of specimens.

  12. #12
    CC Grandmaster Garrett's Avatar
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    Re: WorkChoices

    I don't see why the evil right winged conservatives dont just go the whole hog and re-introduce slavery. It would :-

    - Reduce unemplyment to nil.
    - Reduce inflation (slaves don't spend much).
    - Reduce interest rates (due to reduced inflation).
    - Increase productivity.
    - Induce slaves to take up cheap pastimes like chess.

  13. #13
    CC Grandmaster Capablanca-Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garrett
    I don't see why the evil right winged conservatives dont just go the whole hog and re-introduce slavery. It would :-

    - Reduce unemplyment to nil.
    - Reduce inflation (slaves don't spend much).
    - Reduce interest rates (due to reduced inflation).
    - Increase productivity.
    - Induce slaves to take up cheap pastimes like chess.
    Slavery would violate the free market though. And historically, they did NOT raise productivity. They were the result of wealth not the cause of it in Greece Rome. And the Union defeated the Confederacy in the US Civil War largely because of the economic superiority of the Free States.
    “The history of the 20th century is full of examples of countries that set out to redistribute wealth and ended up redistributing poverty.”
    “There’s no point blaming the tragedies of socialism on the flaws or corruption of particular leaders. Any system which allows some people to exercise unbridled power over others is an open invitation to abuse, whether that system is called slavery or socialism or something else.”—Thomas Sowell

  14. #14
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gunner Duggan
    You've missed the point. My post is not about the politicians. It's about the facile open-mouthed voters who (genuinely ) view a policy differently depending on whose gob it comes out of.
    Many voters on all sides are like that, so you're not telling anyone the news on that front. It's just like many sports fans who find exceptional skill on their own team admirable and exceptional skill from the other team either boring or suspect. I guess it is worth stating now and then, but perhaps a coverage across all parties would be more illuminating. (Greens supporters in particular should be a fertile harvest. )

    Huh? I think we best leave that one alone. Perhaps allow yourself a little teensy peek at post 10 and then turn away quickly.
    Naaah, I'd rather respond to it by pointing out that it's one thing to say you believe in budget surpluses, and they are a good thing - in moderation.

    It's another altogether to say you believe in budget surpluses but then deliver one massively larger than expected because your forecasting is horrendously out of whack and has been so throughout the tenure of your regime, even though your side is supposed to be the one that is good at these things.

  15. #15
    CC Grandmaster Spiny Norman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham
    It's another altogether to say you believe in budget surpluses but then deliver one massively larger than expected because your forecasting is horrendously out of whack and has been so throughout the tenure of your regime, even though your side is supposed to be the one that is good at these things.
    I'd rather have pessimistic economic forecasting resulting in larger-than-expected surpluses, than have optimistic economic forecasting resulting in unexpected budgets. In business, in running a chess club, in managing my own household, I *always* forecast pessimistically on both revenue and expenses. This tends to result in better-than-expected results, which is always a very pleasant feeling. Of course, you can simply point out that "they should get their forecasts right", but if they did that we'd probably accuse them of being witches and burn them all at the stake.
    “As you perhaps know, I haven't always been a Christian. I didn't go to religion to make me happy. I always knew a bottle of port would do that. If you want a religion to make you feel really comfortable, I certainly don't recommend Christianity.” -- C.S.Lewis

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