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Kerry Corker
17-04-2021, 06:50 PM
How much for former World Champion GM Kasparov? He’s hot again. He’s the technical advisor for “The Queen’s Gambit” so he must be worth heaps.
At auction, what would an Indian Multi National Company pay for the services of former World Champion GM Anand on Board One?
What about the Aussie GMs who won’t make it into our next Olympiad team?
How much would an Australian Multi-National pay for a GM on Board One?
How much would a Multi-National company pay for a good manager?
How much would a Multi-National company pay for a good trainer?
Alas, there are only about 80,000 Multi-National Companies in the world.
If they get .1% we are in business. Naturally, we play the traditional Olympiad alongside.
And yes, they will give us a free venue to play in Vegas. But we have to bring the Corporates.
I think they do something like this in cricket. Don’t know if it has caught on.
Stay tuned.

Kerry Corker
18-04-2021, 12:05 PM
I have been speaking to the Marketing Director at FIDE, and apparently, they have already held a Corporate Olympiad via the net.
He told me the next one is going to OTB, held at the same time and place as the traditional Olympiad.
Handled correctly, this could change the world’s perception of chess through the eyes of the media and the public. This is bigger than the invention of chess clocks.
This is really big. How big?
This is a direct connection, a synergy between two parties hitherto completely and utterly disconnected. Apart from the usual begging bowl scenario,
“Please sir, will you sponsor our weekender”, chess and business/media have had no reason to come together.

You have chosen the Green Door.

Behind this door is the last round of the Corporate Olympiad. Table One is Coca Cola v Pepsi.
On Board one for Pepsi is the Australian GM who missed out on selection for his National team.
He is the last-minute replacement for the former World Champion who was mysteriously hit on the head by what was described as a curbed, circling, broken stick.
The Australian GM apparently settled for $100,000 for the 3 day’s work. Boy, does he need a new manager!
The last game of the last round. It all comes down to this. Which is better? Pepsi or Coca Cola.
Meanwhile in the traditional Olympiad, in the last round, on table one, Australia battles USA for gold. It doesn’t get any better than this.

You have chosen the other door. Doesn’t matter what colour it is because you have monochromasy.

Behind this door you are packing up after the latest of what seems an endless series of weekenders. You have won your $35.50 as a share of a rating prize, thus validating your decision to drop out of law and a partnership in daddy’s firm by age 30. You are glad that Bob Menzies is still Prime Minister. You are also glad that chess is still booming in Australia because in a catchment area of 3 million people this event had 106 players. Can it get any better?

Which door did you choose? Stupid question. Sadly, we all know the answer to that.

I urge you all to contact FIDE and ask about progress on the Corporate/Traditional Olympiad.
They did not give me a definite date.
And I can understand this with Covid still on the rise. Give ‘em a nudge anyway.

Desmond
18-04-2021, 12:15 PM
I have been speaking to the Marketing Director at FIDE, and apparently, they have already held a Corporate Olympiad via the net. Yes we had a thread on it here (http://www.chesschat.org/showthread.php?18342-2021-FIDE-World-Corporate-Championship). Carlsen, Nepo etc played.



On Board one for Pepsi is the Australian GM who missed out on selection for his National team.
The Australian GM apparently settled for $100,000 for the 3 day’s work. Boy, does he need a new manager!
Pretty sure no-one good would play in the actual Olympiad, if that were the case.

Kerry Corker
18-04-2021, 05:41 PM
Thanks for that. I'll do some research on it. I do think that being chosen to play for your country is in itself a big payday.
However, having the choice between the two is probably what every other big team sport in the world offers.
All these euro players moving to St Louis are exercising their right to choose. And good on them for earning a living playing chess.
How much do the big time soccer players earn per day, even when they are not playing?
Chess has more people playing organised/rated games than soccer will ever have because we can also play on the net.
What's the difference? Millions and millions of dollars and ----- Teams.

Just found the thread by IA/WIM Chibnall on this year's online Corporate event. Looks like it made a very good impression.
Imagine playing it live alongside the traditional Olympiad in a magnificent venue in a Western city. Perhaps a uni campus offpeak.
Money for a venue would not be a problem for some corporations. All business related expenses. Networking, synergies and all that.
They only have to play for a few days and make sure they keep their receipts!

Kerry Corker
19-04-2021, 11:32 AM
Email to FIDE

Tour Groups
I’m trying to sell the idea of a tour group from Australia to the next combined Corporate and traditional Olympiad.
Will FIDE be working with a world-wide travel group to arrange tours or will that be left to the individual Chess Associations.
This part could be out-sourced. Some global travel companies would have the capacity and expertise to run certain aspects of this event themselves, if it is big enough and worth their time - simply outsourcing the chess technical aspects and doing the travel group arranging themselves. 9.4 million tourists visited Australia in 2019.
How many chess tourists world-wide would travel to a nice chess destination every two years? I’m in! They could be interested.
Leaving it to the National Associations will be a good way for them to raise income for both themselves and the teams being sent. Get a great bulk deal on flights and accommodation and add a bit for National Association expenses and Team expenses. Once this event becomes more of a convention and less of a survival trek, National Teams will attract business money by themselves.

We have six Winning Grandmasters in Australia and Business likes a Winner.

Convention name – Working title
Any ideas on a brand name? Comic-Con works like a charm for the comic collectors. Of course, it has been helped by product placement on The Big Bang Theory. I am guessing Vegas pays them to bring their convention to town. The media loves Comic-Con because it doesn’t take long to say!
You will need an add break for, “The Traditional and Corporate Teams Chess Olympiad”.
Snooze, flick channel.
Run a competition for the best name. At the moment the best I can come up with is “Chess-Corp”. There has to be something better! And I think Chess-Corp is already taken.
The world doesn’t have time for, take a big breath,
“The Traditional and Corporate Teams Chess Olympiad”. And nor does big media.

Number of teams in the Traditional event
As this is going to be bigger than Ben-Hur, why limit countries to one open and one female team?
If it is going to be in a tourist friendly city, why not charge a premium for a second team in each? At the moment some players don’t even apply for selection. They just could not be bothered with the up to 48 hours travel time each way. If it is in a mainstream, tourist friendly venue, many more people will apply for selection. Their family and friends will follow. Think of the “Barmy Army” in cricket. Four teams from Australia means exponential growth in the number of people/family/friends in the tour group. Why not run a Junior Olympiad at the same time and place? And that means more “bums on seats”.
National Associations may even plan their calendars on a two-year cycle with 4 National Teams and several Corporate Teams travelling ever second year. The national management, coaching, training, financing of these teams, and getting them to peak for Chess-Corp will create a profitable, mini economy of its own.
Compare this to running endless weekenders! CHESS IS A TEAM’S SPORT.
When cities are tendering for “Chess-Corp”, first question will always be,
“How many visitor/nights we looking at?”
The travel business is all about “bums on seats”, and word of mouth.

Auctioning former World Champions, GMs and IMs for the Corporate Teams section.
Following the very successful formula of IPL, I suggest FIDE runs a world-wide online auction about two months before the event. This gives big media time to digest, process and propagate the concept. Of course, FIDE will have been selling the concept in the proceeding four years as well.

Merchandising
Will FIDE be handling t-shirts, coffee mugs, special chess sets, clocks, hats etc. or will that be left to the National Associations? Why not collect a specially made chess item from each Chess-Corp.? If it is FIDE, please don’t get it produced by the cheapest country you can find. There is nothing worse than the smell of a souvenir teddy-bear that is stuffed with used bandages. License only good quality, fair priced and ethically sourced souvenirs. DO NOT GO FOR THE CHEAPEST PRICE.
People gladly pay a bit extra for quality. This is a world-wide tourism event. Tourism is sold word of mouth. Quality sells. Cheap - smells.
Boycotts of unethical or shoddy merchandising have worked very well in other arenas.

Chess-Corp side events
Will FIDE be running theatre style commentary sessions on a big screen on the top games?
Will the commentators also be available for private one on one or group coaching? Will chess software companies be on site? What about playing portals – will they be there touting for business?

WHEN?
I suggest first we nail down a year. 2026 at the earliest. This needs to be a water-birth, Start with a big splash! No good planning it for 2024. Too little, too soon. Have some small trial runs in team’s chess friendly countries. I’d like to suggest Australia but we’re still in weekender mode, and likely to stay there until the end of the 20th century. 2026 gives the world time to fix Covid19 and for the travel industry to get back to full capacity. It gives National Associations time to forge partnerships with businesses and introduce Corporate Teams to their State or National Teams Competitions.
Next is the venue. The venue will be heavily contingent upon number of teams and number of visitor/nights. This also gives people plenty of time to save for the trip.

Why not spend 2 weeks every second year in a beautiful city watching the best chess on earth.
Why not Mt Olympus? What better place to start an Olympiad!
Do they do conventions? What’s the mini-bar like?


Chess-Corp. SLOGAN for Anglo-Scot-Carnivores?

Have a STEAM, and meet MASTE of your MATES at the TEAMS, for MEATS, Mate.
(Yeah, you’re right, probably only works in English)



Cheers, Kerry Corker 19/04/21

MichaelBaron
19-04-2021, 01:02 PM
[overquoting snipped - mod]

To be frank, looks more like a piece of creative writing rather than a proposal to Fide

Kerry Corker
19-04-2021, 07:22 PM
No good sending them the same old same old. That is simply not working. One question says it all.
What is the remuneration package for the CEO of Australian Chess? Have a wild guess. Clue - Between $0 and a million dollars per year.
Now go to other team's sports like netball, soccer, aussie-rules etc. etc. etc.
Why is chess different? Something has to change. Thanks for your input.

Afitz
20-04-2021, 11:40 AM
No good sending them the same old same old. That is simply not working. One question says it all.
What is the remuneration package for the CEO of Australian Chess? Have a wild guess. Clue - Between $0 and a million dollars per year.
Now go to other team's sports like netball, soccer, aussie-rules etc. etc. etc.
Why is chess different? Something has to change. Thanks for your input.

Until there is corporate sponsorship of a significant amount or the Australian Sports Commission start tipping money into chess, where exactly does the $$$ come from to have a CEO for Australian Chess? I'm all for it, but without initial seeding money to entice someone to take on a paid full-time role, I just can't see it happening.

Afitz
20-04-2021, 11:42 AM
Thanks for that. I'll do some research on it. I do think that being chosen to play for your country is in itself a big payday.


I don't believe the players get anything at all and end up having to actually pay at least a portion of their trip. Thus being selected to play for your country entails nothing more than that honour, nothing financial.

Kerry Corker
20-04-2021, 04:49 PM
We won't get corporate sponsorship until we form business partnerships. We won't be able to form business partnerships until we demonstrate we can run like a business, not a charity. Scratch that. I don't understand our business model at all. If we ran like a charity, we would have a CEO on 500k.

I used to run Graceville Junior Club in Brisbane at night. When we would finish and go to our cars, we were in a sea of junior netballers. Honestly, it was like a small town of small people in uniform. 180 at least. I asked one of the mum's what sort of comp. it was and she answered, "Its only training". And that was just one section of Brisbane. Why is Netball bigger than chess? We both have a fantastic product to sell. Clue - the money goes one way. The money goes up the tree to the administrators who create business partnerships and EVERYONE prospers. Probably 20 years ago they went past the stage of, "please give us a handout, we don't have any money."

Picture a netballer asking a comp. organiser, "How much are the ratings prizes?" Crazy, right? That is just one of the most bizarre scenarios you will ever think of at a sporting event in Australia. Most of them are there to be part of a well organised social group. Some are there to kick butt all the way to the world championships.
None are there to get cash for not being very good.

And yet with chess, everyone tells me we have no money. You want money, I'll give you money! I'm going to give you 20k, cash in the claw.
With that 20k I suggest you pay 4 of our admin. people $5k per year and sit back and watch the difference. All of a sudden we are not a basket case. All of a sudden we have a business plan that has the main objective of paying those 4 people $6k next year. Why all the focus on them? Because they are the engine of the whole set up.
Try driving a Bentley without an engine. And I do consider our administrators top of the range. We just don't pay them.

I know, you want to know where I got the 20k from.
It is all legal. No balaklava or duct tape. No car chase.
And yet. And yet. You are going to think I am the biggest Judas since, I dunno, Judas I suppose. Interesting side step here. Everyone knew who Jesus was including the feds.
Judas was just an afterthought. And we are back. Here goes.
We redirect the 20k per year we PAY in rating prizes, yes we do PAY some people .
We take the 20k per year we waste on paying people to keep their ratings at 1199 or 1499 or 1799 or 1999 and use it properly.

I go back to the Netballer asking the admin. person how much are the ratings prizes. Once again, totally mad mad and never going to happen.
And then I go back to the chess player asking the same question of the chess admin. person, and all of a sudden the answer is $200. Please, someone tell me why?

When we go cap in hand, with begging bowl balanced on our head, in our old clothes, fingers crossed, to the government or business and ask for "sponsorship", we have to answer why we throw away that $200 which becomes 20k per year. 30 weekenders per year, $600 rating prizes per event. And then there are the sectional events such as Doeberl and GC Open I think. How much are you rewarded for being eligible for the BOTTOM SECTION?

Bottom line -
We have 20k per year to pay people who are not very good at chess. I include myself here so put the rocks down.
We have $0 to pay the best players in the land to travel sometimes for 48 hours to represent our nation. Sometimes they pay so they can represent us? What is going on?

And the kicker is - We have SO LITTLE INTEREST in our best of the best, we couldn't even be bothered giving the teams a name.
"Go the Matildas anyone?" "Go the Wallabies anyone." With chess it is "Go the, aaah, whatever"
Collecting those rating prizes all over the country is not just an exercise in financial mismanagement, it is a way of showing how much indeed we think of our best players.

In answer to your next statement, which is, "We will lose a lot of players who like getting rating prizes."
I say good riddance. Should have traded them to the .....I honestly cannot think of any group who would want them.
And then you say, but we don't have any other customers to take their place.
Yes, we do.

Every single year we ditch, drop, trade, get rid of, whatever you want to call it, 95% of our new clients as they leave year 12.
Some of them have been playing school teams chess for 13 years. Don't forget, chess is a teams sport, regardless of how many weekenders we run and run and run.
We probably hand them an entry form to a weekender on the last night of high school chess.
When they turn up, they don't find team spirit, they don't find their mates, they don't find potential partners, they find a bunch of individuals playing chess.
A bit like going from snowboarding to the Marathon. Stay, have a go anyway. Yeah, nuh.
Get them back, drop the people who are there for the ratings prizes.
Sorry for the rant and I am not having a go at you, but this is corner store business principles, so simple and so basic.
And yet 99% of players will back rating prizes over paying admin people or our national team every single time. They always start with "Yeah, but".

You want another 20k? You've got me on a good day.
McDonald's make money charging for hamburgers. That is one of the main things they do. And they charge a price that keeps everyone in business.
Instead of McDonald's = ACF. Instead of hamburgers = charge for processing ratings.

I could be out on a limb here because I could not find on the net how the ACF makes their money. If they are already charging for ratings, I am wrong on that point.
How much are they charging? Weekenders tend to be good money making ventures nowadays. No ACF ratings, no ratings prizes. You can pick up the rocks again, I'm gone!

Desmond
20-04-2021, 11:36 PM
Picture a netballer asking a comp. organiser, "How much are the ratings prizes?" Crazy, right? That is just one of the most bizarre scenarios you will ever think of at a sporting event in Australia. Most of them are there to be part of a well organised social group. Some are there to kick butt all the way to the world championships.
None are there to get cash for not being very good. Completely agree with this. I have never understood why cash prizes ($100+) are given to juniors or other low rated players. Sure give them a book, a trophy, or even a chess lesson. Never big cash prizes. Seems to be a cultural thing, probably harms more than it helps.


I could be out on a limb here because I could not find on the net how the ACF makes their money. If they are already charging for ratings, I am wrong on that point.
How much are they charging? Weekenders tend to be good money making ventures nowadays. No ACF ratings, no ratings prizes. You can pick up the rocks again, I'm gone!
As I understand it, yes the ACF do charge for rating games and it is the main source of revenue.

Kerry Corker
21-04-2021, 08:31 AM
Thanks for that. That makes two people in Australian Chess who see rating prizes as being foolish.
The businesses who run Primary and Secondary Schools Teams events at a state level run it like a BUSINESS. And business is good. They don't have time for begging!
And they use Board Prizes. How stupid would rating prizes be? Trophies, books. Books are way, way better.
I learned this from FM Craig Laird. One game away from the IM title, but alas, his opponent was the Smerf! Prizes as chess books have several magical qualities.
The biggest is that it keeps the money in the chess business framework for one more cycle. Cash prizes (rating prizes), and the money is gone out of the cycle.

Board Prizes indicate your struggle. How far is it from Board 2 on the second team to Board 4 on the first team. 100 hours of study?
In the above ground world, first is huge. Name the players in the feeder team for your favourite footy team.
Getting up that Board order is difficult and rewarding. Some players are happy to stay on Board 3 and Board 4. Same as a full back doesn't want to be Centre.
They are the anchors to the stars. The stars haven't got a team without the anchors.

So in Australian Chess everything is run like a business until Year 12. No demeaning begging bowl, no,
"please sir, can you give to the chess players who are too financially incompetent to manage their own money."

Up until Year 12 it is a business, same as your corner store, same as BHP Billiton. The business principles are remarkably the same. Income, Expenditure, staff, product etc.

And then, for some unbelievably stupid reason, we decide to change the formula. We stop running it like a business. We throw away the till. In fact we bury it and pour water on it so we won't be tempted to use it again. And then, wait for it, we drag out the begging bowl! Here's a clue chess players of Australia, leave the begging bowl for people who really need it. People are living in cars in Qld. because shelters are full. And yet we are going to spend $1 billion on the Gabba for a two week event. After that it will go back to being used a couple of days a year, as it is now.

Chess players - drop the begging bowl and pick up the till. Teams Chess in one of the most marketable products on the planet. And we already have people on the inside!

Thanks for the heads up on ACF charging for ratings. Good to hear. They should look at how much profit is in weekenders and charge accordingly.
Governments tax cigarettes. And yet the taxes raked in only cover 33% of the cost of a smoker dying. Tax weekenders accordingly. You have the only ratings game in town.

Interesting to note that no one has commented yet on our National Teams having no name.

Why don't we just pick a few random names. And that way we can pretend that we really do care about our National Teams.
This is another reason why we cannot go to the govt. with our begging bowl. First question they will ask is,
"What's the name of your National Teams?"
I guess we will look at each other, shrug our shoulders and say, "Der, dunno"

How about our National Open Chess Team be called the "Greys"
How about our National Women's Chess Team be called the "Beiges"

I'm guessing these will go through unopposed because - no one really cares.

I could do with a bit of help from some of the players who are eligible for these teams. Someone out there has to care.

At the moment I know of two people in Australian Chess who have not drunk (drank, partaken of) the Kool-Aid. Are there any more?

Ian_Rogers
21-04-2021, 10:19 AM
The Australian teams at the Chess Olympiads have been called the Chessaroos for decades, at least going back to the 1980s.

Ian Rout
21-04-2021, 11:04 AM
The Australian teams at the Chess Olympiads have been called the Chessaroos for decades, at least going back to the 1980s.That's a relic of an era when people would tack "roos" on the end of a sport name (Socceroos, Hockeyroos) and imagine it was clever - as maybe it was (sort of) the first time somebody did it.

A sport that aspires to be mainstream should have a name that doesn't have to tell people what they play (Boomers, Diamonds).

Kerry Corker
21-04-2021, 11:58 AM
Thanks to both of you for that info. Obviously I don't have the necessary security clearance to find that on the net. Both teams with the same name. I guess that is to prevent confusion. Like George Formeman naming his 5 boys George. I'm not going to argue with him! I guess that is ok, with female teams of soccer, rubgy-league etc keeping the same name as the franchise name.

Patrick Byrom
21-04-2021, 04:12 PM
That's a relic of an era when people would tack "roos" on the end of a sport name (Socceroos, Hockeyroos) and imagine it was clever - as maybe it was (sort of) the first time somebody did it.It could be worse - our national Quidditch team (yes, there is one!) is called the Drop Bears (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_national_sports_team_nicknames) :)

But not all Australian teams have obvious nicknames. For example, our cricket team is apparently called the Baggy Greens, but I've been watching cricket for decades, and never heard anyone refer to them as anything but "the Aussies".

And a chess 'team' is really just a collection of individual players, like a tennis 'team' (apart from doubles) or a golf 'team'.

Patrick Byrom
21-04-2021, 04:55 PM
The main reason that chess in Australia doesn't have corporate sponsorship is that we don't have tv coverage, or even paying spectators. And that's because it's impossible to follow even medium-level chess unless you are already a reasonably strong chess player. I know almost nothing about netball, for example. But I know that getting the ball into the basket scores points, so I can easily follow a game at that level.

Sports with similar handicaps (no pun intended!) also offer 'rating prizes' - as shown on this entry form (https://www.qldbridge.com.au/entryforms/2946_qba30Apr2021.pdf) for a bridge weekender.

Desmond
21-04-2021, 05:45 PM
The main reason that chess in Australia doesn't have corporate sponsorship is that we don't have tv coverage, or even paying spectators. And that's because it's impossible to follow even medium-level chess unless you are already a reasonably strong chess player. I know almost nothing about netball, for example. But I know that getting the ball into the basket scores points, so I can easily follow a game at that level.

Sports with similar handicaps (no pun intended!) also offer 'rating prizes' - as shown on this entry form (https://www.qldbridge.com.au/entryforms/2946_qba30Apr2021.pdf) for a bridge weekender.

I'm not really sure that bridge has cut through to mainstream and is the model to follow.

Things seem good for chess in Norway. Step 1: create a world champion.

The Magnus effect: In Norway, chess is 24/7 (https://www.todayonline.com/world/chess-norway-247-thanks-magnus-effect)


...The effect then, can be seen everywhere. In a country of around 5 million people, close to half a million play chess regularly online, according to the Norwegian Chess Federation. Stores struggle to keep chessboards on their shelves. Chess podcasts hover atop the download charts in Norway, and trams are full of people playing on their phones. Children play chess on play dates. Adults play chess-themed drinking games at chess-watching parties.

Chess is omnipresent, Norwegians say. And, somehow, it has become cool. ...

Patrick Byrom
21-04-2021, 06:38 PM
I'm not really sure that bridge has cut through to mainstream and is the model to follow.Bridge was definitely mainstream (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contract_bridge):

In the US and many other countries, most of the bridge played today is duplicate bridge, which is played at clubs, in tournaments and online. The number of people playing contract bridge has declined since its peak in the 1940s, when a survey found it was played in 44% of US households. The game is still widely played, especially amongst retirees, and in 2005 the ACBL estimated there were 25 million players in the US.

In this case, I was using bridge as a justification for rating prizes. But if people think that they are holding the game back, the obvious solution is to organise events without them. If these prove to be more successful than the alternative, then I'm sure that they will be more widely adopted.


Things seem good for chess in Norway. Step 1: create a world champion.We had a world champion: C J S Purdy. But I'm completely in favour of producing another one! I'm just not sure that a world champion (or the popularity of The Queen's Gambit) will lead to long-term growth.

Kerry Corker
21-04-2021, 07:49 PM
The youngest person I have taught how to play chess was a girl aged 2 years and 10 months. She knew how all the pieces moved. She didn't know how to checkmate with a bishop and a knight though. I was hoping she'd learn quickly, and could show me. But No. Two years and 10 months and she could understand how the pieces move.
If you want difficulty, try Trust Law.

What was the formula for Steven Hawking's "Brief History of Time". For every formula you put in the book, the sales halve.
It was a best seller all over the world. And what was it about? You'd have to ask him for a proper explanation. I know that it was about time.
The subject matter was way above our heads, maybe not yours Patrick, but for the rest of us lay people, way above our heads. But I bought the book, and so did millions more.
Why, because he told a good story that we could understand.

Do people have to understand the rules of Rugby Union to enjoy the game. I am told the rules can be very complicated. But I still watch it.
All you need is an entertainer. Imagine a chess playing Jerry Seinfeld explaining a chess game. He is never boring. He's always, bing, bang, kaboom. And that is what people want. Joe Public doesn't want to know if Bahr's Rule is being applied properly. They just want to be entertained by a lively person who can explain a chess game.

Think FM Craig Laird, GMs Rogers and Johanson, I've seen them give lively lectures. Of course they can tone it down for the lay person. That's how we teach beginners.
I was at a GM Gufeld lecture where he showed us his "Mona Lisa". He started showing us a side game against Geller. Straight away a voice at the back asked,
"You played Yuri Geller?" Priceless. Could he tone down a game and still be entertaining. Easy.

Glad you brought up Bridge. Bridge is of course a TEAMS game. And therefore, I think most of the clubs own their own premises. Chess is played as an individual game and we own how many premises? I think one in Melbourne. There may be another in Bournmouth, to quote the Major. Bridge charge proper nightly fees.
Yes, all the rumours are true, some clubs charge more than $3 per night.

Bridge is run like a business and of course makes a good profit because they have a good product, as do we. So much in fact that they can afford to use ratings prizes as a hook to get people in. And don't tell me chess does the same. We get the same old people on 1599 year in and year out collecting their ratings prizes. They were rusted on 20 years ago. Bridge's collective rating prize total for the year is probably not even a blip on their yearly books. They are more concerned with property development and share portfolios. That is how they can afford rating prizes.

Chess Australia is pumping out about 20k per year in rating prizes. This is my guess, feel free to correct me if anyone has a better guestimate. 20k for chess is a goldmine.
For Bridge, they probably spend more than that on pencils.

And someone mentioned a chess team being really only a collection of individual players. A Soccer team is really only a collection of individual players. But the difference is that they are smart enough to have a TEAMS format. They could play as an individual sport, but who would watch that. Which brings us back to chess.
With golf it is different. They appear to make a lot of money out of playing as individuals, even though it can be played as a teams event.
If anyone can show me a way for Chess Australia to flourish as an individual sport, to the same extent golf does, I am all for it.

Please don't anyone mention the "chess boom" we are having at the moment.
Any club, anywhere in a city in Australia probably has a catchment area of 1.5 million people. Redcliffe Chess Club has a catchment area from The Gabba to the Sunshine Coast with only The Gap club forming a large triangle. Could be 1.8 million. In this "chess boom" fuelled by individual players, RCC get between 20 and 30 players per night. Brisbane Club was getting between 60 and 80. And kudos to you. I go to my nephew's soccer training and once again, there are many towns in Qld. with less people. And their team can afford a full time coach who has played over 40 games for the Socceroos. And that's the Under 14s. Now that's what I call a boom.

Thanks for your comments Patrick. We need more dialogue on this subject.

What about the titled players? They have the most to gain from chess going over to a business format. Almost complete silence. Must be happy driving cabs. Meeting new people. This new idea means working as a chess player.

Teams need a support network of managers, rival players, trainers, CEOs, transport people, agents etc. More work for chess players.
What about chess players who have done business management at Uni.
Please, shoot me down in flames if I am wrong on running chess as a business.
I know that most of what you did at uni was not connected to the real world (how much do you pay the mafia in New York if you want your restaurant rubbish removed. Try not paying and you will find out. What page is that on?) But I could still use your expertise.

Patrick Byrom
21-04-2021, 08:24 PM
There is already a teams format for chess which is similar to that in bridge - it's called transfer/bughouse chess. Should we be abandoning individual chess weekenders for team transfer tournaments?

But seriously though: If someone knows how to turn chess into a successful tv sport, they shouldn't be just telling us that it can be done; they should show us how it's done by actually doing it.

Afitz
21-04-2021, 10:11 PM
But seriously though: If someone knows how to turn chess into a successful tv sport, they shouldn't be just telling us that it can be done; they should show us how it's done by actually doing it.

Although not TV, the one who has definitely shone in this area is Nakamura and his Twitch streaming. There are definitely others who have turned to this area to market themselves and chess, with a few Australians jumping on the bandwagon as well I believe.

Kerry Corker
22-04-2021, 08:30 AM
There is so much money in Bridge, they don't need to be mainstream. Advertising would be - absolutely common!
People make a very good living out of being hired guns for social Bridge events where the waiters are aspiring chess players.

Things seem good for chess in Norway, Step 1: Create a World Champion.

Way ahead of you. We are already doing that.
Step 1: Hope the government gives us some money, hope business sponsors us, hope people leave us money in their will, hope that big rating prizes really work.
Hope is a great breakfast, but a lousy lunch. I think that's Old Testament.

Kerry Corker
22-04-2021, 09:08 AM
When I was a kid in the 60s there was a program where the pieces moved by themselves, presumably by magnets. Maybe the tv was haunted, who knows.
They played over famous games with commentary. I did not quite know how the game was played, only a rough idea of how the pieces moved, and yet I was fascinated by it.
Anyone know the name of that program?

Also there was a program on British TV called The Master Game? Not sure of the name. GM Rogers drew with GM Karpov who was World Champ at the time, I think.
After the game they would analyse. Very good program with good ratings. Not MasterChef type ratings, but good.

Remember, it only takes 20 minutes to give someone the basic idea of how a chess game is played. And that's all you need to watch something on tv.

I watched a program on the sinking of the Titanic last night. Haven't got a clue how to build, steer, manage or even paint a big ship.
The thing is, it was a well explained program without too much technical detail. If they started explaining how the rivets were first made, then applied, then painted etc., I would have turned off straight away. But because they gave me just a bit of an insight into the details, I had something I could take to the water cooler next day. And tv is a lot about buzz and a lot about the water cooler conversation. How do you create buzz?

Imagine a Reality TV crew following Fischer around on his way to Iceland in '72. That would have rated through the roof. The whole world's tv networks would have bought that program. Bingo. Every one was already talking about Fischer without the Reality program. Imagine the buzz with the Reality program.
Imagine a Reality TV crew following Karpov around on his way somewhere. Still a brilliant player, but not interesting to the average Joe. Therefore, no buzz. no show.

"But seriously though: If someone knows how to turn chess into a successful tv sport, they shouldn't be just telling us that it can be done; they should show us how it's done by actually doing it."

Your comments have inspired me.

Today I am going to apply to the ACF for a grant to make a pilot Reality Chess Program. 250k should do it. That is beer money for a lot of teams sports organisations.
Oh, hang on. The ACF doesn't have anywhere near that sort of money. Unless someone has died recently.
In the above-ground world, builders have what is known as a "roof party". That simply means that they have finished the roof. However, what they have done before that is laid a solid foundation, built the supporting walls, added the rafters and then attached the roof. They don't build the roof on the ground and then try to put the foundation under it.

Build it and they will come. First you need the rags to riches story, or similar, THEN you get the media.
Think of the world wide buzz about the low cut blouse chess incident.
We cannot build anything worth watching on tv with our current business model or plan or whatever people think it is.
At the moment, with our current product, not only can I not get my foot in the door, they probably wouldn't let me on the premises.

Desmond
22-04-2021, 09:50 AM
The Canberra marathon festival is a yearly event that this year took place the week after Doeberl (10-11 April).
They had almost 6000 entrants. (5977)
It costs over a hundred dollars to enter (depends on what race, marathon was $160. Shorter events are cheaper, down to $25 for kids 2km).
All participants (finishers) receive a medal.
Placegetters receive cash prizes.
There are no rating prizes. lol why would there be rating prizes?
I won't tell you how many spectators there are. You'll have to do a lap to see.
Incidentally the marathon festival was sponsored by Tata Consulting Services (TCS).

Anyone can play chess. Anyone can run (or walk, or wheel).

Kerry Corker
22-04-2021, 10:13 AM
Thanks for that. Basically, if you present the public with a good product that they want, and you run it well, you are going to be successful.
And, as a bonus, you will make money.
But what is successful? 6,000 for them might be ok. For us, it is a nightmare. We don't have the infrastructure to handle that.
Hang on a bit. We do have the infrastructure to handle 6,000 players. We do it every year, in school teams chess, around the country.
Fortunately, Chess Australia doesn't have to handle 6,000 players into adulthood because we have the foresight to ditch the golden egg at year 12.

I saw a man pursuing the horizon,
round and round they sped.
I was amused at this, I accosted the man, "You can never..."
"You lie", he cried, and ran on. - Des Crane, I think.

Australian Chess - The Running Game. Now THAT'S A REALITY PROGRAM!

Patrick Byrom
22-04-2021, 01:33 PM
You don't need $250 000 to make a tv program. It can be filmed on a mobile phone for nothing. You've probably heard of a little Aussie movie called The Castle, which was made for $20 000 - and you don't have to pay any actors.

Kerry Corker
22-04-2021, 02:06 PM
Yeah, but my fee is $245,000. Did I not mention that?

antichrist
22-04-2021, 11:34 PM
Yeah, but my fee is $245,000. Did I not mention that?

I thought it ironic you are discussing sinking of Titanic in icy waters around the water cooler. Like accusing chess HQ of shuffling pawns while the chess ship sinks.

But i totally agree with your effort except Fischer did have Brad Darrach Life magazine reporter with him. Probably got sponsorship there.

Fischer was unsuccessfully offered $5m by Marcos to defend his title - how could sponsors etc go near the guy? The $5m went to the Thrilla in Manila instead and boxing got the famous encounter instead. Mohammad and Fischer both "lost" their minds.

(I only knew about Darrach because yesterday arvo someone gave me old book Fischer Against the World)

Kerry Corker
23-04-2021, 11:57 AM
Thanks for that. Yes, I do remember one particular fantastic shot of Fischer striding through the crowd, on his way into the chess venue.
Looked like a couple of meters each stride.
Body language alone, NOTHING was going to stop him. Fischer, despite all his faults, gave the media product. And that is what they want.
How many cable channels and tv channels in total are there on the planet. Over a thousand at least.
They all have one thing in common. They need product. Same as a farmer needs seed.
Without product, all you have is white noise. And white noise is their enemy. They call it dead time.
Managed and presented properly, our sport has product by the truck load.

Which brings us to the Lucena position and the relevance of chess knowledge in the outside world.
When looking at worst case scenarios, the builders of the Titanic would have no reason whatsoever to consider the Lucena position. Useless. Leave the room! Idiot!
However, when looking at escape possibilities for passengers, you need a connection between the sinking ship and safety.
And when you look at the Lucena position, you see the connection between the King, the pawn and the interference of the rook. The saviour rook has to be in a very precise place. As were the rescue boats. And thus, safety for the people and the pawn.

Getting back on board the Titanic, which is a phrase you don't hear every day, the life boats were only meant to be a bridge between the sinking boat and the rescue boat.
The ocean lane they were using was, and still is, very busy. You didn't need enough life boats for all the people. You just needed enough to ferry them back and forth.
And thus, back to the saviour rook in the Lucena position.

I never made the mistake of teaching chess. They'd be better off watching Gilligan's Island. Things are best learned through reflections caused.
Where do you live? Near the Storey Bridge. Ok. Got it.

I copied problem solving ideas from the greats and only used chess as the medium.
This is why I want the ACF to be able to engage TOP TRAINERS for our elite teams, whatever be thy names.
We have plenty of coaches. Not so many TRAINERS.
The ACF cannot engage the services of these TRAINERS without money.

Good to have you on board with this discussion. Whether you agree with me, or think I am sprouting rubbish, doesn't really matter.
Someone has to do something.



The Germans have a beautiful phrase for chess knowledge on its own, without a real world context.

Die Wissenschaft von dem, was nicht wissenswert ist. Cannot remember who said it. But they hit the nail on the head.

Used in context, connected to the real world, working out how many life boats you need for instance, and it is a thing of beauty.