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View Full Version : How far can you push a drawn position?



Phil Bourke
07-07-2007, 12:02 PM
In the current Swedish Championships, there was a Round 7 clash between IM Lindberg and GM Berg. Berg being co-leader of the tournament obviously didn't want anything less than a win, result a 183 move draw
Game will probably be available through TWIC, etc in a while, but if you wish to take a look immediately, then http://www.stockholmschack.nu/ladda_upp/filer/sm2007/Bulletin_Schack_SM_rond_7.pdf will show it to you. Game 2 is the one.
I was actually watching the game on FICS and decided around move 40 that it was a draw and went to bed, glad I didn't hang around until Berg decided it was a draw :)

Igor_Goldenberg
10-07-2007, 02:30 PM
To the point of losing it

eclectic
10-07-2007, 05:02 PM
I'd like to see all next year's Linares contestants agree to orchestrate 300 move draws in every game simply to cheese off signor Renteros :owned:

Kevin Bonham
10-07-2007, 06:48 PM
Here's the whopper. Not quite in the ten longest ever, but not far off:


1. e4 e6 2. d4 d5 3. Nc3 h6 4. Bd3 Nf6 5. Nge2 dxe4 6. Nxe4 Bd7 7. N2g3 Bc6 8.
c3 Nbd7 9. O-O Nxe4 10. Bxe4 Bxe4 11. Nxe4 Nf6 12. Nxf6+ Qxf6 13. Qa4+ c6 14.
Re1 Be7 15. Re3 Qf5 16. Bd2 O-O 17. Rae1 Bd6 18. Rf3 Qd5 19. Bf4 Bxf4 20. Rxf4
Rfd8 21. g3 Qd6 22. Qd1 Rd7 23. Qe2 Rad8 24. h4 Qd5 25. b3 c5 26. Qe3 Rc8 27.
dxc5 Rxc5 28. Re4 Rc8 29. Rd4 Rxc3 30. Rxd5 Rxe3 31. Rxd7 Rxe1+ 32. Kg2 Ra1 33.
a4 b5 34. Rxa7 Ra3 35. Ra8+ Kh7 36. Rf8 bxa4 37. bxa4 Kg6 38. Ra8 Kf6 39. a5 g5
40. hxg5+ hxg5 41. a6 Kf5 42. a7 g4 43. Kf1 Ra2 44. Kg2 e5 45. Rb8 Rxa7 46. Rb2
Ra4 47. Rb6 Ra5 48. Rc6 Kg5 49. Rb6 f5 50. Rb8 Ra6 51. Rc8 Kf6 52. Rh8 Rd6 53.
Ra8 Ke6 54. Ra5 Rd1 55. Ra8 Rd6 56. Ra5 Rc6 57. Ra1 Rc4 58. Ra5 Kd6 59. Ra8 Kd5
60. Rf8 Ke4 61. Rf7 Rc8 62. Re7 Rc2 63. Re8 Re2 64. Re7 Rd2 65. Re8 Ra2 66. Re7
Ra5 67. Re8 Kd3 68. Rf8 Ke4 69. Re8 Rb5 70. Re7 Rb2 71. Re8 Kd5 72. Rd8+ Ke4
73. Re8 Rb1 74. Re7 Rc1 75. Re8 Ra1 76. Re7 Ra8 77. Re6 Rh8 78. Re7 Kd5 79. Ra7
Rd8 80. Rf7 Ke6 81. Ra7 Rd7 82. Ra6+ Rd6 83. Ra8 Kd5 84. Rf8 Ke4 85. Re8 Rd5
86. Rf8 Rc5 87. Rf7 Rc6 88. Re7 Rc8 89. Re6 Rc7 90. Re8 Rc3 91. Re7 Kd5 92. Rf7
Rf3 93. Rd7+ Kc4 94. Rd8 e4 95. Rd7 Rd3 96. Rf7 Rd5 97. Ra7 Rd2 98. Kf1 Rb2 99.
Rf7 Rb5 100. Ke2 Kd4 101. Rd7+ Ke5 102. Re7+ Kf6 103. Re8 Kf7 104. Ra8 Rb3 105.
Kf1 Rb2 106. Ra6 Rb1+ 107. Kg2 Rb3 108. Rc6 Rf3 109. Ra6 Rd3 110. Rb6 Ke7 111.
Ra6 Rd6 112. Ra5 Kf6 113. Rb5 Ke6 114. Ra5 Rd5 115. Ra4 Ke5 116. Rb4 Ra5 117.
Rc4 Kd5 118. Rb4 Kc5 119. Rb8 Kd4 120. Rb3 Kc4 121. Rb8 Kd3 122. Rb3+ Kc2 123.
Rb8 Kd2 124. Rb2+ Kc3 125. Rb8 Kc2 126. Rd8 Ra3 127. Rd7 Rd3 128. Rf7 Rd5 129.
Kf1 Kd3 130. Ra7 Kc2 131. Ra2+ Kb3 132. Ra8 Rd1+ 133. Ke2 Rd3 134. Kf1 Kc3 135.
Ra3+ Kb2 136. Ra8 Rf3 137. Kg2 e3 138. fxe3 Rxe3 139. Rc8 Rc3 140. Rd8 Kc1 141.
Rd5 Rf3 142. Rd6 Kc2 143. Rd5 Kc3 144. Rd7 Rd3 145. Rf7 Rd2+ 146. Kf1 Rd5 147.
Kf2 Kd3 148. Re7 Rc5 149. Rd7+ Ke4 150. Re7+ Kd4 151. Rd7+ Ke5 152. Re7+ Kd4
153. Rd7+ Rd5 154. Re7 Re5 155. Rd7+ Ke4 156. Rd2 Rc5 157. Re2+ Kd3 158. Re3+
Kd4 159. Re2 Rc3 160. Re6 Rf3+ 161. Kg2 Re3 162. Rd6+ Ke4 163. Re6+ Kd3 164.
Rd6+ Ke2 165. Ra6 Rd3 166. Re6+ Re3 167. Ra6 Rd3 168. Re6+ Kd1 169. Re5 Rf3
170. Re6 Kd2 171. Re5 Kd3 172. Ra5 Ke4 173. Ra4+ Ke5 174. Ra5+ Kf6 175. Ra6+
Kg5 176. Ra8 Rb3 177. Rg8+ Kf6 178. Ra8 Rb2+ 179. Kg1 Kg6 180. Rg8+ Kf6 181.
Ra8 f4 182. Rf8+ Kg5 183. Rxf4 Ra2 1/2-1/2

Capablanca-Fan
10-07-2007, 07:41 PM
One of the most tedious and boooooring games I've ever seen! :evil:

Kevin Bonham
10-07-2007, 07:55 PM
It is indeed remarkably dull and pointless; I should have included a "play through at own risk of falling asleep for thirteen centuries" type note.

For those wondering, Black reaches KR3P vs KR2P with all pawns on one side on move 45. He bashes his head against a brick wall for another 93 moves before exchanging a pair of pawns, and doesn't get anywhere after that either.

Phil Bourke
10-07-2007, 09:15 PM
It is indeed remarkably dull and pointless; I should have included a "play through at own risk of falling asleep for thirteen centuries" type note.

For those wondering, Black reaches KR3P vs KR2P with all pawns on one side on move 45. He bashes his head against a brick wall for another 93 moves before exchanging a pair of pawns, and doesn't get anywhere after that either.
Yes indeed, I checked back the day after, just to see that I was correct in my evaluation of draw. Couldn't believe that it went on and on and on and on and on :)

Capablanca-Fan
10-07-2007, 11:11 PM
The whole game was boring from start to finish. Black was fortunate even to turn a dull totally equal position into a dull totally drawn position a pawn up.

And I have a confession to make: I skipped over 10 moves here and there, and found no change. It really needs a warning: "do not drive or operate heavy machinery after playing through this game."

Kevin Bonham
10-07-2007, 11:20 PM
If net boredom can be viewed as the amount of boredom in the game minus the amount of interest I think this is a serious candidate for the most boring game of all time!

WhiteElephant
10-07-2007, 11:52 PM
I can't believe I actually played through it.

As boring as it was to go through in a few minutes, imagine actually sitting at the board and playing those rook moves back and forth. Now that would be boring.

Garvinator
10-07-2007, 11:58 PM
As boring as it was to go through in a few minutes, imagine actually sitting at the board and playing those rook moves back and forth. Now that would be boring.Spare just one thought for the arbiters and organisers :eek:

CameronD
11-07-2007, 12:04 AM
Found that game to be really interesting and instructional to watch, will put it through fritz later. It would have been interesting to play as well, a minor error by either would have been disasterous. A lot to be learnt in the rook endgame.

Capablanca-Fan
11-07-2007, 10:32 AM
Passengers with Cameron driving are hereby given fair warning :P

Spiny Norman
11-07-2007, 10:53 AM
I'm with Cameron ... except that the lessons learned (about what sort of position constitutes a drawn position) could have been learned in at least 100 less moves!

Basil
11-07-2007, 11:01 AM
Passengers with Cameron driving are hereby given fair warning :P
A snappy 20 HCDs! The money is not for the sentiment (I'm not sure you were the first ;)), but for the material! Good work. Nothing personal Cameron - you must know that

Jono; a comedic, right-wing academic!!! What an unusual gent! :lol: More of them please.

Rincewind
11-07-2007, 11:09 AM
Jono; a comedic, right-wing academic!!! What an unusual gent! :lol: More of them please.

I assume by academic you mean "having no practical purpose or use". No other usage seems to apply. ;)

Desmond
11-07-2007, 11:40 AM
<yawn>

This type of position I suppose you'd push on for a while against a weak opponent, but there seems to be 0 point against a titled player. I probably would have offered a draw at about move 38. Or perhaps move 9 now that I think about it. :lol:

Cameron, I wouldn't waste any time studying this game. Study rook endings by all means, but study critical positions instead.

littlesprout85
14-08-2007, 05:50 PM
Wazz^ CC crew-

Sprouty like to say that heavy's still got Skills -RA - RA !!!!

Like to also say to this Question put forth by this topic- Can only push so far til 1. It pushes back
2. It Takes the position
3. It moves outta postion(unlocks restraints)

Really sprouty is just scratching the surface here-

ERrmmmm - Sprouty is Trying to figure out 'Why is KB's holding onto that game ems just posted in this thread :eek:

-Sprout :)