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  1. #61
    CC Grandmaster Basil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham
    Did anyone really hate John Major though?
    No I don't think so. While I stand broadly by my spouted adage, it's clearly a generality at best. I think John Major, Winston Churchill and others are examples of why I'd never subject the statement to rigorous testing.
    There is no cure for leftism. Its infestation of the host mostly diminishes with age except in the most rabid of specimens.

  2. #62
    Reader in Slood Dynamics Rincewind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Underpants
    No I don't think so. While I stand broadly by my spouted adage, it's clearly a generality at best. I think John Major, Winston Churchill and others are examples of why I'd never subject the statement to rigorous testing.
    I think a lot of people hated Winston Churchill. He was the sort of prime minister you need during war time and for the same reasons the sort of PM that cannot be tolerated during times of enduring peace. I believe Attlee made that point after the famous "Gestapo" gaff during the 1945 campaign.

    Anyway, despite Churchill's wartime hero status, there was a dramatic landslide win to Labour in the 1945, largely credited to Labour's social reform platform.
    So einfach wie möglich, aber nicht einfacher - Albert Einstein

  3. #63
    CC Grandmaster Basil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rincewind
    I think a lot of people hated Winston Churchill. He was the sort of prime minister you need during war time and for the same reasons the sort of PM that cannot be tolerated during times of enduring peace. I believe Attlee made that point after the famous "Gestapo" gaff during the 1945 campaign.

    Anyway, despite Churchill's wartime hero status, there was a dramatic landslide win to Labour in the 1945, largely credited to Labour's social reform platform.
    Quite unfamiliar. Happy to take your assessment on board.
    There is no cure for leftism. Its infestation of the host mostly diminishes with age except in the most rabid of specimens.

  4. #64
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Churchill was back again as PM in 1951 (at age 76 when returned to office!), although that was also a "time of war" to some degree (Korean War and various imperial conflicts).

  5. #65
    CC Grandmaster antichrist's Avatar
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    Even going back to Heath I don't think anyone hated him, we liked him coz he was a sailor who even may have sailed to Australia. And Arold Wilson there was nothing wrong with him in spite of what Alf Garnett used to say.

  6. #66
    Reader in Slood Dynamics Rincewind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham
    Churchill was back again as PM in 1951 (at age 76 when returned to office!), although that was also a "time of war" to some degree (Korean War and various imperial conflicts).
    I don't know much about the 1951 election but according to wiki it was a bit of a disaster. Labour called a very early election in order to try and increase its margin, it backfired and despite garner more of the vote Labour lost mainly due to the first past the post system. Churchill formed a government in a coalition with the help of the National Liberals
    So einfach wie möglich, aber nicht einfacher - Albert Einstein

  7. #67
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rincewind
    Labour called a very early election in order to try and increase its margin, it backfired and despite garner more of the vote Labour lost mainly due to the first past the post system.
    The Wikipedia article is a bit misleading on that. The fact is that the Tories and their partners the National Liberals got over 51% of the popular vote between them, which they had not done in 1950, and thus they would also have won a combined majority under proportional representation.

    In the 1950 election the Liberals (as opposed to National Liberals) split the anti-Labour vote somewhat and that prevented the Tories and Nat Libs from getting a majority of either votes or seats between them. If anything it is the 1950 election that shows FPP in action because this vote-splitting would have given Labour some seats that would otherwise have gone Tory.

    It really has little to do with FPP, and to the extent that it has anything to do with FPP it could also happen under preferential voting.

    An interesting difference to Australia is that because party discipline in the UK is weaker, a majority of anything less than 10 seats typically isn't stable.

  8. #68
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    The UK finally gets a new Labour leader tonight our time. The brothers Miliband are the main contenders here and the system involves preferential voting by three equally-weighted bodies: the party's rank-and-file membership, the affiliated unions and other organisations, and the party's Commons and European Parliament MPs.

    David Miliband has been the frontrunner for much of this process but in the last 24 hours there is a lot of speculation that Ed, who is seen as less Blairite and more left-wing, will just squeak over the line.

  9. #69
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Ed's got the job. He got home with a two-candidate preferred margin of just 50.65:49.35.

  10. #70
    CC Grandmaster Adamski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Bonham
    Ed's got the job. He got home with a two-candidate preferred margin of just 50.65:49.35.
    If that had been the final election result, they too would have a hung parliament.
    God exists. Short and to the point.

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  11. #71
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adamski
    If that had been the final election result, they too would have a hung parliament.
    It's a year for close finishes since the UK did get a hung parliament in their general election and now the Labour Party (effectively the loser) can't unite behind a specific choice for leader.

    Ed will face a legitimacy issue because neither the rank and file nor the parliamentarians got him over the line - it was the unions that did it.

  12. #72
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    Ed Miliband was the cabinet minister that pushed through the bill allowing chess to be recognised as a sport back in 2006. In practical terms, it meant chess clubs can apply for charitable status and get extra funding.

  13. #73
    CC Grandmaster arosar's Avatar
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    Lib Dems caught in a massive lie.

    AR

  14. #74
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    Is it anything new? Our ALP wasn't intended on keeping their promises either.
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  15. #75
    Monster of the deep Kevin Bonham's Avatar
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    Not the only ones. A Labour MP who won re-election against a Lib Dem by 103 votes, but in the process made false claims about his opponent, has had his election overturned and is banned from running for office for 3 years.

    This is contrary to Australian practice in which you can only lose your seat for misleading voters about technical aspects of casting a vote. You can lie about your opponent all you want here and it is for the voters to decide what should occur.

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