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chesslover
04-03-2004, 10:38 PM
The motor sport season will start this weekend when the Melbourne F1 race starts.

This is the TAB betting odds for the winning Driver for 2004 for a $1 bet;

1 Michael Schumacher $1.90
2 Juan Pablo Montoya $4.50
3 Kimi Raikkonen $4.50
4 Ralf Schumacher $5.50
5 David Coulthard $15.00
6 Rubens Barrichello $15.00
7 Fernando Alonso $26.00
8 Jarno Trulli $67.00
9 Mark Webber $126.00
10 Drivers Not Quoted $34.00

Michael Schumacher is the overwhelming favourite to win the Drivers championship for a record 7th time. I guess given that Michael Schumacher is the greatest F1 driver in the history of the sport, it is no wonder he is such a firm favourite. However such huge favouritism in a wide open field, before the first race is even started is surprising

I like F1, and stay late to watch it. It is the richest and most expensivest sport in the world, and car companies spend a lot of time and effort to win and test their technology

skip to my lou
04-03-2004, 10:56 PM
I heard someone say in toukley: "Watching car racing is like watching grass grow!".

Trent Parker
04-03-2004, 11:02 PM
I know it is sadistic. But I watch racing for the spectacular crashes. But F! is good, i sometimes stay up late to watch F!.

chesslover
04-03-2004, 11:56 PM
I know it is sadistic. But I watch racing for the spectacular crashes. But F! is good, i sometimes stay up late to watch F!.

the last F1 death was the great Senna in 94. F1 is far more safe than it was ever before

And do not forget that F1 is the richest and most expensive sport in the world, and the glamour and prestige is unmatced. This year there will be F1 in bahrain and china, and countries are bidding for the right to host f1 grand prixs

Trent Parker
05-03-2004, 12:02 AM
also senna's death may have been as a result of someone fiddling with his car.

GO MINARDI

GO WEBBER!!

chesslover
05-03-2004, 12:10 AM
GO MINARDI

GO WEBBER!!

HA HA HA !!!

Have you not looked at the odds? Webber is $126 to win the F1 champs, while Schumacher who has won 6 world champs (more than anyone in the history of F1) is the big favourite to win again

However the rumour is that if webber drives as well as he did last year, he may get a chance next year in Williams. It seems Williams will probably kick out Ralf Schumacher or Montoya next year as those 2 are asking for mega million dollar increase in their salary

With a competitive car to drive next year, webber may indeed be a good chance. This year he will be lucky to place in any of the races

Kevin Bonham
05-03-2004, 12:10 AM
I like all of F1, V8 Supercars and Indycars. Not really into bikes or rally much. It's sad that the CART/IRL split in the US has led to CART being a relatively weak series that is only just keeping its head above water, and the IRL being low profile in Aus (and boring since it runs almost exclusively on ovals unlike some of the great tracks they have in CART). Before that happened, Indycar racing was great. I still watch it and enjoy it but I do wish the two series would come back together again as there are too few cars and too many rabbits in the CART fields now.

F1 does suffer from the money aspect causing only a few teams to be competitive; you would see much better racing if all those drivers were in similar cars. I don't like the way they changed the point system to give 8 points for second.

I enjoy the racing in V8 Supercars (apart from the reverse grid rubbish they had a few years back - totally inappropriate for a peak national championship). I do wish they had a better solution to the problem of crashed cars than pace cars at Bathurst - it's no longer the flat-out test of ultimate merit it used to be, it's more like whoever stays out of trouble all day then has the fastest car in the end. I really get into the whole Bathurst thing and have watched every Bathurst 1000 since 1980.

As for those F1 odds, Michael Schumacher is my favourite to win the thing again, barring injury, but the pack is closing . Raikonnen is good money at $4.50 considering that he nearly did it last year with the 2002 car because McLaren never finished their 2003 model, and considering he is still a rising star. Alonso is likely to be a multiple World Champion in the future. It's still too early and Renault's engine this year is an old one but still that $26.00 is worth a bit of thought. Coulthard at $15.00? Naah, forget it, he's way too conservative and he must be only going through the motions for the pay check now. Wouldn't back him for double that in a fit. Wouldn't be all that tempted by that $5.50 for the season for Ralf either, too inconsistent and harebrained. And I'd love to see Barrichello win a pack of races and become World Champion one day because he has such a big heart for the sport, but I don't think it's going to happen. By the way, I'm a Toyota F1 fan. They may not be up to much yet, and I don't expect more than a scatter of points this season either, but the long term project of trying to win the thing from scratch with entirely original designs is something rather novel.

An interesting new rule for this year - if a driver's engine fails in practice he is relegated 10 spots on the grid. Could spice it up a bit.

Should be another exciting season.

arosar
05-03-2004, 08:01 AM
Youse blokes don't know what you're crapping on about. F1, V8, Nascar and any other fixed circuit type racing are all BORING! I mean, what's so fun about watching them cars go around in circles? Rally is best! It also demands more from drivers - not only driving skills but mechanical skills too.

AR

Garvinator
05-03-2004, 09:39 AM
also senna's death may have been as a result of someone fiddling with his car.


yes you are correct tparker, the theory goes like this, Senna left maclaren to join williams, but could not get comfortable in the williams car, so he asked for the steering column to be changed, the allegation goes that Patrick Head and co did dodgy work on this changed steering column, so that when Senna went into Tamburello curve at 180mph, the steering column snapped, sending Senna off the track and into the wall.

Then a piece of said steering column came back and went through his helmet.

Btw i would argue that senna is the greatest f1 driver of all time. His record would have been much better had he been able to retire by his own choice instead of it being a permanent one.

Kevin Bonham
09-03-2004, 12:46 AM
Should be another exciting season.

Or maybe not, after what sounds like it was a very processional race on the weekend. If the Ferraris stay anywhere near that dominant then 2003 may have just been a hiccup for them.

AR - the problem I have with rallies is a certain lack of overtaking. Not that F1 is all that much better. :rolleyes:

Garvinator
09-03-2004, 05:22 AM
Or maybe not, after what sounds like it was a very processional race on the weekend. If the Ferraris stay anywhere near that dominant then 2003 may have just been a hiccup for them.

ferrari was so much faster than everyone else that it did make the race a two car show. Alonso in third claimed he had a boring race cause he was always 30 secs behind schumacher/barrichello and 30 secs in front of montoya/button etc.

Whether this advantage will last is doubtful now that they move to sepang(malaysia) where the temperature will be warmer, so the michelin shod runners will be back in the game. Michelin are notoriously bad in coldish weather, like the conditions in melbourne. Last season michelin were superior in the hot conditions. that should reduce ferraris advantage over the rest of the field.

I did like neil cromptons line during the commentary- once the flag drops, the bs stops :lol: very true for the melbourne race. before the race the talk was that ferrari was to be challenged by maclaren and williams. that was all bs in melbourne.

chesslover
27-03-2004, 06:41 PM
The Roy Morgan poll below shows the personalities of the viewers of F1 and V8 racings

It says that 20% of the Australian population watch F1, and an almost equal 20% watch V8. If found that 30% of men watch F1 and V8 with 11% of females watching F1 and 10% V8.

F1 viewers are generarly well edcuated more smarter and earn more than the V8 viewers

http://www.roymorgan.com/news/polls/2002/3504/

I like F1 more than V8 for V8 is just Holden vs Ford. V8 needs more car manufacterers to take part to make it more exciting

chesslover
27-03-2004, 06:47 PM
I was reading the F1 magazine as I am a F1 buff. I cannot afford the F1 cars but F1 is the ultimate in motosports

It said that F1 racing in 2003 costs a staggering $2.5 billion dollars. :eek: :eek: That is for the 10 teams that particpate in the annual F1 champs

Of that amount $110 million went to the 20 drivers :eek: :eek:

Compare that to say League where there is a $3.5 million salary cap for the ENTIRE team members in a club or NBA (basketball) where there is a $33million cap for the entire team or NFL(US football) wwhere there is a $78million cap for the entire team or Aussie Rules where there is a $6.11 million salary cap for the entire team

F1 is by far the richest sport in the world :eek:

Kevin Bonham
27-03-2004, 06:57 PM
F1 viewers are generarly well edcuated more smarter and earn more than the V8 viewers

http://www.roymorgan.com/news/polls/2002/3504/

Yep, sadly the popular perception that V8 Supercars is a code designed for bogans and disproportionally watched by bogans is supported by pretty much every aspect of the quoted findings. Very interesting research, thanks for posting it.


V8 needs more car manufacterers to take part to make it more exciting

I like the closeness of the racing and the large number of quality teams, these are certainly big differences from the Group Cs of the early-mid 1980s where only a handful of cars were generally competitive. However only having two makes is a bit boring. I liked it when Bathurst had the odd BMW running longer on petrol to try to knock off the big muscle cars. The problem came when they let the 4WD Nissans in and the awesome things won twice in a row, and the poor patriotic Aussie crowds couldn't deal with that.

Garvinator
27-03-2004, 07:41 PM
The problem came when they let the 4WD Nissans in and the awesome things won twice in a row, and the poor patriotic Aussie crowds couldn't deal with that.
and even though i was rather young then, i was a fan of the nissan skyline GTR

chesslover
27-03-2004, 10:56 PM
and even though i was rather young then, i was a fan of the nissan skyline GTR

Watching Jim Richards and Seaton win on a Nissan was fun. The V8 crowd however booed Jim and he abused them when he was on the podium

I did not like it when they just made it Holden and Ford. The more cars the better and people can support the car that they own

F1 may be the pinnacle and ultimate in motosport but V8 is supposed to be more reflective of the cars you see in the streets. It has been severely modified and performace has been tweaked but it is still essentially supposed to be a car that you can buy on Monday from a dealer. All cars sold in Australia are not Holden or Ford and they should let other car manufacterers join in

F1 has 18 races this year the most yet. V8 has 13 including 1 in New Zeland and 1 in CHina.

Garvinator
27-03-2004, 10:59 PM
V8 is supposed to be more reflective of the cars you see in the streets. It has been severely modified and performace has been tweaked but it is still essentially supposed to be a car that you can buy on Monday from a dealer.
the reality is that the V8 cars you see on the track are almost nothing like the ordinary road car.

Kevin Bonham
27-03-2004, 11:04 PM
Watching Jim Richards and Seaton win on a Nissan was fun. The V8 crowd however booed Jim and he abused them when he was on the podium

Justly so, it's true he had just used a crashed Japanese car to beat Dick Johnson who had forgotten the rules and tried to claim the win (in his true blue Aussie Sierra, ho ho), but that's no excuse for that sort of bad sportsmanship. Which, I might add, continues in Supercars to this day, particularly among the Holden fans (or maybe they're just louder because there's more of them.)

It was Skaife not Seton who Richards won with in 1991-2. Glenn Seton has never won Bathurst though did manage to come second with Craig Lowndes last year.

PHAT
28-03-2004, 10:28 AM
F1 viewers are generarly well edcuated more smarter and earn more than the V8 viewers

http://www.roymorgan.com/news/polls/2002/3504/


... but the grammar of F1 watchers is more badder. :owned:

I'ld be very careful CL. I would bet a lot of money that the proportion of drug-taking rapist thugs in the ranks of League fans is higher than in all the other footy games.

arosar
29-03-2004, 04:50 PM
I really don't like V8 racing. It's prolly the stupidest of all motor-racing. I mean, the only difference it seems to me, apart from the Ford and Holden bit, is the bloody paint job.

AR

chesslover
30-03-2004, 11:23 PM
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/03/29/1080544427011.html

the first ever F1 race in bahrain is happening this weekend

history

Schu should make it 3 in a row. Ferrari has the best driver. Ferraris has the best car. Ferrari has the best technicans. Ferrari has the best that money can buy. How can Ferrari be stopped???

Schu already has won 6 world champs. This is one ahead of the next best by Fangio. How would Schu have compared to Senna??? Senna won 3 and would have won 4 if he did not die. At that time Schu had yet to win 1 world champ.

We will never know but if Senna was alive I think he could have had 10 world champs by now

Garvinator
31-03-2004, 12:03 AM
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/03/29/1080544427011.html

We will never know but if Senna was alive I think he could have had 10 world champs by now
its tough to say that as you dont know how technology of the cars would have influenced results of the individuals drivers. But in my opinion, senna was the best driver ever in formula one.

Interesting to note that David coulthard had his career enhanced due to the death of Senna as David was given the second seat for williams in the next race after imola.

chesslover
31-03-2004, 12:21 AM
its tough to say that as you dont know how technology of the cars would have influenced results of the individuals drivers. But in my opinion, senna was the best driver ever in formula one.

Interesting to note that David coulthard had his career enhanced due to the death of Senna as David was given the second seat for williams in the next race after imola.

do you subscribe to the "Senna was Murdered" theory??

I think it was an accident. Senna took a lot of risks which was why he was the most talented driver till Schu came along.

A race with Schu and Senna would have been so brilliant and awesome to watch

Garvinator
31-03-2004, 12:27 AM
do you subscribe to the "Senna was Murdered" theory??

i suscribed to the negligent action theory regarding the suspension arm of the williams for about 9 years and 10 months. Recently though I watched a detailed program on pay tv which said that the steering column in the williams didnt break and senna had control of the steering wheel at all times when he was still on the track.

According to the program, due to the safety car on the track since the start of that race, senna's tyres were not up to the required pressure, lowering the height of the car. When senna entered tamburello curve at 190 mph, the williams ride height was reduced and the car bottomed out. this cause the downforce to be reduced to zero and the williams lost grip and could not make the corner.

Senna then applied the brake at 100% and the car slowed a small amount, but the car could not be stopped and hit the wall. what actually killed senna was the right front wheel rebounding back and hitting his helmet front on.

Bill Gletsos
31-03-2004, 12:41 AM
i suscribed to the negligent action theory regarding the suspension arm of the williams for about 9 years and 10 months. Recently though I watched a detailed program on pay tv which said that the steering column in the williams didnt break and senna had control of the steering wheel at all times when he was still on the track.

According to the program, due to the safety car on the track since the start of that race, senna's tyres were not up to the required pressure, lowering the height of the car. When senna entered tamburello curve at 190 mph, the williams ride height was reduced and the car bottomed out. this cause the downforce to be reduced to zero and the williams lost grip and could not make the corner.

Senna then applied the brake at 100% and the car slowed a small amount, but the car could not be stopped and hit the wall. what actually killed senna was the right front wheel rebounding back and hitting his helmet front on.
I watched that same show. It was very interesting.

Kevin Bonham
31-03-2004, 02:57 AM
I think it was an accident.

So do I. I always have.


Senna took a lot of risks which was why he was the most talented driver till Schu came along.

If you look at stats for Senna it's quite interesting. His finishing rate was not outstanding (unlike Schumacher who is up there with Fangio) but he had an incredibly high proportion of poles and an incredibly low proportion of fastest laps in the race. More than three times as many poles as fastest laps. That, I think, tells you something about the guy's ability to be fast when he needed to but drive within himself as the race situation demanded it.

Senna did not win as high a proportion of races as Schumacher, who is quite incredible in that regard. But Senna had a better calibre of opponent - he had to beat people like Piquet, Prost and Mansell. I do not think Schumacher's opponents - guys like Hakkinen, Hill, Coulthard, Jacques Villeneuve, Montoya, have really been quite in that sort of league. Hakkinen perhaps, but not the rest. They are not first-order "greats".

It has to be subjective in the end as to which of Senna and Schumacher you think is the best - their records are so different and yet both so compelling. I am not sure what more Schumacher has to do to prove himself in this regard objectively.


A race with Schu and Senna would have been so brilliant and awesome to watch

There were a few. Schumacher started partway through the year before Senna died but wasn't winning races right away. He was leading the World Championship a few races into '94; I think Senna had been eliminated from a couple of races which Schumacher had won. What's a real shame is that we didn't get to see them going head-to-head for the world title over a season, or even for one full race.

Kevin Bonham
08-05-2004, 01:08 AM
As for those F1 odds, Michael Schumacher is my favourite to win the thing again, barring injury, but the pack is closing .

Latter comment is not looking sexy at all.


Raikonnen is good money at $4.50

Nor this one. :wall: :wall: :wall: This year's McLaren is a dog.


Coulthard at $15.00? Naah, forget it, he's way too conservative and he must be only going through the motions for the pay check now. Wouldn't back him for double that in a fit. Wouldn't be all that tempted by that $5.50 for the season for Ralf either, too inconsistent and harebrained.

Least I got some things right. Ralf is a joke, his performance this year has been pathetic. Pay-for-drive for Minardi next year is about what he deserves. :whistle: Even Toyota are getting cold feet about hiring him for '05.

Anyway, I just thought I'd revive this thread to mention Tas getting our round of the Supercars back to Symmons Plains later this year (China fell through alas), apparently with a 5-year deal and a big $ revamp. Not the most incredible track in the world but not bad, I'll be amused to watch 32 big V8s trying to get through the first hairpin unmolested. Might be time that they widened the track just a tad. If I'm still here, I'll probably go up and see it.

Garvinator
08-05-2004, 01:24 AM
Might be time that they widened the track just a tad. If I'm still here, I'll probably go up and see it.
I would suggest that they improve access to the track and general facilities first :whistle:

Kevin Bonham
08-05-2004, 01:56 AM
Not wrong there. The track is conveniently located besides a main road, that's the good news. The bad news is the main road is the busy highway between Hobart and Launceston. I can remember this being an issue in times past. As for spectator facilities, I can't remember noticing any last time I was there.

There was some speculation that Baskerville near Hobart might get the round but I'm not surprised that didn't last long. Baskerville is a wonderful track for watching - it's cut into a hillside and there are several places where you can get great views of the cars and large sections where you can see virtually the entire circuit. But it's too small and pokey for lots of big cars and the safety just isn't remotely good enough for stuff this fast. Last time I was there (which was several years ago) two cars jumped the fence in seperate incidents.

chesslover
10-05-2004, 07:13 PM
Schu wins 5 in a row :clap: :clap:

6 times world champion - a record that has never been achieved ever in F1 :clap: :clap: :clap:

And he equals the 5 wins in a row record of mansell. In Monoco, Schu will be going for an unprecedented 6 wins in a trot

It is a shame that watcging the greatest F1 driver ever, instead of provoking admiration, now leads to boredom. The FIA wants to change the rules to make it more competitive, but since Schu as the greatest driver ever, he will still win under those rules

Kevin Bonham
10-05-2004, 07:39 PM
And I think he will retire before 2008 anyway. By the way, I think 6 in a row has been done, but not in the one season.

The gap between MS and the rest this season is astonishing. Considering driver and car together, none of them are in the same division.

Bill Gletsos
10-05-2004, 07:44 PM
Schu wins 5 in a row :clap: :clap:

6 times world champion - a record that has never been achieved ever in F1 :clap: :clap: :clap:

And he equals the 5 wins in a row record of mansell. In Monoco, Schu will be going for an unprecedented 6 wins in a trot

It is a shame that watcging the greatest F1 driver ever, instead of provoking admiration, now leads to boredom. The FIA wants to change the rules to make it more competitive, but since Schu as the greatest driver ever, he will still win under those rules
Is he the greatest driver ever?
Maybe its more a case that his car is superior to the others.

In chess terms perhaps it the case of a 2600 player constantly winning tournaments where everyone else is 2500, whereas in the past the winner may have been 2750 beating all 2700's.

Garvinator
10-05-2004, 08:00 PM
Is he the greatest driver ever?
Maybe its more a case that his car is superior to the others.

In chess terms perhaps it the case of a 2600 player constantly winning tournaments where everyone else is 2500, whereas in the past the winner may have been 2750 beating all 2700's.

i dont think schumacher is the greatest driver ever, i believe that senna owns that title. I have no problem with schumacher winning alot though. He left benetton to get ferrari back to being the best. He has been one of the leaders in alot of the advances of ferrari. All the best to him.

Kevin Bonham
10-05-2004, 09:05 PM
Is he the greatest driver ever?
Maybe its more a case that his car is superior to the others.

In chess terms perhaps it the case of a 2600 player constantly winning tournaments where everyone else is 2500, whereas in the past the winner may have been 2750 beating all 2700's.

As I think I mentioned much further up the thread, he hasn't had quite the kind of competition that a driver did in the 80s when Senna, Prost, Mansell, Lauda and Piquet were all racing. I've also seen it said that top-level car racing is 80% car and 20% driver while bike racing is the other way around.

He does have a history of very good performance even when the car is not that great though. He won two world championships for Bennetton, who were otherwise a second-tier team good for the odd race win but not at all a title threat. And when he transferred to Ferrari, he was soon competitive in a car that had been pretty ordinary the year before that. My guess though is that Senna (who was ridiculously fast in some really bad cars) would have done much the same thing.

Bill Gletsos
10-05-2004, 09:09 PM
Actually I was thinking back to the days of Juan Manuel Fangio .

Garvinator
10-05-2004, 09:47 PM
Actually I was thinking back to the days of Juan Manuel Fangio .
fangio reputation was that even though he was a very good driver, as soon as a new team and car came along, he changed teams straight away, ensuring he was always in the best car. I dont recall him competiting in any type of uncompetitive car.

Rincewind
10-05-2004, 10:13 PM
fangio reputation was that even though he was a very good driver, as soon as a new team and car came along, he changed teams straight away, ensuring he was always in the best car. I dont recall him competiting in any type of uncompetitive car.

Is anyone going to get parochial and suggest, Sir Jack?

Garvinator
11-05-2004, 10:57 AM
Is anyone going to get parochial and suggest, Sir Jack?
no :p

JGB
12-05-2004, 12:01 AM
How can people really say who the better drivers are? That Senna is better that Schumi? Thats pretty difficult to prove. According to all the data and stats they come out with here in Germany, MS is the best driver of all time. I have my 'fav', and that's Prost, but Schumi makes it look easier than any other driver in history. He did learn all his skills from the champs of the 80's and early 90's.

All that I do know is that F1 is much more boring now than it was in the 80's and 90's.

Kevin Bonham
09-10-2004, 01:34 AM
Anyone want to make any predictions for Bathurst on Sunday?

The heart says it would be nice to see Ford finally win another one after five Holden wins in a row. The head says the dice have no memory, the Holdens have had the edge in practice and Greg Murphy's chances of a repeat of last year's crushing win look excellent.

(And no, I don't think the Parramatta Spammer is going to win #10. Indeed, I don't understand why he is still going.)

Garvinator
09-10-2004, 05:17 AM
Anyone want to make any predictions for Bathurst on Sunday?

The heart says it would be nice to see Ford finally win another one after five Holden wins in a row. The head says the dice have no memory, the Holdens have had the edge in practice and Greg Murphy's chances of a repeat of last year's crushing win look excellent.

(And no, I don't think the Parramatta Spammer is going to win #10. Indeed, I don't understand why he is still going.)
i think it will be another smash it up derby with the cars trundling around behind the safety car alot. Btw, Greg Murphy's win wasnt crushing. Skaife could have won until he was forced to come in to seal up his rear door to stop it flapping. I would just like to see skaife get a full race without someone else running into him.

Kevin Bonham
09-10-2004, 11:06 PM
i think it will be another smash it up derby with the cars trundling around behind the safety car alot.

I'm hoping the smaller field (34 cars) will cut the number of SC excursions to, say, six, but it is a pious hope. There's always some idiot who feels obliged to park his car in the sand half a dozen times in the race, presumably for the sponsorship exposure.


Btw, Greg Murphy's win wasnt crushing.

I've had to reshape the concept of a crushing win for the safety car age in making that comment. I remember from about half way through thinking Murphy had it in the bag if he kept going around, when usually these days it's not at all clear til the last 20 laps.


Skaife could have won until he was forced to come in to seal up his rear door to stop it flapping.

I remember that but at the time I did not think he would have held off Murphy anyway.


I would just like to see skaife get a full race without someone else running into him.

Or his car blowing up. He's had such a dog of a year like that this year that it is hard to tell what his equipment is capable of. Grid position 18 however is not good. And the other HRT car qualified even worse. :rolleyes:

Garvinator
09-10-2004, 11:09 PM
in my travels to the qld schools team championships today i saw a report saying that the holden ford domination of v8 supercars is about to end. It is likely that the supercars will be opened up to more manufacturers.

Kevin Bonham
09-10-2004, 11:13 PM
That's been in the woodwork for a few years and hasn't happened quite as fast as it was supposed to.

Kevin Bonham
10-10-2004, 09:05 PM
Pretty interesting race. Again around half-way it was clear to me that Murphy had the car to beat. All the other leading Holdens had self-destructed and he was stretching his lead. Then he had a bit of bad luck (or perhaps inflexible strategy) with the safety car locking him into two pitstops while the others only needed one, so then there was that situation where he was stuck behind four Fords for a little while. I suspect that given his car speed and the fact that he had a shorter pit stop left to make he would have nailed them anyway, but the final safety car made it easier for him. Maybe Ambrose could have matched him without that tyre problem.

Some of the driving in the first two hours or so was pretty silly and a few times I thought "uh-oh, enormous pile-up coming up".

ursogr8
10-10-2004, 09:15 PM
Pretty interesting race.


Is it the fact that it is a race that makes it a motor sport? (See thread title).
Event I could believe. Entertainment I could believe. But driving your car on a Sunday arvo. is hardly a sport.
starter

Kevin Bonham
10-10-2004, 10:36 PM
Is it the fact that it is a race that makes it a motor sport? (See thread title).

I can think of some non-competitive forms of driving that are sometimes passed off as "sport", eg four-wheel-driving. However 4WDing is also sometimes passed off as a traditional land use, so all such claims should be treated with some caution.


But driving your car on a Sunday arvo. is hardly a sport.

Do you drive your car at 290 km/h on Sunday arvo?

I think it's in our interests as chess players to prefer as inclusive a definition of "sport" as reasonably possible.

Garvinator
10-10-2004, 10:40 PM
Do you drive your car at 290 km/h on Sunday arvo? what if i answer yes to this question? :lol: :lol:

Kevin Bonham
10-10-2004, 11:16 PM
what if i answer yes to this question? :lol: :lol:

Then you are a bogan, and we have ways of dealing with your sort.

Bill Gletsos
10-10-2004, 11:32 PM
Do you drive your car at 290 km/h on Sunday arvo?
I suspect his car cannot do 290km/h.

Kevin Bonham
11-10-2004, 12:08 AM
I suspect his car cannot do 290km/h.

I suspect yours could at least get close.

skip to my lou
11-10-2004, 12:15 AM
What car is that?

Bill Gletsos
11-10-2004, 12:28 AM
I suspect yours could at least get close.
No mines speed limited to 250.

Bill Gletsos
11-10-2004, 12:35 AM
What car is that?
Current model XJ Superv8 Jaguar with supercharged 4.2 litre 298kw 553nm engine.

Kaitlin
11-10-2004, 06:02 AM
One time I went wif my friend and her dad to Sydney and he took us to Parramatta Speedway place. That was good fun cause you get to see them all the time cause they just go round and round in a little circle. But car racing on tv should be baned it is sooooooo boring :( so im going to click 'I do not like motor sports' :)

arosar
11-10-2004, 09:39 AM
. . . car racing on tv should be baned it is sooooooo boring :(

Rally racing is certainly not boring. It's also perhaps the most demanding form of motor racing.

AR

Kaitlin
11-10-2004, 01:17 PM
:snooty: All car racing including the demanding :crosseye: sport of Rally racing is past its used by date... cars are not going to get any better by people trying to make them go faster.... :ponder: unless they make it the first one to get there car to the moon and back wins :).

Garvinator
11-10-2004, 01:29 PM
:snooty: All car racing including the demanding :crosseye: sport of Rally racing is past its used by date... cars are not going to get any better by people trying to make them go faster.... :ponder: unless they make it the first one to get there car to the moon and back wins :).
motor racing does also provide an important avenue for safety in the ordinary road car.

Kaitlin
12-10-2004, 08:52 AM
........ faster :uhoh: safety
...... faster :uhoh: safety
... faster :uhoh: safety
faster :uhoh: safety
wait..
slow down = safer :)

Garvinator
12-10-2004, 11:33 AM
........ faster :uhoh: safety
...... faster :uhoh: safety
... faster :uhoh: safety
faster :uhoh: safety
wait..
slow down = safer :)
i was more thinking of stuff like better designed cars, better frame design, better tyres etc.

skip to my lou
12-10-2004, 11:38 AM
Actually, how fast or slow you go has little to do with safety.

arosar
12-10-2004, 11:50 AM
There's no point talkin' to a sheila about this kinda stuff. It's like talking to a brick wall in latin.

AR

JGB
12-10-2004, 03:29 PM
A few year back I was also more into motor sports and somehow I also believe that in general it has become more boring over the last decade. New technology has not made racing any more spectacular for me. Why is that? Maybe its just me but I know that F1's lack of competitivness is the main reason for my lack of enthusiasim there.

Spiny Norman
12-10-2004, 06:57 PM
A few year back I was also more into motor sports and somehow I also believe that in general it has become more boring over the last decade. New technology has not made racing any more spectacular for me. Why is that? Maybe its just me but I know that F1's lack of competitivness is the main reason for my lack of enthusiasim there.

I can't bear F1 either. I end up snoozing. Much prefer the V8s for the closeness of the racing.

Kevin Bonham
04-12-2010, 09:51 PM
*bump*

Not F1 so I will resurrect this ancient thread, which is so old that when it was last in circulation I correctly tipped the Bathurst winner!

It was interesting to see one of the more obscure rules of motorsport - a rule I was well aware of - play a major role in the V8 Smashemcars Supercars Championship today. This rule is the "slow last lap" rule, which requires that when a race finishes, everyone who is classified as a finisher must have recorded a final lap that isn't ridiculously slow. The purpose of the rule is to stop idiots from limping obviously dead cars around the track at 20 km/h at the business end of the race (or leaving them sitting at the final corner as used to happen at Bathurst in the good old days).

The rule came into play today in Sydney because all the race leaders, including the title contenders, decided to stay out on cooled slick tyres at a time when it was raining heavily. They were all afraid that if they pitted and it wasn't so bad they would lose a stack of track position to their rivals. The upshot of this collective insanity was that all the leaders including all three championship contenders crashed, eliminating almost half the field.

As the mayhem was close to the end of the race, there was then a race between the various pit crews to bash their crashed cars back into some kind of (vaguely) raceable shape before the race finished. Championship leader Courtney's crew won the pit-crew race in time for him to complete two laps at the end and he was classified as a finisher in 15th place a number of laps down. Defending champion Whincup, however, was only able to drive from his pit bay and around the track once before the race was completed.

The problem with this was that Whincup's lap had formally started on the way into his pit and so the "last lap" he did failed, by some very short distance, to count as a full lap. His final lap formally included the 20 minutes he spent in the pits trying to have the heap of junk he dragged in there reconfigured to resemble a car, and hence he was too slow.

As there are no points awarded for not finishing, this meant zero points instead of 57 for Whincup (150 for win) meaning that Courtney only needs to finish 22nd tomorrow to win the title.

One of the oddest finishes I have seen.

antichrist
05-12-2010, 07:40 AM
actually they could employ you to do their stats - how many points are needed etc

and you may meet my cous who is now with Lotus team (if you want any free tickets if you are nice to me)

Kevin Bonham
12-06-2013, 11:47 PM
*bump again*

Don't suppose AC's cousin is with the current Lotus and could scam me an original Raikonnen "Leave me alone I know what I'm doing" t-shirt? ;)

Anyway thought I'd post up the finish to one of the support races for the recent Indy 500.

And the obligatory warning that the commentary is in American and includes such expressions as "Ohhh baby!"

Wp1klmtsWQA

antichrist
04-07-2013, 09:12 PM
Did it ever occur to anyone that motor racing could be viewed as highly immoral in today's problem of air pollution and climate change.

The figures came out today, the past ten years the earth have had the highest temperatures since records began.

Surely motor racing just for the sake is dinosaur thinking