Alex

03-12-2003, 02:20 AM

Can anyone give me a hand withthe untouchable king problem? it's pretty easy against the computer, but against someone that knows I can't touch the king it's a nightmare!

TIA,

Alex

TIA,

Alex

View Full Version : Untouchable King

Alex

03-12-2003, 02:20 AM

Can anyone give me a hand withthe untouchable king problem? it's pretty easy against the computer, but against someone that knows I can't touch the king it's a nightmare!

TIA,

Alex

TIA,

Alex

skip to my lou

03-12-2003, 12:44 PM

This is the position, where white has to checkmate black within 11 moves without moving the white king.

8/8/5K2/8/8/8/4Q3/7k w - - 0 1

I'll publish the solution tonight.

8/8/5K2/8/8/8/4Q3/7k w - - 0 1

I'll publish the solution tonight.

skip to my lou

05-12-2003, 05:10 PM

Ill try and post tonight, Im having trouble with this PGN thing :x

Alex

09-12-2003, 03:20 AM

Here is my solution, which can't be quite right, but 12 moves is the best I can do, if you can trim a move out of this you're better than me :?

1 e4 h2

2 g4 h1

3 e1 g1

4 f3 h2

5 f1 g3

6 e2 f4

7 d3 g4

8 e3 h4

9 g5+ h3

10 g1 h4

11 g2 h5

12 h3#

That is taking black's longest line of defence that I can see.

Cheers,

Alex

1 e4 h2

2 g4 h1

3 e1 g1

4 f3 h2

5 f1 g3

6 e2 f4

7 d3 g4

8 e3 h4

9 g5+ h3

10 g1 h4

11 g2 h5

12 h3#

That is taking black's longest line of defence that I can see.

Cheers,

Alex

skip to my lou

09-12-2003, 11:08 AM

1. Qg4 Kh2 2. Qe4 :)

Gandalf

10-12-2003, 01:06 AM

Jeo maybe we should update the FEN display to show the grid numbers and letters? I can't be bothered counting any more. :)

skip to my lou

10-12-2003, 05:27 AM

lol, ok, will do next week

xiao1985

10-12-2003, 04:35 PM

Jeo maybe we should update the FEN display to show the grid numbers and letters? I can't be bothered counting any more. :)

lolz, ditto

lolz, ditto

Gandalf

15-12-2003, 05:25 AM

Leave it until after Christmas. You're working too hard, and next week we'll all be manipulating preferences three times a day. Don't worry, it can wait. :)

Bill Gletsos

01-01-2004, 02:48 PM

1.Qd1+ Kg2 2.Qe1 Kf3 3.Qd2 Ke4 4.Qc3 Kd5 5.Qc1 Kd4 6.Qc2 Kd5 7.Qc3 Kd6 8.Qc4 Kd7 9.Qc5 Kd8 10.Qa7 Ke8 11.Qe7#

skip to my lou

01-01-2004, 02:50 PM

Qd1 is incorrect, The first few moves are below, try working out the rest:

1. Qg4 Kh2 2. Qe4

1. Qg4 Kh2 2. Qe4

Bill Gletsos

01-01-2004, 04:13 PM

Qd1 is incorrect, The first few moves are below, try working out the rest:

1. Qg4 Kh2 2. Qe4

Instead of just saying my answer is incorrect and stating it starts 1. Qg4 Kh2 2. Qe4, perhaps you can actually show where my line is faulty.

After all the question is mate in 11 without moving the white King.

Show me where my line is wrong. I.e show me where black can improve his play and therefore make white exceed 11 moves.

1. Qg4 Kh2 2. Qe4

Instead of just saying my answer is incorrect and stating it starts 1. Qg4 Kh2 2. Qe4, perhaps you can actually show where my line is faulty.

After all the question is mate in 11 without moving the white King.

Show me where my line is wrong. I.e show me where black can improve his play and therefore make white exceed 11 moves.

skip to my lou

01-01-2004, 04:18 PM

Kf2 is a better option than Kf3 in your line.

Bill Gletsos

01-01-2004, 04:25 PM

No it isnt. Kf2 isnt even legal at that point as Whites Q is on e1.

skip to my lou

01-01-2004, 04:27 PM

OK Sorry, Started off with Qe1, so thats my mistake.

How about Kh2

How about Kh2

Bill Gletsos

01-01-2004, 04:32 PM

No Kh2 is worse.

2...Kh2 3.Qf1 Kg3 4.Qe2 Kf4 5.Qd3 Kg4 6.Qe3 Kh4 7.Qg5+ Kh3 8.Qg1 Kh4 9.Qg2 Kh5 10.Qg5#

2...Kh2 3.Qf1 Kg3 4.Qe2 Kf4 5.Qd3 Kg4 6.Qe3 Kh4 7.Qg5+ Kh3 8.Qg1 Kh4 9.Qg2 Kh5 10.Qg5#

Bill Gletsos

01-01-2004, 04:33 PM

I suspect your solution is as follows:

1.Qg4 Kh2 2.Qe4 Kg1 3.Qf3 Kh2 4.Qf1 Kg3 5.Qe2 Kf4 6.Qd3 Kg4 7.Qe3 Kh4 8.Qg5+ Kh3 9.Qg1 Kh4 10.Qg2 Kh5 11.Qg5#

1.Qg4 Kh2 2.Qe4 Kg1 3.Qf3 Kh2 4.Qf1 Kg3 5.Qe2 Kf4 6.Qd3 Kg4 7.Qe3 Kh4 8.Qg5+ Kh3 9.Qg1 Kh4 10.Qg2 Kh5 11.Qg5#

skip to my lou

01-01-2004, 04:36 PM

Ok, what about 1. ...Kh2

Im not an expert on this, but I know someone that is, thats how I came to know about this problem.

Im not an expert on this, but I know someone that is, thats how I came to know about this problem.

Bill Gletsos

01-01-2004, 04:38 PM

No 1.kh2 in reply to my original Qd1 is worse.

The flaw in my Qd1 line is that at move 10 black can play Kc8 instead of Ke8, thereofre it is no longer mate in 11.

The flaw in my Qd1 line is that at move 10 black can play Kc8 instead of Ke8, thereofre it is no longer mate in 11.

skip to my lou

01-01-2004, 04:39 PM

I suspect your solution is as follows:

1.Qg4 Kh2 2.Qe4 Kg1 3.Qf3 Kh2 4.Qf1 Kg3 5.Qe2 Kf4 6.Qd3 Kg4 7.Qe3 Kh4 8.Qg5+ Kh3 9.Qg1 Kh4 10.Qg2 Kh5 11.Qg5#

Thats correct, however it is quite easy to figure out after the first move is given away. Thats the hard move to figure out.

1.Qg4 Kh2 2.Qe4 Kg1 3.Qf3 Kh2 4.Qf1 Kg3 5.Qe2 Kf4 6.Qd3 Kg4 7.Qe3 Kh4 8.Qg5+ Kh3 9.Qg1 Kh4 10.Qg2 Kh5 11.Qg5#

Thats correct, however it is quite easy to figure out after the first move is given away. Thats the hard move to figure out.

skip to my lou

01-01-2004, 04:40 PM

How is Kh2 worse? Just curious.

Bill Gletsos

01-01-2004, 05:04 PM

As follows:

1.Qd1+ Kh2 2.Qf1 Kg3 3.Qe2 Kf4 4.Qd3 Kg4 5.Qe3 Kh4 6.Qg5+ Kh3 7.Qg1 Kh4 8.Qg2 Kh5 9.Qg5#

1.Qd1+ Kh2 2.Qf1 Kg3 3.Qe2 Kf4 4.Qd3 Kg4 5.Qe3 Kh4 6.Qg5+ Kh3 7.Qg1 Kh4 8.Qg2 Kh5 9.Qg5#

skip to my lou

01-01-2004, 05:08 PM

What about Kh2 after Qe1?

Bill Gletsos

01-01-2004, 05:33 PM

Both worse

1.Qd1+ Kg2 2.Qe1 Kh2 3.Qf1 Kg3 4.Qe2 Kf4 5.Qd3 Kg4 6.Qe3 Kh4 7.Qg5+ Kh3 8.Qg1 Kh4 9.Qg2 Kh5 10.Qg5#

1.Qe1+ Kh2 2.Qf1 Kg3 3.Qe2 Kf4 4.Qd3 Kg4 5.Qe3 Kh4 6.Qg5+ Kh3 7.Qg1 Kh4 8.Qg2 Kh5 9.Qg5#

1.Qd1+ Kg2 2.Qe1 Kh2 3.Qf1 Kg3 4.Qe2 Kf4 5.Qd3 Kg4 6.Qe3 Kh4 7.Qg5+ Kh3 8.Qg1 Kh4 9.Qg2 Kh5 10.Qg5#

1.Qe1+ Kh2 2.Qf1 Kg3 3.Qe2 Kf4 4.Qd3 Kg4 5.Qe3 Kh4 6.Qg5+ Kh3 7.Qg1 Kh4 8.Qg2 Kh5 9.Qg5#

skip to my lou

01-01-2004, 05:36 PM

I see. Good Work.

Im always overlooking Qf1, no idea why.

Im always overlooking Qf1, no idea why.

Bill Gletsos

01-01-2004, 05:42 PM

I have a feeling the following is also a valid solution.

1.Qg4 Kh2 2.Qd1 Kg2 3.Qe1 Kh2 4.Qf1 Kg3 5.Qe2 Kf4 6.Qd3 Kg4 7.Qe3 Kh4 8.Qg5+ Kh3 9.Qg1 Kh4 10.Qg2 Kh5 11.Qg5#

1.Qg4 Kh2 2.Qd1 Kg2 3.Qe1 Kh2 4.Qf1 Kg3 5.Qe2 Kf4 6.Qd3 Kg4 7.Qe3 Kh4 8.Qg5+ Kh3 9.Qg1 Kh4 10.Qg2 Kh5 11.Qg5#

skip to my lou

01-01-2004, 05:44 PM

Seems to be, but im not sure. I'll get someone experienced in this problem to take a look at this post.

Kevin Bonham

04-01-2004, 12:04 AM

I have a feeling the following is also a valid solution.

1.Qg4 Kh2 2.Qd1 Kg2 3.Qe1 Kh2 4.Qf1 Kg3 5.Qe2 Kf4 6.Qd3 Kg4 7.Qe3 Kh4 8.Qg5+ Kh3 9.Qg1 Kh4 10.Qg2 Kh5 11.Qg5#

What about 3...Kf3 here? Black K will run to d4 and e5 and get past the king if not stopped after that.

1.Qg4 Kh2 2.Qd1 Kg2 3.Qe1 Kh2 4.Qf1 Kg3 5.Qe2 Kf4 6.Qd3 Kg4 7.Qe3 Kh4 8.Qg5+ Kh3 9.Qg1 Kh4 10.Qg2 Kh5 11.Qg5#

What about 3...Kf3 here? Black K will run to d4 and e5 and get past the king if not stopped after that.

Bill Gletsos

04-01-2004, 12:20 AM

Yes you are correct.

Vasudevan

10-01-2004, 05:00 PM

I will create a tutorial with all possible variations and some brief analysis, when I get some free time.

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