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View Full Version : Drunk chess star dozes off, concedes match at Kolkata Open



Garvinator
04-09-2009, 01:38 PM
I know there have been comments on people falling asleep at the board on here, but it has actually happened again.

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/drunk-chess-star-dozes-off-concedes-match-at-kolkata-open/512679/


In an unusual incident at the ongoing Kolkata Open Grandmasters Chess Tournament on Thursday, a top-rated French player had to concede his game after he couldn’t sit through his match against his opponent. Reason — he showed up drunk at the venue, slept through his moves several times over, and eventually had to be carried off.

Vladislav Tkachiev of France, who boasts of an ELO-rating of 2669, was declared ‘timed run-out’— a rarity in international chess — when officials at the event decided he wasn’t in a condition to carry on against Tamil Nadu’s Praveen Kumar. The Indian player walked away with a point.

The sight of a player falling over the chessboard, and eventually stumbling out of the venue, drew a fair number of giggles from the other players at the international championship at the Alekhine Chess Club in Gorky Sadan, but the organisers said action would be taken against Tkachiev.

Kevin Bonham
04-09-2009, 01:56 PM
About time Tkachiev had some action taken against him; shame it will only be for this and not for the WCBC farce.

ER
04-09-2009, 06:31 PM
here is a case for our "bringing the game in disrepute" thread! can we have some comments there please?

also


drew a fair number of giggles from the other players at the international championship at the Alekhine Chess Club in Gorky Sadan,

it continues a proud tradition involving the great master himself... re incidents during 1st WC match vs Dr Ewe

antichrist
04-09-2009, 09:16 PM
what is wrong with sleeping through your moves? I have often done it. You just use up your time a bit, it is your time to do whatever you like with. As long as he was not snoring or making funny wind noises from down south just give him a pillow.

Oepty
05-09-2009, 08:54 AM
what is wrong with sleeping through your moves? I have often done it. You just use up your time a bit, it is your time to do whatever you like with. As long as he was not snoring or making funny wind noises from down south just give him a pillow.

I think the major problem is he was drunk, not that he slept.
Scott

MichaelBaron
05-09-2009, 10:00 AM
I think it is sad that Tkachiev is now getting ''special treatment'' from the organisers due to his ''big name'' in the chess world. Any lower-rated chess player would be kicked out of the tournament for this.

ER
05-09-2009, 10:47 AM
the answer is BILL! he'd give him the force no worries! :)

Garvinator
05-09-2009, 11:53 AM
the answer is BILL! he'd give him the force no worries! :)
More likely he would just give him the boot! ;)

Garrett
05-09-2009, 12:34 PM
I hope he gets the help he needs.

antichrist
05-09-2009, 02:16 PM
If he was drunk he just stuffs his game up quicker and everyone's happy. An easy win.

Kevin Bonham
05-09-2009, 02:40 PM
According to chessbase (http://chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=5740) fifteen moves were played and according to the Hindustan Times:

"He was so badly under the influence of alcohol that he could hardly sit on his chair and after 11 moves, fell asleep resting his head on the table.Attempts to wake him up proved futile and the game was awarded to the Indian on the technical ground of Tkachiev being unable to complete his moves within the stipulated time of an hour and 30 minutes."

It is not clear to me whether he was actually "defaulted" or simply lost on time.

Basil
05-09-2009, 05:27 PM
I hope he gets the help he needs.
I hope he has the nuggets to accept when it arrives.

antichrist
05-09-2009, 08:07 PM
According to chessbase (http://chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=5740) fifteen moves were played and according to the Hindustan Times:

"He was so badly under the influence of alcohol that he could hardly sit on his chair and after 11 moves, fell asleep resting his head on the table.Attempts to wake him up proved futile and the game was awarded to the Indian on the technical ground of Tkachiev being unable to complete his moves within the stipulated time of an hour and 30 minutes."

It is not clear to me whether he was actually "defaulted" or simply lost on time.

But I doubt they left him there for 90 mins and if they did not they would know for sure. Boris Yeltsin was president and he could sleep during official visits and not get into trouble - even could not get out of the aeroplane he was so plastered.

The Ukrainians love playing when full of vodka. I hope that guy got his entry fees back.

Garvinator
07-09-2009, 11:35 PM
www.chessbase.com

In reaction to this the Chief Arbiter of the event, R. Anantharam, sent us the following letter:


In your article you mentioned that one of the participants of the tournament stated that the chief arbiter mishandled the Tkachiev situation. As chief arbiter, I have to explain the remaining part, which are missing in the version of the anonymous eye witness.

First of all, there was no illegal assistance to wake up Tkachiev. His opponent, Praveen Kumar (rating 2354), informed us that he wanted to continue. He said that he did not want to miss an opportunity to play with such a highly rated opponent (2669), which he gets rarely and requested me to wake him up. When the top seed Mamedyarov Shakhriyar, a member of the Appeals Committe, was taking a stroll in the tournament hall after his move, I informed him the matter and he volunteered himself to wake him up. This is what happened.

For your reference, I am quoting an answer from Mr. Guert Gijssen, the Chairman of the Rules and Regulations Committee, FIDE regarding this matter in his Column "An Arbiter's Notebook" in the Febraury 2000 issue of Chess Cafe.

Question: Dear Geurt, asituation occurred in a match I had recently. My opponent fell asleep. I was looking at the position, with my opponent to move, and suddenly heard him snoring. One of his teammates poked him, he woke up and continued the game. As a matter of interest (I raised no complaint during the match): does the waking of a player by a teammate amount to interference such as when a teammate points out an illegal move or that a flag has fallen, etc.? I know that I play solid openings, but I didn't think the position was boring enough for my opponent to fall asleep! Dave Burtonshaw (London, England)

Answer: Article 13.6 says: "The arbiter shall refrain from informing a player that his opponent has made a move, or that he has failed to press the clock." Article 13.7 says: "Spectators and players in other games are not to speak about or otherwise interfere in a game." The question is whether waking up a sleeping player is interfering in a game? I can imagine that some people have this opinion. But I can also imagine that a snoring player disturbs his opponent. The only way to stop this is to wake up the player. But to be serious, I believe it is not a problem to wake up a sleeping player. I, for sure, would never blame someone who woke up a sleeping player.

I acted only as per the precedence quoted by Mr. Guert Gijssen himself.

In addition I would like to mention that according to Article 13.2 of the Laws of Chess "The arbiter shall act in the best interest of the competition. He should ensure that a good playing environment is maintained and that the players are not disturbed."

Only to ensure a good playing environment, I had to wake him up. The scene of many players coming to his board and watching him sleeping was a disturbance to the nearby boards.
Thanks and regards, R. Anantharam, Chief Arbiter - Kolkata Open

Kevin Bonham
08-09-2009, 12:05 AM
The scene of many players coming to his board and watching him sleeping was a disturbance to the nearby boards.

Interesting argument and probably fair enough. Not quite the same thing as Geurt's case. If a player is snoring then waking them up is the only option to stop the disturbance, but if their sleeping is merely attracting spectators then there is also the option of asking the spectators to go away. However, that may not be very practical.

The one thing I will say in criticism is that after his recent cheating accusation outbursts, Shak should be considered unfit to serve on any appeals committee for a while.

Redmond Barry
08-09-2009, 09:41 AM
maybe tchakiev needs david boon on his coaching team to teach him how to polish off liquor without falling asleep.

Garvinator
08-09-2009, 04:31 PM
I am more concerned about two situations from this incident:

1) The arbiter tries to defend his decision about the player being asleep and looking at the laws of chess about whether the player can be woken up, but says nothing about the fact that this player was drunk.

I have a simple solution for the arbiter, wake the player up and exclude him from the rest of the tournament.

2) As Kevin pointed out, Shak being on the appeals committee. This indicates what the organising and arbiting team think about players using the media to defame other players.

As Kevin says, Shak should not be appointed to anything official for a long period of time, especially to an appeals committee for a major tournament.

ER
08-09-2009, 05:05 PM
(...) Shak should not be appointed (...) especially to an appeals committee for a major tournament.
Hold on a sec ref, isn't the other players who decide on that?

Denis_Jessop
08-09-2009, 05:21 PM
Hold on a sec ref, isn't the other players who decide on that?

Not necessarily. Having the players select the Appeals Committee is a common practice but in FIDE events the Tournament Rules say:


12. Penalties, appeals
(a) When there is a dispute, the CA or CO as appropriate should make every effort to resolve matters by reconciliation. If such means fail and the dispute is such that penalties are appropriate, where penalties are not specifically defined by the Laws or the regulations, he shall have discretionary power to impose penalties. He should seek to maintain discipline and offer other solutions which may placate the offended parties.
(b) In all events there shall be an Appeals Committee. The CA and CO shall ensure that the Appeals Committee is elected or appointed before the start of the first round, usually at the drawing of lots. It is recommended this consists of a Chairman, at least two members and two reserve members. Preferably no two members of the committee shall come from the same federation. No arbiter, administrator or player involved in the original dispute shall be a member of the appeal committee actually considering that dispute. Such a committee should have an odd number of voting members. Members of the Appeals Committee should not be younger then 18 years old.
...........


DJ

ER
08-09-2009, 05:39 PM
Not necessarily. Having the players select the Appeals Committee is a common practice but in FIDE events the Tournament Rules say:
DJ

oh ok thanks boss, see you always learn new things in this life! ;)

Garvinator
08-09-2009, 09:07 PM
Nigel Short sums up my position much better than I did earlier today.

http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=5746

Nigel Short: "An example must be made!"


Professor R. Anantharam, is a most charming man, but it is hard to understand how his actions during the infamous "Inebriated Tkachiev Game" adhere to the Laws of Chess. In his attempt at self exculpation, he quotes the two laws (Article 13.6 : "The arbiter shall refrain from informing a player that his opponent has made a move, or that he has failed to press the clock." and Article 13.7 "Spectators and players in other games are not to speak about or otherwise interfere in a game.") that show EXACTLY why nobody should have been allowed to interfere with Tkachiev's slumbers. Professor Anantharam's tenous justification apparently rests not with the Laws of Chess themselves, but apparently to an answer given by Geurt Gijjsen to a correspondent Dave Burtonshaw on an Internet website in 2000.

The comparison is bogus. The Tkachiev case differs from the Burtonshaw case mentioned by in one crucial respect: Tkachiev had not merely fallen asleep, but was deeply drunk. This is, of course, the nub of the matter. Unlike Burtonshaw's poor opponent who inadvertently dozed off (and who incidentally was snoring – unlike Tkachiev – disturbing other players and therfeore needed to be woken up), the Champion of France was in a self-induced, near-comatose state. Short of actually vomiting on his opponent, it is hard to think of a more flagrant breach Article 12.1 of the FIDE Rules:

Article 12: The conduct of the players
12.1 "The players shall take no action that will bring the game of chess into disrepute."

The (extraordinarily wide-ranging) punishments for such a transgression are:

a) warning
b) increasing the remaining time of the opponent
c) reducing the remaining time of the offending player
d) declaring the game to be lost
e) reducing the points scored in the game by the offending party
f) increasing the points scored in the game by the opponent to the maximum available for that game
g) expulsion from the event.

In view of the seriousness of the breach, (g) was the most appropriate response. Indeed why does such a provision exist if not for extreme cases like this? On a number of occasions, over the years, I have seen players who have arrived to a game somewhat worse for wear, but I have never seen anyone even close to being as paralytic at a chessboard as Tkachiev. The reaction to his condition was one of amusement to a few, but indignation and disgust to a great many others. His behaviour set a shocking example to the many children present. It is to see how we expect to see chess treated seriously as a sport (and, naturally, the incident generated world-wide publicity) if firm action is not taken in a case like this.

Professor Anantharam mentions that when Shakhriyar Mamedyarov (an Appeals Committee member) was taking a stroll he mentioned the subject to him and that Mamedyarov himself volunteered to wake up Tkachiev. This somehow gives the impression that the action was casual, spur-of-the-moment one. Not so: Professor Anantharam spoke to at least one other member of the Appeals Committee during the round to seek support for his position. Lest it be forgotten these people were busy playing and did not have the rulebook to hand. To the best of my knowledge, no one was informed that interfering with the game was against the FIDE Rules (Articles 13.6 and 13.7 above). Furthermore not only Mamedyarov, but various other people also tried to wake Tkachiev. This was done, if not explicitly at the Chief Arbiter's behest, then at least with his tacit approval.

As Professor Anantharam rightly argued, there was, in fact, a good argument for waking Tkachiev up, as the commotion caused by his methylated somnolence was disturbing to overyone. However this should have been done to forfeit him and to remove him from the playing venue, NOT to render him assistance.

Lastly, on a personal note: I have on many occasions enjoyed Vladislav Tkachiev's entertaining company. He is vivacious and witty when still sober. What he chooses to do in the company of friends in his own room is, of course, his own business. However when he brings the game into disrepute, causing widespread public embarrassment, as he most certainly did on this occasion, an example must be made.

Nigel Short

ER
08-09-2009, 09:25 PM
Great minds meet - here is an example! :P


here is a case for our "bringing the game in disrepute" thread! can we have some comments there please?

Followed by (4 days afterwards but I won't claim copyright - Nigel is ok)


However when he brings the game into disrepute, causing widespread public embarrassment, as he most certainly did on this occasion, an example must be made.

Kevin Bonham
08-09-2009, 11:15 PM
I hadn't actually considered the disrepute rule. I think Nigel Short makes a pretty good case.

Garvinator
12-09-2009, 04:36 PM
I hadn't actually considered the disrepute rule. I think Nigel Short makes a pretty good case.
I think this is exactly the type of situation that the disrepute rule is to be used for!!! If the disrepute rule is not meant for situations like this, then what does fall under the disrepute rule?

ER
12-09-2009, 05:23 PM
just to remind both of you that I was the first to bring the matter publicly to the fore. You are batting for the opposition ignoring the local talent! :( :lol:

Garvinator
12-09-2009, 05:40 PM
just to remind both of you that I was the first to bring the matter publicly to the fore. How did you do this? I was the one who started this thread.
You are batting for the opposition ignoring the local talent! :( :lol:Huh, please explain? I do not understand.

Kevin Bonham
12-09-2009, 05:55 PM
Jak is pointing out, quite correctly, that he mentioned the disrepute rule in #3 some days before Nigel Short did, and that I overlooked this.

ER
12-09-2009, 06:02 PM
Jak is pointing out, quite correctly, that he mentioned the disrepute rule in #3 some days before Nigel Short did, and that I overlooked this.

Thanks Kev, suffer Garv you 're from QLD anyway! :P:owned:

antichrist
15-09-2009, 07:04 PM
After this guy was thrown out I hope someone gave him a few more bottles to drown his sorrows.

ER
16-09-2009, 01:04 PM
no, force the bastard go to the church and repent! hmm :hmm: then again the holly communion bottle would not have an easy night! :P

MichaelBaron
16-09-2009, 03:32 PM
My main concern about how this case was handled by the chief arbiter is: Would he bother to spend so much time and energy on waking up someone rated 600 points below Tkachiev? The French start was clearly given VIP treatment