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Garvinator
19-04-2008, 05:48 PM
Hello all prospective tournament entrants and interested parties,

With only one game remaining in the previous tournament and that game looks like going for a while, I think it is time to start the formal discussions and collection of entries for the next tournament.


Entries:

Dilly boy
Garrett
Alexrules01

Garvinator
19-04-2008, 05:53 PM
Rules


Time control:

The time control is 30 days plus 3 days per move. This works exactly like an over the board fischer time control, in that a player receives an initial 30 days and will receive an extra 3 days for every move you make.

A player must also make one move in each individual remaining game per seven days.

If a player requires some extra 'holiday' time, then you will need to contact me before you time out to request this time. It is not retrospective. There is a maximum of seven days allowed.

This will be the first tournament on here which has used this time control, so I would not be surprised if there are some teething problems along the way.



Databases/opening books and other assistance:

Engine assistance and endgame tablebases can not be used. Opening books are fine. Each person is playing as an individual, so getting advice from other people is forbidden.



Format:

If more than 6 entries: Single round robin, with order of entry determining seed number
If equal to or less than 6 entries: Double round robin, with order of entry determining seed number

If Boris and/or Sunshine enter, their games will start after their last game finishes from the previous tournament. Of course they can start earlier if they wish to.

Garrett
19-04-2008, 06:00 PM
yep, I'm in.

Cheers
Garrett.

Zwischenzug
19-04-2008, 06:05 PM
Hmmmm, is the one move a week rule still active? Sounds like a player can make some moves and when losing just "let the flag fall" :eek:.

Basil
19-04-2008, 06:06 PM
RulesOpening books are fine.
You CANNOT be serious!!!!!!!
Some opening books play entire games with key gambits and ideas played right through to the end of their conclusion - including ideas 5 moves and more deep.

Where is the point in beating a friend this way?

I vote: Trash this rule!

Axiom
19-04-2008, 06:08 PM
You CANNOT be serious!!!!!!!
Some opening play entire games with key gambits amd ideas played right through to the end of their conclusion - including ideas 5 moves and more deep.

I vote: Trash this rule!
SECONDED

Garrett
19-04-2008, 06:11 PM
[QUOTE=Gunner Duggan]You CANNOT be serious!!!!!!!
QUOTE]

McEnDuggan ?

CameronD
19-04-2008, 06:49 PM
You CANNOT be serious!!!!!!!
Some opening books play entire games with key gambits and ideas played right through to the end of their conclusion - including ideas 5 moves and more deep.

Where is the point in beating a friend this way?

I vote: Trash this rule!

I disagree, this is a good way to learn openings.

Gunner should note that database searches and personal books (win with the tromposky) are legal as they are considered public.

ps- I'm using no assistence at all for my colle game with gunner

Kevin Bonham
19-04-2008, 06:55 PM
I thought virtually all CC tournaments, even those that banned computers rigorously, allowed use of books on openings.

Garrett
19-04-2008, 06:56 PM
ps- I'm using no assistence at all for my colle game with gunner

yes we know.

Basil
19-04-2008, 07:06 PM
Now this is silly. Consulting anything is assistance.

FWIW, I will never be party to a corro game where consulting books, dbs, other people's games and similar is involved. What. Is. The. Point?

Carry on! I'm sure you will.

CameronD
19-04-2008, 07:10 PM
Now this is silly. Consulting anything is assistance.

FWIW, I will never be party to a corro game where consulting books, dbs, other people's games and similar is involved. What. Is. The. Point?

Carry on! I'm sure you will.

Thats the rules for correspondence play

Axiom
19-04-2008, 07:12 PM
Now this is silly. Consulting anything is assistance.

FWIW, I will never be party to a corro game where consulting books, dbs, other people's games and similar is involved. What. Is. The. Point?

Carry on! I'm sure you will.
I have to agree .
I like the idea we are playing in a tournament hall albeit a virtual one.

just imagine an OTB game with opening books open next to the board.

"The true warrior must fight by his wit alone" - Ax Tsu

Basil
19-04-2008, 07:13 PM
Thats the rules for correspondence play
Really? I am proposing that we take those and bash them so far up ...

Axiom
19-04-2008, 07:14 PM
Thats the rules for correspondence play
in that case correspondence SUX ! :D

ER
19-04-2008, 10:07 PM
Is this the historic occassion where Gunner and Ax managed to agree on something? Is this setting a trend?
Cheers and good luck!

Basil
19-04-2008, 10:21 PM
Is this the historic occassion where Gunner and Ax managed to agree on something? Is this setting a trend?
Cheers and good luck!
Ax and Gunner agree on many things and on many levels, but it's bad for ratings if we play to them in public too much ;)

Desmond
20-04-2008, 06:23 AM
What is the point of 30 + 3 when you have to make each move in 7 days anyway?

Garrett
20-04-2008, 08:07 AM
What is the point of 30 + 3 when you have to make each move in 7 days anyway?

probably the same point as in 90 + 30 time control when you have to make your first move in an hour.

I think it's to outlaw dying.

Garvinator
20-04-2008, 06:12 PM
Still looking for more entries.

Basil
20-04-2008, 06:21 PM
Still looking for more entries.
For you middle-game tournament!?

Garvinator
20-04-2008, 06:30 PM
For you middle-game tournament!?
Simple question for you.

How is the policy you wish to see actually enforced, except for trust?

Basil
20-04-2008, 06:33 PM
Simple question for you.

How else is the policy you wish to see actually enforced, except for trust?
The same as the rest of the correspondence policies are enforced. Trust.

Garvinator
25-04-2008, 02:13 AM
Any more entries?

Axiom
25-04-2008, 02:45 AM
I enter

Desmond
25-04-2008, 07:08 AM
Any more entries?
The time control is too complicated for my liking.

Garvinator
28-04-2008, 05:48 PM
Requesting that this thread be stickied so it stops being lost in all the games whilst I attempt to get more entries. Otherwise I keep having to make posts in this thread to keep it up the top.

Kevin Bonham
28-04-2008, 05:49 PM
Done.

Kerry Stead
30-04-2008, 05:57 PM
Count me in for this one

Garvinator
30-04-2008, 06:08 PM
Dilly boy
Garrett
Alexrules01
Axiom
Kerry Stead

Sunshine??

Garvinator
04-05-2008, 07:45 PM
Entries are still open. 5 players so far. Entries close 11:59pm Friday 9/5/08. Games will be posted Saturday morning.

Basil
04-05-2008, 08:49 PM
Roll up. Roll up. Chess Chat's Middle game Tournament is about to commence.

Sunshine
05-05-2008, 12:54 PM
Dilly boy
Garrett
Alexrules01
Axiom
Kerry Stead

Sunshine??

Not for me this time - but I'll be back for more.

Garvinator
09-05-2008, 10:40 AM
Entries close tonight, so those wanting to enter had better express interest or be left out and will have to wait months for the next one.

ER
09-05-2008, 01:47 PM
please count me in! :)
good luck to all

Garvinator
09-05-2008, 02:01 PM
Entries so far:


Dilly boy
Garrett
Alexrules01
Axiom
Kerry Stead
justaknight

Reminder to all prospective entries.

Now that we have six entries, if someone else joins the tournament it will become a single round robin with order of entry being used as your seed number for pairing purposes.

ER
09-05-2008, 02:18 PM
Hi GG i will need a short tutorial to refresh my memory in using the interactive board
Cheers and good luck!

PS has Harold from Brizzy chickened out?

CameronD
09-05-2008, 07:50 PM
I will enter on the condition that I can have a 3 week break during August\September as I'll be on vacation at the coast without internet access.

Basil
09-05-2008, 10:28 PM
as I'll be on vacation at the coast without internet access.
Please don't say 'vacation'.

Garvinator
10-05-2008, 12:16 AM
Entries are now closed. Have pm'ed Rincewind to move the previous cc tournament to the archive section and to create a new sub forum for this tournament.

As the tournament now has seven entries, it will be single round robin.


Dilly boy
Garrett
Alexrules01
Axiom
Kerry Stead
justaknight
CameronD

Garvinator
10-05-2008, 03:43 AM
Will create all the tournament games later today. Not going to create them at 3:43am :eek:

Garrett
10-05-2008, 09:10 AM
Will create all the tournament games later today. Not going to create them at 3:43am :eek:

Wuss

Garvinator
10-05-2008, 12:38 PM
Wuss
But where did it fit on the scale of wussiness?

Garvinator
10-05-2008, 12:39 PM
Hi GG i will need a short tutorial to refresh my memory in using the interactive board
Sorry but this is not part of the free service. The above request is a premium membership feature and costs extra ;) :whistle:

Shark93
10-05-2008, 01:42 PM
I'd like to join if I still can.

Garvinator
10-05-2008, 04:58 PM
I'd like to join if I still can.
Have sent a pm.

ER
11-05-2008, 02:26 PM
Sorry but this is not part of the free service. The above request is a premium membership feature and costs extra ;) :whistle:

:P, sorry mate, I just discovered an obscure thread that explains everything! :owned: All I need now is to sit for an afternoon and lear how to do ladders adn results and pairings look good when i publish them :P :owned:
That's not to say i am not greatful for your assistance to correct my messy posts up to now!
Cheers and good luck!

Garrett
11-05-2008, 06:07 PM
I'd like to join if I still can.

sorry bud. Like Garvo said in post #31. You missed the cut.

Cheers
Garrett.

Garvinator
11-05-2008, 06:35 PM
sorry bud. Like Garvo said in post #31. You missed the cut.

Cheers
Garrett.
:hmm: Ziah has been added to the tournament as the eighth entrant.

Garvinator
12-05-2008, 12:11 PM
Reminder to all participants, check the second page for games. It is easy to forget that there are games on the second page.

Garvinator
15-05-2008, 03:08 PM
To all participants,

Please keep the chain of moves intact by just adding your move to the rest of the chain of moves, instead of just adding your move using the post reply button.

This makes it easier to create the pgn boards and also reduces the chances of a recording error and then claims of illegal moves and/or claims of blunders caused by notation errors leading to poor game moves being made.

Trent Parker
16-05-2008, 12:54 PM
To all participants,

Please keep the chain of moves intact by just adding your move to the rest of the chain of moves, instead of just adding your move using the post reply button.

This makes it easier to create the pgn boards and also reduces the chances of a recording error and then claims of illegal moves and/or claims of blunders caused by notation errors leading to poor game moves being made.

Hello garvin

I have been putting in the moves into the first pgn of each page as we play them. I do this as I do not want lots of pgn viewers on a single page.

Its easier for me to put the moves into the pgn viewer than to have the string in every single mo fo ing post.

Thnking you

Dilly Boy.

Kerry Stead
19-05-2008, 04:41 PM
1-0 Kerry Stead v AlexRules01

Alexrules01
19-05-2008, 05:09 PM
1-0 Alexrules01 vs Axiom

Capablanca-Fan
21-05-2008, 12:20 PM
A much better tournament than the last one.

Garvinator
21-05-2008, 03:25 PM
A much better tournament than the last one.
Yeah, these games are actually getting played :whistle:

ER
21-05-2008, 04:29 PM
Yeah, these games are actually getting played :whistle:

:hmm: :doh: :eek:

Trent Parker
22-05-2008, 09:43 AM
http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/violent002.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org)

Damn you Ax! :lol:

The ax has fallen :D

http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/violent019.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org)
Dilly Boy 0 - 1 Axiom

Shark93
23-05-2008, 10:59 AM
I had to go to my mum's house for a week while my dad went to the gold coast, and I just got back and found out I've forfeited my games. Why is that, I have not overstepped the 30 day time limit :|.

Trent Parker
23-05-2008, 12:11 PM
Some silly rule they wanted to implement..... that a move had to be made in 7 days or notify ggray of an absence

I was for a 14 day limit but...... oh well.....

Kevin Bonham
23-05-2008, 12:20 PM
I had to go to my mum's house for a week while my dad went to the gold coast, and I just got back and found out I've forfeited my games. Why is that, I have not overstepped the 30 day time limit :|.

Rules were clearly stated in post 2:


The time control is 30 days plus 3 days per move. This works exactly like an over the board fischer time control, in that a player receives an initial 30 days and will receive an extra 3 days for every move you make.

A player must also make one move in each individual remaining game per seven days. [my bolding]

Desmond
23-05-2008, 01:29 PM
Which defeats the purpose of the 30 + 3. Is anyone even tracking that in their games?

Zwischenzug
23-05-2008, 01:31 PM
Does that mean that if a game goes for more than a month it is a double forfeit? Or is it a forfeit for the player that failed to make the move by the 30th day (regardless of whether the 7 days/move deadline has been breached)?

Garvinator
23-05-2008, 02:33 PM
Just to update all players. Currently in pm back and forth with Ziah. Will inform of decision once something is sorted out.

Basil
23-05-2008, 03:30 PM
Mr Wisdom of Solomon available for modest fee.

Desmond
23-05-2008, 03:49 PM
Mr Wisdom of Solomon available for modest fee.The rules were clearly stated, but not stated clearly?

Basil
23-05-2008, 04:13 PM
The rules were clearly stated, but not stated clearly?
I haven't looked into it yet (read: just dribbling without the facts (my specialty)). I gleaned that there might have been some contradictory stipulations, in which case one requires WOS.

Kevin Bonham
23-05-2008, 04:54 PM
Which defeats the purpose of the 30 + 3.

The point wasn't to give players more flexibility but to stop players stringing out games for ages at one move per week (at which rate games could go for more than a year if one players was slow.)


Is anyone even tracking that in their games?

Probably no need to because unless an opponent averages more than 3 days per move it can't become relevant, and most of them are clearly faster than that.


Does that mean that if a game goes for more than a month it is a double forfeit?

No. Your time only runs when it's your turn, like a normal chess clock, plus there is an increment per move.

Garrett
23-05-2008, 07:44 PM
Rules were clear as far as I'm concerned, what's the problem ?

CameronD
24-05-2008, 01:00 AM
Geez!!!

This tournament is worth absolute nothing. Just enjoy your game and let him off with a warning.

Ziah... We'll keep playing our game and if garvin tries to interfer, we'll tie him down in a spare room and let axiom talk to him for a week

Garvinator
24-05-2008, 03:04 PM
Dear Participants,

Following a few pm's back and forth with Ziah, I am satisfied that Ziah was not aware of the seven day rule and was only aware of the 30 day + 3 rule. Of course it was Ziah's responsibility to be aware of all the rules before entering.

It is my opinion that Ziah's lack of knowledge of the 7 day rule was caused in part by him being a late entrant.

I have accepted Ziah's explanation for why he timed out and Ziah is now aware of all his obligations and the ramifications if he times out again.

I therefore reverse my previous decisions and the two games are to continue from their previous board position. Can a mod please remove the games scores in the thread title of the two re-instated games? [done-mod]

At least now all players are aware of the 7 day rule and so it will now be zero tolerance applied.

ER
24-05-2008, 07:13 PM
Is there a chance to have some kind of an indicator, of how much time ie days, weeks etc do we have at our disposal?
i presume the date we posted our last move yeah? But I want to clarify something, is it accumulated?

Garvinator
24-05-2008, 10:22 PM
Is there a chance to have some kind of an indicator, of how much time ie days, weeks etc do we have at our disposal?
i presume the date we posted our last move yeah? But I want to clarify something, is it accumulated?
If you are referring to the seven day rule, then the time of your opponents last move is listed in their move post.

The 30 + 3 days requires calculation and from the move rates of most players should not even come into any kind of calculation. If someone was regularly using a lot of time, I would have to do the manual calculations for it.

Capablanca-Fan
26-05-2008, 03:10 PM
Geez!!!

This tournament is worth absolute nothing. Just enjoy your game and let him off with a warning.

Ziah... We'll keep playing our game and if garvin tries to interfer, we'll tie him down in a spare room and let axiom talk to him for a week
Come on, don't diss Garvin, who was merely applying the agreed rules fairly. He is open to discussion as shown above. And he could be playing himself instead of looking after it, to a high level as shown elsewhere on ChessChat.

ER
26-05-2008, 07:20 PM
If you are referring to the seven day rule, then the time of your opponents last move is listed in their move post.

The 30 + 3 days requires calculation and from the move rates of most players should not even come into any kind of calculation. If someone was regularly using a lot of time, I would have to do the manual calculations for it.

everything clear, thanks GG!
Cheers and good luck!

Garrett
03-06-2008, 05:47 PM
1-0 Garrett v AlexRules01

1-0 Garrett v Kerry Stead

Alexrules01
04-06-2008, 10:56 PM
1-0 Alexrules vs Dilly Boy

Alexrules01
11-06-2008, 11:30 PM
0-1 CameronD vs Alexrules01

Garrett
25-06-2008, 04:39 AM
1-0 Garrett Vs CameronD

Trent Parker
01-07-2008, 12:46 PM
Dilly Boy .5-.5 Garrett

CameronD
05-07-2008, 08:59 PM
Ax 0 - 1 Cameron

Garvinator
06-07-2008, 10:40 AM
Axiom banned for a week after admitting he has deliberately disobeyed moderation directions.Only just seen above ruling.

I am trying to work out why I should not throw Axiom out of the tournament right now. and possibly not re-admit him for the next one or for a long time to come.

In this last tournament he played, he spent two weeks and then a further week on the sidelines, which delayed that tournament.

I was reluctant to admit him to this tournament based on his previous behaviour and his continual ability to get suspended while playing in the organised correspondence tournaments on here.

CameronD
06-07-2008, 10:49 AM
Only just seen above ruling.

I am trying to work out why I should not throw Axiom out of the tournament right now. and possibly not re-admit him for the next one or for a long time to come.

In this last tournament he played, he spent two weeks and then a further week on the sidelines, which delayed that tournament.

I was reluctant to admit him to this tournament based on his previous behaviour and his continual ability to get suspended while playing in the organised correspondence tournaments on here.

With just one game left for him to play, I think he should be allowed to finish it to not distort the crosstable for other participants. Garvin then should permanently suspend him till his behaviour shows that he can be here without being suspended.

Kevin Bonham
06-07-2008, 09:15 PM
Only just seen above ruling.

I am trying to work out why I should not throw Axiom out of the tournament right now. and possibly not re-admit him for the next one or for a long time to come.

Ax has only one game remaining and even with his ban reinstated today it is still possible he will manage his next move without losing on time as his opponent, Ziah, is to move by tomorrow afternoon. Axiom's ban currently expires 13/7/08 at 7pm - he will have between two and 19 hours to make his move when unbanned depending on when Ziah moves, and will certainly have had plenty of time to think about the move.

My suggestion is that where someone times out because they are banned you treat it the same way as if they time out for any other reason (ie do not allow any extensions for a player who has got themselves banned, and if someone loses all their games on timeout as a result then deal with them accordingly so far as future tournaments go.) If they are banned but are able to continue their game without timeout then just ignore it.

Kevin Bonham
07-07-2008, 03:07 PM
^^^
Or Ax could win on timeout while he is suspended, of course. :wall: :wall: :wall:

Desmond
07-07-2008, 03:44 PM
What happens with timeouts on conditional moves? Eg, Player one plays X, if Y, then Z. Player two responds, Y. Does player one time out if they fail to reiterate Z within 7 days of player two's Y? Does player two timeout if they fail to respond to Z within 7 days of player one's post? Or does player two have 7 days from their own post of Y?

Kevin Bonham
07-07-2008, 04:34 PM
Or does player two have 7 days from their own post of Y?

Pretty sure it's this one. Once player two has made move Y, move Z is instantaneously player one's next move, and player two has seven days to reply to move Z.

Zwischenzug
07-07-2008, 04:34 PM
I think if the conditional is a forced move then yes. However if it isn't a forced move, then it becomes more tricky.

Garvinator
07-07-2008, 07:46 PM
Pretty sure it's this one. Once player two has made move Y, move Z is instantaneously player one's next move, and player two has seven days to reply to move Z.
If I have read Boris's question and algebra calculations correctly, then KB is correct.

I think most people who understand conditionals would also put move Z into the game notation.

Garvinator
07-07-2008, 07:49 PM
I think if the conditional is a forced move then yes. However if it isn't a forced move, then it becomes more tricky.
I dont think I understand your quote??

If Player One moves X... and then says if Player Two responds with Move Y, then they will play Move Z.

Player One MUST make move Z if, and only if Player Two did respond with Move Y

Zwischenzug
07-07-2008, 08:34 PM
Nevermind, I think I misread Boris's post.

Garvinator
08-07-2008, 07:27 AM
In each of these tournaments, I get left with the impression that my only real role is to enforce losses for players being slack :(

Garrett
08-07-2008, 07:31 AM
which you do very well Garvin.

It's necessary.

Capablanca-Fan
08-07-2008, 09:30 AM
In each of these tournaments, I get left with the impression that my only real role is to enforce losses for players being slack :(
When people enter a tournamen, they implicitly agree to follow the rules. No one should blame the arbiter for enforcing them.

CameronD
17-08-2008, 11:46 PM
Letting grayggray and opponents know that I will be on holidays and without internet from

22 September to 7 August

Thanks

Cameron

Garvinator
18-08-2008, 09:43 AM
I will assume you meant 22 August till 7 September ;) and that your absence will be because of the Surfers Paradise Open.

CameronD
18-08-2008, 07:55 PM
I will assume you meant 22 August till 7 September ;) and that your absence will be because of the Surfers Paradise Open.


Yes to the dates. My reason is because I'm on holidays at the coast for 2 weeks and will be playing chess for 3 days during the break.