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  1. #16
    CC International Master Brian_Jones's Avatar
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    Photos at

    http://asianchess.net/wp/?p=1970

    and

    http://asianchess.net/wp/?p=1988

    and

    http://www.fide.com/component/conten...in-sydney.html

    Asian Master titles awarded to Ari Dale, Vineetha Wijesurija and Tarek Al-Taher.

    ************************************************** ************************************************** *********

  2. #17
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    I've had some interesting correspondence with FIDE about title rules for the 2012 Asian Seniors that I thought I'd note here for reference in future cases.

    Quote Originally Posted by heligan
    I was told, unofficially, that one third of the federations in the Asian zone had to take part in the Seniors before titles would be awarded in that. There are roughly 50 federations in the Asian zone. Unfortunately, I can't find any formal regulations on the FIDE website or the Asian Chess Federation site. So Brian, please, some clarification would be welcome, for both Amateur and Senior events...

    Update! I found the relevant regulations for the Seniors (and all other championships) at
    http://www.fide.com/fide/handbook.ht...8&view=article

    ...which does require that one third of the federations take part, before any automatic titles or norms can be awarded. There does not seem to be any automatic title on offer in a continental amateur championship.
    Now, we received a query from someone claiming to be a previous winner (haven't checked if he was or not as it doesn't matter) asking why the 2012 Asian Senior winner was not a direct title IM.

    In the process I investigated the rule mentioned above (NB link no longer working) and discovered it had been changed on the FIDE website only a few days after the Asian Senior ended.

    So I asked FIDE when it was actually changed and it turned out that this rule was changed in 2009 and that, effective mid-2010 at the latest, the rule for direct titles has no longer required that. However, it was not updated on the FIDE website until 2012. A common problem and nowhere near the record for slow updating (which to my knowledge stands at nine years!)

    This is the rule as stands now:

    With the exception of IBCA, ICSC and IPCA, in the continental, regional or other associations' competitions mentioned below, a title or result can be achieved if at least one third or three of the appropriate member federations — whichever is lower - participate in the event.
    The minimum number of participants in the tournament is eight.


    It seems that the tournament could have been eligible for titles and norms but for this catch:

    1.17 The tournament shall be conducted by an International Arbiter, failing that, by a FIDE Arbiter.

    The arbiter at the time of the tournament (Brian) was not titled at the time of the tournament, although it was one of his FA title norms. Of course, had there been a general knowledge that titles were awardable despite the relatively low-strength field, perhaps a titled arbiter would have been found (or perhaps there would have been some other obstacle).

    Among the many lessons in this (and I made the odd mistake while getting to the bottom of it all too) is that at times what appears in the online Handbook is not reliable.
    Last edited by Kevin Bonham; 08-05-2013 at 08:09 PM.

  3. #18
    CC International Master Brian_Jones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham
    The arbiter at the time of the tournament (Brian) was not titled at the time of the tournament, although it was one of his FA title norms. Of course, had there been a general knowledge that titles were awardable despite the relatively low-strength field, perhaps a titled arbiter would have been found (or perhaps there would have been some other obstacle).
    We have good grounds for special dispensation here as IA Casto Abundo cried off at short notice. IA Gary Bekker took over the FIDE Arbiter Seminar with assistance from IA Charles Zworestine. However both were unavailable as arbiters for the Asian Seniors/Amateur because of work commitments so I was left on my own with Shane Burgess (both IO's).

    We could also argue that Gary and Charles were overseers.

  4. #19
    CC Candidate Master heligan's Avatar
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    Im

    So messing up my last round game against Luchtmeijer in the Asian Seniors might have cost me an IM title, as well as everything else? Ah well. Probably for the best. The number of people who would have died laughing if I'd been made an IM does not bear thinking about...

  5. #20
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian_Jones
    We have good grounds for special dispensation here as IA Casto Abundo cried off at short notice. IA Gary Bekker took over the FIDE Arbiter Seminar with assistance from IA Charles Zworestine. However both were unavailable as arbiters for the Asian Seniors/Amateur because of work commitments so I was left on my own with Shane Burgess (both IO's).

    We could also argue that Gary and Charles were overseers.
    Perhaps. But the impression I gained from the email I wasn't supposed to see is that they will only award the title and norms if they can't avoid doing so under the rules, which is understandable. So I won't be taking it further unless Council asks me to.

  6. #21
    CC Candidate Master heligan's Avatar
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    wim norm?

    Was just checking the Zonal regulations when I noticed the Asian Senior Women's regulations. Silver in the Asian Senior Women's (which I won, technically, by being second out of two women in the event) should get a 9-game wim norm. Brian, if you are pursuing these titles and norms, then I should like that one please! wfm Shirchin Battsengel should get the wim title, too...

  7. #22
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by heligan
    Was just checking the Zonal regulations when I noticed the Asian Senior Women's regulations. Silver in the Asian Senior Women's (which I won, technically, by being second out of two women in the event) should get a 9-game wim norm. Brian, if you are pursuing these titles and norms, then I should like that one please! wfm Shirchin Battsengel should get the wim title, too...
    This was already discussed in Istanbul; Battsengel applied for WIM and it was rejected. I was there but can't find any mention of it in the minutes. From memory the reason Battsengel was rejected is that there were not enough female participants. The rules envisage awarding the titles from a specific Womens event; if it is awarded from a mixed event then the requirement for the number of female participants must still be met.

  8. #23
    CC Candidate Master heligan's Avatar
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    So there would need to be three, ie three federations? Oh well. Maybe next time!

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