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Pharoah
06-07-2006, 12:42 PM
After, Bxh7, during the Greek Gift (the opponent O-O, I'm O-O-O)? You gotta have a Queen on the H-File, with a Rook behind it to checkmate right?

Thanks :)

Dozy
06-07-2006, 01:17 PM
There are lots of variations on the Greek Gift. It depends on where your pieces are deployed and whether your opponent can marshall his defence in time.

Often, after 1. Bxh7+ you need to be able to play 2. Ng5+ with the threat of 3. Qh5+.

Here's an unusual variation I got away with in a Chessbase game recently. The notation looks weird but it plays OK.

BTW, apropos that "other" thread this bloke's Internet rating was 1912. He lasted longer in our second game (27 moves). By comparison my current OTB rating is about 1550.

Event: Friendly Game, 20m + 0s
Site: Main Playing Hall
Date: 2006.04.21
Round: ?
White: Dozy
Black: Diabora
Result: 1-0
ECO: B80
BlackElo: 1912
Annotator: Evans,David
PlyCount: 33
TimeControl: 1200

1. e4 {[%emt 0:00:02]} c5 {[%emt 0:00:02]} 2. Nf3 {[%emt 0:00:02]} e6 {
[%emt 0:00:03]} 3. d4 {[%emt 0:00:01]} cxd4 {[%emt 0:00:02]} 4. Nxd4 {
[%emt 0:00:01]} a6 {[%emt 0:00:03]} 5. Nc3 {[%emt 0:00:02]} Nc6 {[%emt 0:00:02]
} 6. Be3 {[%emt 0:00:04]} Nf6 {[%emt 0:00:04]} 7. Bd3 {[%emt 0:00:04]} d6 {
[%emt 0:00:02]} 8. O-O {[%emt 0:00:03]} Be7 {[%emt 0:00:01]} 9. f4 {
[%emt 0:00:13]} O-O {[%emt 0:00:03]} 10. e5 {[%emt 0:00:04]} dxe5 {
[%emt 0:00:06]} 11. Nxc6 {[%emt 0:00:04]} bxc6 {[%emt 0:00:04]} 12. fxe5 {
[%emt 0:00:04]} Nd5 {[%emt 0:00:01]} 13. Nxd5 {[%emt 0:00:05]} cxd5 {
[%emt 0:00:07]} 14. Rf3 {[%emt 0:00:08]} Bb7 {[%emt 0:00:05]} 15. Bxh7+ {
[%emt 0:00:05]} Kxh7 {[%emt 0:00:14]} 16. Rh3+ {[%emt 0:00:01]} Kg6 {
[%emt 0:00:19]} 17. Qh5# {(Lag: Av=0.50s, max=0.8s) [%emt 0:00:04]} 1-0

Desmond
06-07-2006, 02:38 PM
what had you intended after 16. ... Kg8

EZBeet
06-07-2006, 02:53 PM
what had you intended after 16. ... Kg8

Good point, this is not really the 'greek gift' (still a worthwhile sac and well done). As mentioned above, it has to have Ng5+ after Kxh7 to qualify I think. The point being that black cannot then play ...Kg8 as he can here. After ...Kg6 then Qg4 is usual.

EZBeet
06-07-2006, 03:06 PM
Haven't tried pgn upload before (fingers crossed) here is an example of the greek gift. Usually it is a white plan but here black sees an opportunity to employ it.

Event: Queensland open
Site: The Gap
Date: 2006.04.15
Round: 1
White: EZerBeet
Black: EZBeet
Result: 0-1
ECO: A01
TimeControl: 3600+30

1. b3 e5 2. Bb2 Nc6 3. e3 d5 4. Bb5 Bd6 5. Ne2 Nf6 6.
O-O O-O 7. Bxc6 bxc6 8. c4 e4 9. Qc2 Bxh2+ 10. Kh1 Ng4 11. g3 Qg5 12. Nf4 Qh6
13. Kg2 Bg1 14. Nh3 Qxh3+ 15. Kxh3 Nxe3+ 16. Kh4 Nxc2 17. Rxg1 Nxa1 18. Bxa1
Be6 19. c5 a5 20. Be5 a4 21. b4 a3 22. Nc3 f6 23. Bxc7 g5+ 24. Kh5 Kg7 25. f4
exf3 26. Rf1 d4 27. Ne4 Bxa2 28. Kg4 Be6+ 29. Kxf3 Bd5 30. d3 f5 31. Be5+ Kg6
32. Ke2 fxe4 33. Rxf8 Rxf8 34. dxe4 Re8 35. Bxd4 Rxe4+ 36. Kd3 Rxd4+ 37. Kxd4
a2 0-1

Dozy
06-07-2006, 03:53 PM
what had you intended after 16. ... Kg8I was expecting Kg8. After the obvious Qh5 I imagine you're looking at f5 where there are possibilities with the queen, rook and bishop which should produce a win or, at very worst, a draw.

Pharoah
07-07-2006, 04:04 AM
Thanks :)

(I was thinkin' either Kxh7 or Kh8. I figured there would be a pawn at g7. And hes already on g8, so after Bxh7, it would really be Bxh7+.

Desmond
07-07-2006, 08:56 AM
I was expecting Kg8. After the obvious Qh5 I imagine you're looking at f5 where there are possibilities with the queen, rook and bishop which should produce a win or, at very worst, a draw.
I was actually thinking of f6, when Qg6 at some point won't be hitting the e6 pawn.

So would I be correct to say that your sacrifice was speculative and that you had not calculated to either a forced draw or win?

Dozy
07-07-2006, 11:19 AM
I was actually thinking of f6, when Qg6 at some point won't be hitting the e6 pawn.

So would I be correct to say that your sacrifice was speculative and that you had not calculated to either a forced draw or win?Boris, you must have been reading my mail. ALL my sacrifices are speculative (they don't call me Dozy for nothing ), and my gift for analysis rates alongside qpawn's OTB rating. That's why I don't attempt anything too erudite in my chess stories.

Sometimes I wonder how I win any games at all . . .

Howsomever, since Albino Jumbo raised Moulthun Ly's flag last night I've been searching for info to do another (unerudite) story and came across this game on Gardiner Chess from the training match Moulthun played against Steven Solomon last year. The commentary describes it as a "Greek gift double piece sacrifice". You can read the whole article at http://www.gardinerchess.com/solo-ly-match.htm

This was a win to Solo.


Event: Training Match
Site: ?
Date: 2005.??.??
Round: 1
White: Solomon, Steven
Black: Ly, Moulthun
Result: *
ECO: C05
WhiteElo: 2412
BlackElo: 2117
PlyCount: 53
TimeControl: 1200

{192MB} 1. e4 e6 2. d4 d5 3. Nd2 Nf6 4. e5 Nfd7 5. c3 c5 6. f4 Nc6 7. Ndf3 Qb6
8. a3 a5 9. b3 Be7 10. h4 f6 11. Bd3 cxd4 12. cxd4 O-O 13. Ne2 Qd8 14. Nc3 Nb6
15. Bxh7+ Kxh7 16. Ng5+ fxg5 17. hxg5+ Kg8 18. Qh5 Rf5 19. g4 Nxd4 20. gxf5
exf5 21. g6 Bh4+ 22. Kd1 Be6 23. Rxh4 Kf8 24. a4 Bg8 25. Be3 Nxb3 26. Qxf5+ Ke8
27. Rh8 *